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  • #51,601
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:16am Jan 30, 2012 12:16am
read junkiesssssss



Lots of rumors flying in the last 24 hours over a potential Greek exit at the end of March. This comes via Niel’s Jensen and John Mauldin:


“Greece plans an orderly exit out of the Eurozone according to two sources close to Mr. Papademos, Greek Prime Minister, who spoke on condition of anonymity earlier today.
The sources confirmed that plans are ready to return to a legacy currency given the current circumstances and that such exit would be dealt with, quote “in as orderly a fashion as possible” unquote.
The plan does not come as a surprise but the timing may be surprising to most members and investors while negotiations about a severe haircut with the IIF are still ongoing.
Last year’s announcement by Mr. Papandreou, former Prime Minister, that a referendum would be held to decide whether or not to stay in the Eurozone may have set the precedent for developing a plan that apparently will be set in motion.
The stalemate in negotiations about the depth of the haircut on some of the outstanding Greek sovereign debt, said to be capped at 65-70% while Greece is looking for more concessions, may have set things in motion as the ultimate alternative.”

I don’t know how you pull-off an “orderly” exit. Especially considering the potential actions from the other troubled countries. The worry with a Greek exit is the domino effect to Portugal, Ireland, etc. It’s all rumors for now, but the seafloor might get kicked up as we head into the end of March. If this is all true it will substantially increase market uncertainty and markets hate uncertainty….
  • #51,602
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:17am Jan 30, 2012 12:17am
Quoting gatorinla
Baltic dry shipping. i dont have a broker supplied one. but i know rates are down a shitload.
https://customers.reuters.com/commun...an_27_2012.pdf yeah it is here or 1350 es 2 things take the pain by getting stopped or miss it wait is more painfull thats the question in what to do
  • #51,603
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:18am Jan 30, 2012 12:18am
Quoting PayTheLimit
just was looking at one last week, down big like you say, bloomberg is the only place I look at it, saw another one last week that ovelays it over s&P's, will try to dig it up later...
if commerce is happening. it just dont make sense for the rates to drop so much. that's usually usd positive. because it usually lowers the u.s. trade deficit. if those rates start to rise it usually against the usd. japan closing its nuke plants. i would of thought would of helped bds. since they will import more coal and ng. my thoughts are, the yen is so strong. that japan is making more products out of japan.. more especially in the u.s. and since the u.s. is making more of the Japanese products. we import less, causing the drop in shipping
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,604
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:20am Jan 30, 2012 12:20am
Quoting kill56
read junkiesssssss



Lots of rumors flying in the last 24 hours over a potential Greek exit at the end of March. This comes via Niel’s Jensen and John Mauldin:[indent] [indent] “Greece plans an orderly exit out of the Eurozone according to two sources close to Mr. Papademos, Greek Prime Minister, who spoke on condition of anonymity earlier today.
The sources confirmed that plans are ready to return to a legacy currency given the...
the best way is to exit....before germany n france get the deasese like waht happen to greece..hehehe
Bismillah
  • #51,605
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:22am Jan 30, 2012 12:22am
Quoting kill56
As the old adage goes smoke before fire; historically a sharp plunge in shipping prices would be the smoke warning investors of an approaching global economic slowdown, but this time it’s not the case. The Baltic Exchanges Baltic Dry Index (BDI) has collapsed falling nearly 34% since the start of December, and nearly 66% since its 2010 peak in May. So why is it different this time and, unless you are overweight shipping stocks, more or less irrelevant?
The answer lies in the size of the shipping fleet. When times for the sector were good...
I'd heard that, in the context of the reduced steaming speed. But also, in that context, in that reducing the turn rate helps reduce some of that tonnage overhang.

Overall, I do believe that there is less tonnage moving. But I don't have source for that, just anecdotes.
  • #51,606
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:25am Jan 30, 2012 12:25am
Quoting OldQuant
Who am I kidding? I ain't going to bed just yet.

Here's one:
http://www.investmenttools.com/futur..._index.htm#bdi

BTW, did you hear one of the only reasons the rates are even as high as they are is because the average steaming speed is dropped?

