MB Trading Futures - Introduction

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Justin, can you call in orders to the order desk w/ a Demo acct? The thing is, your demo environment DOES NOT WORK, and I'm sure you are aware of this. My father needs to learn how to use the software because he's old and not a tech wiz, but your demo system disappears orders constantly. He resorted to just writing down orders but that kind of defeats the purpose doesn't it? He does have a funded acct w/ MB, he just wants to learn how to use MBT Desktop so he doesn't needlessly lose money before he goes live. As he has a funded acct, will your order desk accept orders over the phone from him on a demo acct? Your tech support is a joke and a pointless waste of time.

Or can you recommend a reliable ECN so he can defund his acct and go somewhere else?

Ilove,

Those are closer to normal spreads for our FREE EXN plan going forward. We did indeed add some liquidity providers.

Ilove,

As has been discussed on these forums in the past, those data spikes at rollover do not trigger orders. You would not have been stopped out of anything.

Max Thrax,

No, I’m not aware of any issues with our Demo environment. This is the first I’ve heard of anything about orders disappearing. What I need from you (via private message) is your email and Demo account numbers so that I can have it researched and have someone solve your problem for you. This definitely is not an issue that has been reported by anyone else.

Justin,

I have several live accounts with MBTrading. And I have been one of the first people to join the MT4 live accounts, and have had nothing but good things to say about MBTrading.

But now I'm very pissed off at MBTrading and MT4 because of the recent "Account Balance Correction" that I have been hit with on my main account. I don't even know what is the point of trading on MT4 with MBTrading is after this. My latest "account balance correction" is -$1,000+, and it just shows up out of the blue and deducts from my account. This is ridiculous. Who the hell cares about pay for limits or no fees if we cannot trust that our trades are executed at the price in MT4 or that it is sync'd up correctly to your other platform. That is not my problem if your bridge cannot handle this correctly.

I would like to hear back on this because if people know about this "account balance correction", I'm sure no one would trade live with you. At least no one with a serious account. I mean, sure if the account adjustments were for a few bucks, no problem. But this is pretty big, even given that I trade big too.

BTW, I've been waiting for an Live Chat rep to connect for the last 10 minutes, nothing. Yes, I'm getting very annoyed.

ONE PISSED OFF CUSTOMER

I had the same problem on my micro account; MBT wipe out $80.00 without giving me any detail o reason for the transaction.

I called the MT4 support/cashier/whoever to get my account synced twice because the withdrawal amount couldn't be adjusted automatically on MT4. I made third withdrawal last week, therefore it's out of since again.

why not try to learn there desktop pro and mabe you wont have these problems

Because MT4 is MT4, mainly used for automated trading. the desktop pro doesn't have that function.

JB3,

As our website states, Account Balance Corrections occur when you are flat at rollover and there is a difference at that time between the balance showing in your MT4 software and the true balance of your account (which is shown at the MBT Desktop/Pro level, which you can be logged into at any time to view, or view from our site). MT4 is not FIFO based, and we have to provide you with FIFO accounting. What this means is that as you carry positions, your cost basis in MT4 can stray from FIFO cost basis. Then, swaps that are being charged or commissions that are based on cost basis using FIFO account can create slight differences in your account. The only time that we can truly check between the two (MT4 and Desktop) to see if they match is if you are flat at rollover. If you have positions, by definition, there could be a problem between how MT4 and Desktop are seeing the positions, so we can’t be sure. In some cases, when you close the final trade, then the balances match.

Let me give you an example. You buy 10 EURUSD at 1.3000 in MT4, creates deal number 1. You buy 10 EURUSD at 1.2900 later, creates deal number 2. EURUSD goes up to 1.3000 and in MT4, you close deal number 2 for 100 pips. This is NOT FIFO accounting as you have to close the initial entry first. However, the problem now exists that if you continue to hold the position for days, MT4 is charging the swap rate at 1.3000, but it should be from 1.2900, as that is the true position still left open. So, from that scenario, differences begin to occur, and there are other scenarios as well. There is nothing that we can do with MT4 to make it behave as it needs to under FIFO NFA rules. Obviously, if you trade a mini and hold that deal 1 for 5 days, when you finally go flat at rollover, we will spot the difference and it might be a couple of dollars. However, if you have a bigger account and are trading 30 lots or 100 lots at a time and hold that trade for 5 days of swaps from a wrong cost basis, the difference can obviously be bigger.

So, let me run through a few points here.

1) MBT Desktop is always right. Period. It has all of the trades at the exact cost handled down to all partials under FIFO accounting rules. All swaps and commissions are based on the correct pricing. It is, simply, the correct way of viewing the account. As long as you check that on-line or through the Desktop software, you know at all times where the account is at.
2) The reason to use MT4 is because you have an EA or like the interface. Otherwise, I would suggest using Desktop Pro as it has many more order types, and since it IS the account itself, you have no balance discrepancies.

