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vsa with Malcolm

  • #21,081
  • Jun 14, 2011 4:07pm Jun 14, 2011 4:07pm
Quoting sony
..But as i can see on your first chart you did not marked highes volume bar...Is that true?

You marked one before it...

Please tell me why?..
Thank you for the kind words.

I am trying to come up with a consistant way of determining the Selective Based Start Point-the bar used to determine a trigger level.

I do use climatic volume, which is colored black as one Start Point definition. But I also have another definition that does not neccessarily have climatic volume.

If you take another look at that pic, you can see that the interval after the high volume bar is down. Therefore the trigger level would be the low of the climatic volume bar. But note that this level is the close of the bar before it. Since I already know the close could be a trigger level, I just didn't place the line there.
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #21,082
  • Jun 14, 2011 4:27pm Jun 14, 2011 4:27pm
Quoting HiddenGap
There are 4 key price points on a bar for triggers:

1. High
2. Low
3. Close
4. Midpoint

There are two main techniques used with triggers. The first is to assume the trigger level is the close and let the market tell you if it the level is actually on one of the other key points.

The other starts out by looking at the bar (think of it as the cause) and the bar that follows (think of it as the effect). If the cause is a high volume up bar closing off the high and the effect is a down bar, then there must have been some selling on the first bar....
So if price closes up after a high vol bar, we place the trigger at the high of that high vol bar and if price closes lower after the high vol bar, we place the trigger at the bottom. But when do we place a trigger at the close?
  • #21,083
  • Jun 14, 2011 4:33pm Jun 14, 2011 4:33pm
Quoting HiddenGap
..I am trying to come up with a consistant way of determining the Selective Based Start ....
Sorry, forgot where I was there for a moment. I thought I was in one of those advanced VSA skype rooms for a second. Newbies don't ask and don't worry about it.

On second thought here it goes in a nutshell:

Selective based means you are taking a trade signal at a "support or resistance" line or zone. This would include things like triggers, pivots, poc, vahs, vals, and trend lines or channels. Or taking a trade after the completion of a sequence.

Non-Selective based means you are simply taking a trade in "air". For example if the trend is up and you see a Test in a Rising market, if you take that test and the test is not around a know level of some sort, it is Non-Selective based.

This concept is something most people here already know but I'm just putting a name to it. Taking a trade at some sort of "level" usually has a higher probability than taking a trade that is not at a "level". That's just trading 101.
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #21,084
  • Jun 14, 2011 4:49pm Jun 14, 2011 4:49pm
Quoting HiddenGap
Sorry, forgot where I was there for a moment. I thought I was in one of those advanced VSA skype rooms for a second. Newbies don't ask and don't worry about it.

On second thought here it goes in a nutshell:

Selective based means you are taking a trade signal at a "support or resistance" line or zone. This would include things like triggers, pivots, poc, vahs, vals, and trend lines or channels. Or taking a trade after the completion of a sequence.

Non-Selective based means you are simply taking a trade in "air". For example...
LOL, like the reference!!
  • #21,085
  • Jun 14, 2011 4:54pm Jun 14, 2011 4:54pm
Whats with all the 'Invisible' traders tonight?

Why would they want to be invisible? Am I missing something?
  • #21,086
  • Jun 14, 2011 5:03pm Jun 14, 2011 5:03pm
EU M5

Looks like we are finding a bit of support at the 4440 area. Wouldn't surprise me if we move back into the trend channel soon.
  • #21,087
  • Jun 14, 2011 5:10pm Jun 14, 2011 5:10pm
Quoting Intel
EU M5

Looks like we are finding a bit of support at the 4440 area. Wouldn't surprise me if we move back into the trend channel soon.
4445 is my highest volume trigger on the 15min today. The hidden upthrusty kinda bar at 13:30
  • #21,088
  • Jun 14, 2011 5:13pm Jun 14, 2011 5:13pm
Thanks for the replies, sorry I didn't get around to replying through the day, was too busy trying get my head around today's PA, let alone yesterdays!

Quoting NaughtyPip
Ok I'll pull my finger out.

The way I see your 5 min chart is,

The first trigger in purple, price seems to be respecting the low more than anything else. Now i know you dont use channels but I do think they carry some validity even on small time frames. (Yellow)

Once price has broken out of the channel we would expect a pullback to confirm the new trend (counter trend) which we see at the first no demand labeled with the red line... The only problem i see with this is it hasnt broken that lower trigger.