They claim it's for environmental reasons, and to save fuel. Yeah, Greek ship owners are real tree huggers. But the slower they go, the less available tonnage there is at any point in time. That thought probably occurred to them as well.
wouldnt this make more sense as to the reason. bb said rates will remain low. a world drop in commerce. that would make the Greek situation a gnat on a elephants ass? and would actually me not so bad for the u.s. comparably to the world.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,607
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:30am Jan 30, 2012 12:30am
i love this shitt



Stock buybacks by U.S. companies have reached record levels. Flush with billions in cash many companies have figured out that the best way to spend those funds is to simply buy their own shares.
The following chart from a recent Wall Street Journal article shows the gradual rise in share buybacks since the market lows of 2009:
Click to enlarge
http://static.seekingalpha.com/uploa...cks_thumb1.jpg
From the article:


Among companies in the Standard & Poor’s 500-stock index, repurchase spending totaled at least $437 billion last year, a 46% increase from 2010, estimates Howard Silverblatt, senior index analyst at S&P.

Share buybacks rarely benefit shareholders. Instead of paying dividends or making capital investments, companies take the easy way and implement share buybacks.Unlike other countries, the phenomenon of companies buying and sometimes trading in their own shares is very high in the U.S. Short-term mentality of managements, stock options and other factors drive companies to boost stocks price at all costs including spending excess cash on the balance sheet on share buybacks.
The reason usually given by managements for share buybacks is that the stock is undervalued. But in reality it just shows that managements are unable to find better uses for the cash. Just like any other investor, companies also cannot accurately determine if their stock is undervalued and also they cannot predict the future direction of the stock. Despite the odds of being right so negligible, companies buy their own shares anyway hurting shareholders. So generally it is a wise idea to avoid companies that implement share buybacks.
A recent article by CNBC confirms the theory that most share buybacks don’t benefit shareholders. From the article titled “Most Share Buybacks Don’t Pay Off for Investors“:


With cash at record levels, stock buybacks are an increasingly popular way to use free cash flow.
Investors often equate buybacks with management’s belief that the company is undervalued by the market, and purchases can significantly affect the performance of a company stock if the timing is right. But Thomson Reuters’ data shows that’s not always the case.
According to the report, out of 380 companies in the S&P 500 that repurchased shares in at least five of the quarters, 84 companies bought shares when the stock price was high, and only 60 firms were able to buy low.
In addition, 72 companies saw poor returns within a year following share repurchases, versus 57 that saw good results.
The findings point to a combination of bad market timing as well as policies that increase buybacks when companies have more free cash flow.
“This may be partially explained by the need for officers of public companies to make some use of the cash on hand, including keeping less of it due to the possibility of being taken over,” says the report.

Very few companies that have implemented share buybacks have seen their share prices rise consistently and benefit investors. International Business Machines Corp. (IBM) is one company that I can think whose share buybacks has benefited investors. Last October a Bloomberg article noted that IBM plans to spend $50 billion on buybacks through 2015.
Disclosure: No Positions
  • #51,608
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:30am Jan 30, 2012 12:30am
Quoting kill56
As the old adage goes smoke before fire; historically a sharp plunge in shipping prices would be the smoke warning investors of an approaching global economic slowdown, but this time it’s not the case. The Baltic Exchanges Baltic Dry Index (BDI) has collapsed falling nearly 34% since the start of December, and nearly 66% since its 2010 peak in May. So why is it different this time and, unless you are overweight shipping stocks, more or less irrelevant?
The answer lies in the size of the shipping fleet. When times for the sector were good...
after tourism, I think shipping is #2 for the Greeks.. so can you imagine if a country lost a high % of its top money makers? in a already bad economy. do i hear default?
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,609
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:33am Jan 30, 2012 12:33am
Quoting gatorinla
wouldnt this make more sense as to the reason. bb said rates will remain low. a world drop in commerce. that would make the Greek situation a gnat on a elephants ass? and would actually me not so bad for the u.s. comparably to the world.
Which is why more and more the deflation side looks better. And if the dollar stays backed by oil, the lower the price, the more btu's a buck will buy. Which, in turn, is why the exclusive usd denomination of oil is strategically important enough for the us to go to war over it.
  • #51,610
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:34am Jan 30, 2012 12:34am
Quoting gatorinla
after tourism, I think shipping is #2 for the Greeks.. so can you imagine if a country lost a high % of its top money makers? in a already lad economy. do i hear default?
sure its and with no eur and the drakhma in cheep alot of tourisets will be going their and spend the eur at the greek shawerma