I can’t give you 100% of the details on your account here because this is a public forum and it would not be right for me to discuss your trades (I would prefer that you never have posted a screenshot showing information about your account). However, since you did post it, I was able to have someone here find the account and research it. What you aren’t showing in the screenshot is that you placed a trade over four months prior that you carried for four months, and you did run other trades in that pair (and it was a pretty good size trade) on the day that you initiated the trade. So in other words, the exact scenario that I described above occurred, and MT4 was charging swaps based on the trade that you left open, which was not the correct price under FIFO accounting. And you left that trade open for over four months, so each day, the swaps were different. Had you monitored the Desktop/Pro software or checked the website, you would have seen the correct swaps that were charging each day under FIFO rules. Once you finally went flat on 11/30, the check was done and the difference was correct on the MT4 side. So basically, you have an extreme case here because you left the trade open for months, and that explains the difference.

The accounting is never wrong, by the way. We are FIFO compliant per the NFA, and everything at the Desktop/website/Desktop Pro level reflects that 100%. If it didn’t, we would be in trouble with the NFA. What we can’t control is the fact that MT4 doesn’t do it right, but that’s why everything on the website and in the account agreements clearly states this over and over. What you see in Desktop is exactly what is happening in your account. What you see in MT4 under certain conditions can be wrong, and we have a clearly stated policy for how those differences are corrected and when.

If you have further questions, please contact me in private and I can have you talk to the person who runs the MT4 project here.

Euripides,

Please see my last post to JB3.

Justin,

Yes, I had several large orders that was held for 4 months. However, they were initiated in the same direction within the same month (July), and I closed all of the trades at the same time in November. There was no FIFO going on with these specific trades. These long term trades are simple buy and hold trades (as simple as it gets). So what kind of explanation is there for this "correction" without any of this FIFO accounting issue going on?

I have no problems posting my trades because I want a good explanation. If interested, I will post these 4 month trades as well to show that there is no FIFO problem going on. It should be simple accounting on these trades.

I still do not understand why I got this "correction". So even without the FIFO issue, the swap on MT4 is still wrong for these trades???

JB3,

Unfortunately, I can’t discuss customer live trades with any specificity over a public forum, we simply aren’t allowed. But in a general sense, you can easily go on-line and compare the swaps that were charged daily under the Desktop system, which is correct, to the swaps that were charged under MT4, and there you will easily see that exact difference. And again, if you had been watching Desktop in real-time throughout that period, you would have seen those numbers. It isn’t something that just magically happened after the fact. As we state clearly on the site, your actually accounting is done in Desktop. Your account, by selecting MT4, is set up to allow you to use MT4 as your trading interface.

If you go back and look at your trades, and again, I will not discuss them in any further detail in public on this forum, but I’m happy to let you talk to our top MT4 support reps, you did clearly have trades that you opened and left open for months, but then in the same pair, you opened and closed a later trade. That is not FIFO, as I outlined in the prior post. In fact, during the months that the trades were left open, you had many trades on the same pair that you entered and exited that were at a higher cost basis, all the while leaving open the initial trade. Again, that is not FIFO accounting (FIRST In, FIRST Out). The accounting is correct under the rules.

Crickets.

Sigh. So basically, the swap in MT4 is completely bogus? So let me ask you where in Desktop Pro can I see the accumulated swap that is owed on each position (so I can compare)? I see the daily premium only, and I have no idea what Prem Calc even means.

Seriously, Desktop Pro is one of the most non-intuitive software out there. Can your programmers get together with a designer, and make a single screen with open/closed positions, P/L, commissions and total Swap (similar to MT4)? This way, we can actually compare what is going on without having to fiddle with Desktop Pro. Make a big simple button for us non-desktop pro users who only uses MT4. Thanks. If I wanted to trade using Desktop Pro, I would not have left Interactive Broker, I hated their interface.

Yes, please, I would love to have a top MT4 support rep to prepare a simple audit of where the balance correction came from. I like numbers. Talking is pretty meaningless to me. If the numbers make sense, then that's fine with me. I don't like getting a big correction without much explanation in detail (swap difference per trade between platform and why).

MB are marketing the MT4 as a trading interface, but now I find out the swap on MT4 is complete BS...perhaps that should conveyed to your customers before we start trading on it. And Desktop Pro is not simple to use, and hard to find the data to compare. I hope MB doesn't expect your customers to keep track of every trade on a daily basis on excel to figure out the differences in swaps between the platforms. If trading is not hard enough, I have to deal with accounting on multiple broker platforms.

I have witnessed many times that MT4 quote freeze but not in Desktop Pro. It happened not just in high volatility but sometimes also in low volatility. Thanks to the crazy volatility an hour ago I finally discovered the reason that caused MT4 freeze is negative spread!

The freeze actually began the moment the EURUSD dived at 10:58EST for just about 7 second. It freezed again at 11:00EST and 11:02EST but this time it is long enough for me to witness the spread in desktop pro was actually in negative (as high as negative 4pips++!) during the freezing time!

Justin, could you please advise whether this is done on purpose or just a bugs? Will the stop orders on MT4 server execute during the quote freeze because I still can see the price jumping around at desktop pro. Please advise.
Thank you.

Justin:
How can I migrate an account from MT4 to Desktop pro platform???

I wonder if all retail forex is rigged ? still cant connect to server (mt4).

Only very small test account (live) - this broker isnt any different than the rest.