What did you change to start being profitable? | Forex Factory

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What did you change to start being profitable?

  • #1
  • First Post: Nov 7, 2011 3:27pm Nov 7, 2011 3:27pm
Hello

I would like to know from you guy's that as struggled and finally made it to be profitable, what did you change in your habits. What was the triggering point that made you on the positive side

Was it
- Mentally approach
- Technical
- Tutoring
- Others

Could be interesting to understand how the turning point was achieved for you

Any comments appreciated

Martin
  • #2
  • Nov 7, 2011 10:22pm Nov 7, 2011 10:22pm
Dedication & Sacrifice
  • #3
  • Nov 7, 2011 11:18pm Nov 7, 2011 11:18pm
Quoting arjfca
=e, what did you change in your habits. What was the triggering point that made you on the positive side
Was it
- Mentally approach
- Technical
- Tutoring
- Others

Could be interesting to understand how the turning point was achieved for you

Any comments appreciated

Martin
I stopped trying so hard to define everything, and simply started trading as I know it now. "Systems" are comfortable but the very definition is misleading. Yes systems work the only problem I feel is that people are generally restricted by their own walls and interpretation of what this means.
Time hides Nothing
  • #4
  • Nov 8, 2011 3:44am Nov 8, 2011 3:44am
cannot tell at the moment... still searching for my edge... i'm still a loser
and in continous struggle... but sooner or later... i will be there... i suppose
  • #5
  • Nov 8, 2011 6:24am Nov 8, 2011 6:24am
Really it was my mental approach to trading which I had to change. I had to completely re-work my perspective on profits and losses. Once I actually started thinking of so-called "losses" as actual business expenses instead of a punishment for being "Wrong", I became unafraid of them and embraced the experience as a necessary element of being in this business. The sooner you start thinking about trading as an actual business and less of an ego-centric prediction game, the better. And I don't mean just accepting the idea that it is a business, I mean actually working it like one, practically speaking. A good first step is to keep track of your trading expenses and profits on a piece of paper or in a document on your computer, during any given trading session. Allow yourself to see the ebb and flow of your capital and this will give you a clear insight into how well your trading method/system actually works.

I might add that once your psychological situation is stable, the next logical issue is that of your money management rules. They should be crafted in such a way that they protect your capital over time, meaning that they should ensure your overall profitability, even in the face of mounting expenses, e.g. The risk/reward ratio.

Anyway... just my 2 cents. Hope it helps shed some light.

~fighter
  • #6
  • Nov 8, 2011 6:59am Nov 8, 2011 6:59am
Quoting fighterdude
And I don't mean just accepting the idea that it is a business, I mean actually working it like one, practically speaking.
I've read this sentiment numerous times, over the years, about treating forex like a business. I'm not picking on you but, seriously, how many people on this forum have run a business? To me, it's BS. Most of them wouldn't have any idea on how to run a business.

Imagine having, just as an example, 20-30 employees relying on you for their wages each week, ensuring that you have enough to pay VAT/PAYE/National Insurance contributions on time each month/quarter to HM Revenue and Customs, constantly chasing payments from clients that you have done work for, fending off massive investigations instigated by HM Revenue and Customs (that can sometimes take years, a shitload of money and untold pressure), adhering to Health & Safety regulations in the workplace, recruiting decent office staff, advertising costs, supplier payments, appeasing the bank manager because you've gone over your overdraft ... the list goes on and on.

I've also read numerous times, over the years, that successfully trading forex is one of the hardest things to accomplish. Those people need to run a successful business and then come back and tell me that.
Nothing worth having is easy.
  • #7
  • Nov 8, 2011 8:07am Nov 8, 2011 8:07am
Quoting Patience
I've read this sentiment numerous times, over the years, about treating forex like a business. I'm not picking on you but, seriously, how many people on this forum have run a business? To me, it's BS. Most of them wouldn't have any idea on how to run a business.

I've also read numerous times, over the years, that successfully trading forex is one of the hardest things to accomplish. Those people need to run a successful business and then come back and tell me that.
Now I am not picking on you either but, just because you find running a business harder than trading, doesn't mean everyone has had as hard a time as you with traditional business. I do believe that there are more people successfully running real world businesses, than there are successful traders.

I also never said anything about trading being harder than running a real world business.

To treat trading currencies like a business, you simply must do it in principle and mindset, not in actual operating terms.

The idea behind running any business(in principle) is to make your capital inflows more than your capital outflows, correct? When first starting a business venture, most people are just looking to stay afloat and make an living, not become an instant millionaire. The former mentality is vital for new traders to adopt, if they want to become successful at trading, but unfortunately it is usually the latter mentality which they ingrain in their psyche, and that ultimately leads to their failure.

So, the successful business formula is to focus on just making your profits, greater than your expenses consistently(this is all I actually meant, when I said to treat forex like a business). Profits > Expenses, that is all it really means to run a successful business. Once this is applied and achieved in the forex market or any other financial market for that matter, then trading becomes the greatest business on the planet for a number of reasons, e.g. no staff to pay, no physical location to take care of, no inventory, no disgruntled customers, etc.