they will be better off to leave


oh they need to move greece close to the US shipping is their No. 2 so they could move the cocka to the US
  • #51,611
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:37am Jan 30, 2012 12:37am
Quoting OldQuant
Which is why more and more the deflation side looks better. And if the dollar stays backed by oil, the lower the price, the more btu's a buck will buy. Which, in turn, is why the exclusive usd denomination of oil is strategically important enough for the us to go to war over it.
we may sit off shore and let the Europeans fight it. hell we got enough of the stuff. asia and europe are the ones in need.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,612
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:42am Jan 30, 2012 12:42am
Quoting kill56
sure its and with no eur and the drakhma in cheep alot of tourisets will be going their and spend the eur at the greek shawerma

they will be better off to leave
i think so too.. they can have a international air/rail and shipping hub. a international gateway into Europe. from from Africa Asia and the Americas. they could devalue all they need and back their currency with the foreign Asian (currency) and usd collected from tourist.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,613
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:47am Jan 30, 2012 12:47am
Quoting gatorinla
i have several platforms. that i use differently.. for instance my magic # today and depending on direction this week is 66.. a mapa #.. something i use for large reversals. the # moves.. for instance if we go lower this # would also move lower. 50 pips +- is 16. last week at the weeks end was 77 and 27. so basically 3166 in a important #, if we close 00est below. i would be less bullish. and more likely to wait for a deeper pullback. when i say 66 and or 16.. its any # ending in these. 3166 is the major one
not as big.. but London could make a sub 66 splash.
those who can, do. those who cant, talk about those who can
  • #51,614
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:51am Jan 30, 2012 12:51am
hi guys

I hate forex

I quit

have a great week

kthx bye
  • #51,615
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:53am Jan 30, 2012 12:53am
Quoting gatorinla
we may sit off shore and let the Europeans fight it. hell we got enough of the stuff. asia and europe are the ones in need.
Not a single multinational oil co. in the world wants oil denominated in EUR or SDR or Yuan.

Hugo, maybe. Russians, sure. Iran, certainly. But all for political reasons. The fact is the oil companies are way better off with the usd as the exchange. So any boat rockers have the Europeans to worry about as much as the US. A couple carriers, minesweepers, and a floating office to temporarily re-flag tankers so they can be escorted by US warships is more than enough for the US to do, and someone else could do the heavy lifting.
  • #51,616
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:54am Jan 30, 2012 12:54am
Quoting gatorinla
not as big.. but London could make a sub 66 splash.

we did go through the DPP now we 37 and 24 and below 3104 is the dump
  • #51,617
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:56am Jan 30, 2012 12:56am
Quoting OldQuant
Not a single multinational oil co. in the world wants oil denominated in EUR or SDR or Yuan.

Hugo, maybe. Russians, sure. Iran, certainly. But all for political reasons. The fact is the oil companies are way better off with the usd as the exchange. So any boat rockers have the Europeans to worry about as much as the US. A couple carriers, minesweepers, and a floating office to temporarily re-flag tankers so they can be escorted by US warships is more than enough for the US to do, and someone else could do the heavy lifting.
the best thing that could happen for continued US and massive oil co. dominance of Oil IS a war.... or at least the shadow of one

"Kill Kill Kill" should be the new motto of the US in 2012
  • #51,618
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:56am Jan 30, 2012 12:56am
Quoting Wulfgar
hi guys

I hate forex

I quit

have a great week

kthx bye
why its better than sex bro
  • #51,619
  • Jan 30, 2012 12:58am Jan 30, 2012 12:58am
Quoting Wulfgar
hi guys

I hate forex

I quit

have a great week

kthx bye
Something blindside you? And you don't hate forex. If you did, you'd be on FAcebook or downloading cute kitty videos from Youtube.
  • #51,620
  • Jan 30, 2012 1:01am Jan 30, 2012 1:01am
i know i am crazy dumb but we did enter the dam zone lets see if we stay in it
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