-fighter
  • #8
  • Nov 8, 2011 8:23am Nov 8, 2011 8:23am
Quoting fighterdude
Now I am not picking on you either but, just because you find running a business harder than trading, doesn't mean everyone has had as hard a time as you with traditional business. I do believe that there are more people successfully running real world businesses, than there are successful traders.

I also never said anything about trading being harder than running a real world business.

To treat trading currencies like a business, you simply must do it in principle and mindset, not in actual operating terms.

The idea behind running any...
Agree with you

About your trading journal, do you mind to share with us how you do it, witch data do you collect etc.

For myself, I realized that I made these mistake too often
- moved my initial stop loss too rapidly. I should wait until a bar is traded completly above my entry. If a reverse setup occurred, I will try to stick with my initial stop loss.

- Have made my mind, mentally on where the market should go and avoid what the charts is telling me because it does not fit with my view.

This is also a mental jobs. I need to learn that part to...

Martin
  • #9
  • Nov 8, 2011 9:04am Nov 8, 2011 9:04am
When I

 Realised it’s all a game
The game is between your ears
Got rid of every indicator apart from pivots
There's tons of BS out there and best to ignore 95% of it. Though there is some amazing stuff and people on FF.
CUT trades quickly when they go against you.... the hardest part of the game.
Realise it’s easy to suffer myopia. Then I dumped 6 of my 8 FX pairs and replaced them with
Two indices
Two metals
Two commodities

 Then I traded on demo and took one from 10k to 28k and one from 5K to 10K from October 1st.There’s more to life than FX pairs
  • #10
  • Nov 8, 2011 9:26am Nov 8, 2011 9:26am
Quoting courtneywild
When I

 Realised it’s all a game
The game is between your ears
Got rid of every indicator apart from pivots
There's tons of BS out there and best to ignore 95% of it. Though there is some amazing stuff and people on FF.
[font=Verdana][size=2]CUT trades quickly...
Interesting

I only trade EurUsd, No indicators, only volume
I'm trying at the moment to display Dollars index as a comparison only.

I realize that I'm not too far, but still ,,,

No pain, No gain they say....

Martin
  • #11
  • Nov 8, 2011 12:15pm Nov 8, 2011 12:15pm
Quoting arjfca
Hello

I would like to know from you guy's that as struggled and finally made it to be profitable, what did you change in your habits. What was the triggering point that made you on the positive side

Was it
- Mentally approach
- Technical
- Tutoring
- Others

Could be interesting to understand how the turning point was achieved for you

Any comments appreciated

Martin
it was the switch to long-term trading / position holding / letting winners ride for months
  • #12
  • Nov 8, 2011 12:35pm Nov 8, 2011 12:35pm
Quoting Custos
it was the switch to long-term trading / position holding / letting winners ride for months
Something to think about!... thanks
  • #13
  • Nov 8, 2011 1:27pm Nov 8, 2011 1:27pm
Quoting Custos
it was the switch to long-term trading / position holding / letting winners ride for months
interesting cause i made the switch to short term intraday trading and started holding trades for couple of hours if necessary (vs few minutes before)
  • #14
  • Nov 8, 2011 1:39pm Nov 8, 2011 1:39pm
Quoting hilmy83
interesting cause i made the switch to short term intraday trading and started holding trades for couple of hours if necessary (vs few minutes before)
well, I also like the intellectual stimulation long-term trading (or actually medium-term trading) provides. Not only can you analyze the technicals, but also the overall fundamental picture.

The combination of both is great for tuning up the win/loss ratio.
  • #15
  • Nov 8, 2011 2:17pm Nov 8, 2011 2:17pm
Here, it is the style i've changed, and the psychological way of trading aka greed, patience.

1. Went from indicators trading to classic price action trading (intraday)
2. For the psy effect, getting 1 pip is still better than losing one.
COT: The precious data ignored
  • #16
  • Nov 8, 2011 2:20pm Nov 8, 2011 2:20pm
For me, the change to profitability was when I started using EA's to open and close trades, taking the emotion out of the equation.

I just can't sit in front of a terminal and patiently wait for trades. Similarly, if the position goes against me, I find it difficult to maintain composure.

EA's take care of all of that and let me think objectively.
  • #17
  • Nov 8, 2011 3:06pm Nov 8, 2011 3:06pm
Quoting kuroro001
Here, it is the style i've changed, and the psychological way of trading aka greed, patience.

1. Went from indicators trading to classic price action trading (intraday)
2. For the psy effect, getting 1 pip is still better than losing one.
I like this one:
Quote
Greed is my devil...

Martin
  • #18
  • Nov 8, 2011 4:51pm Nov 8, 2011 4:51pm
One word - patience
  • #19
  • Nov 8, 2011 5:23pm Nov 8, 2011 5:23pm
Quoting Dodo1497
One word - patience
Thanks

On what where you impatient?
Was it the only point ( or the last one in the list)

I do believe that patience is really needed

Martin
  • #20
  • Nov 8, 2011 5:51pm Nov 8, 2011 5:51pm
When Ive realized there is so much I dont know and became more humble. Its about the trip, not destination
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