2 bars later we get quite a wide...
I do like trend channels i just don't really use them on the 5min as it gets a bit too messy for my liking. And yes, i always say hindsight is the greatest tool in a trader's arsenal!

Quoting Lowell83
In fact the 15min looks just lovely. Good support on sunday and just before LO.

Whats your reasoning for invalidating the NS off the first trigger?

And that "nice" test, what a doozie. I love it when the high/close of a successful test is respected in the future.
I invalidate it because it broke the trigger, i like the low to touch the trigger and bounce from there for the best kinda of entry. Doesn't mean I haven't entered on such a bar in the past though.

Quoting Intel
Another view.
Cheers Intel, appreciate the input. That's real VSA without silly triggers all over the charts

Bout time you got back trading huh?
  • #21,089
  • Jun 14, 2011 5:16pm Jun 14, 2011 5:16pm
Quoting KinsaleForex
..........Cheers Intel, appreciate the input. That's real VSA without silly triggers all over the charts

Bout time you got back trading huh?

I may do soon. Trying to get my head around everything. Surprising how much of your 'edge' you can lose when you take a break for a while!!
  • #21,090
  • Jun 14, 2011 5:47pm Jun 14, 2011 5:47pm
Quoting KinsaleForex
4445 is my highest volume trigger on the 15min today. The hidden upthrusty kinda bar at 13:30
Hey if you try using HG's new methodology for triggers, its actually bouncing right on the low trigger of the bar (which also happens to be yesterdays high) interesting stuff.
  • #21,091
  • Jun 14, 2011 6:04pm Jun 14, 2011 6:04pm
Quoting NaughtyPip
Hey if you try using HG's new methodology for triggers, its actually bouncing right on the low trigger of the bar (which also happens to be yesterdays high) interesting stuff.
I find the trigger lines / areas fascinating. I love how well the areas are respected. Certainly brought a new edge to my trading.
  • #21,092
  • Jun 14, 2011 6:12pm Jun 14, 2011 6:12pm
Quoting NaughtyPip
Hey if you try using HG's new methodology for triggers, its actually bouncing right on the low trigger of the bar (which also happens to be yesterdays high) interesting stuff.
You give me far too much credit my friend. It's Gavin's method (if I am correctly interpreting it).
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #21,093
  • Jun 14, 2011 6:27pm Jun 14, 2011 6:27pm
Just a quick follow up to the post this morning.

You can see how the midpoint did actually act as the trigger level. I could not get in there, but my man Intel might as he saw a Double bottom made with a Shake Out and a No Supply.

As for me, I do not use indicators for signals, but I do not trade against them either. So I had to wait for the Test when the bars turned back to blue and the chart mode was BUY.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: ex 5.png Size: 37 KB
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #21,094
  • Jun 15, 2011 2:52am Jun 15, 2011 2:52am
Quoting HiddenGap
Just a quick follow up to the post this morning.

You can see how the midpoint did actually act as the trigger level. I could not get in there, but my man Intel might as he saw a Double bottom made with a Shake Out and a No Supply.

As for me, I do not use indicators for signals, but I do not trade against them either. So I had to wait for the Test when the bars turned back to blue and the chart mode was BUY.

Nice charts so even if i dont get something what you wrotte it can be seen easily...

All the best
Work smart not hard
  • #21,095
  • Jun 15, 2011 3:46am Jun 15, 2011 3:46am
anybody found anything wrong with IBFX volume? volume has been very low and Flat before and after the London Open...

im using trade interceptor to compare and the volume looks okay there...
  • #21,096
  • Jun 15, 2011 4:30am Jun 15, 2011 4:30am
I was thinking the same thing just now Mtm. I haven't been able to find any information about the why.
  • #21,097
  • Jun 15, 2011 4:30am Jun 15, 2011 4:30am
Good morning and hello.

New here, but not to the concept.

Currently reading through your wonderful thread, on page 41 and I am keen to continue my education.

You have some wonderful and very informative posts that are well described etc etc.

I have many further questions relating to VSA, but I will take my time asking.

(sometimes you have to be ready to hear the answer).
  • #21,098
  • Jun 15, 2011 5:54am Jun 15, 2011 5:54am
Thanks for that HG.

Really well laid out and easy to read!

'hdz
  • #21,099
  • Jun 15, 2011 6:02am Jun 15, 2011 6:02am
Quoting SatchB
I was thinking the same thing just now Mtm. I haven't been able to find any information about the why.
im trading live account, its strange that the ibfx feed is like this...
  • #21,100
  • Jun 15, 2011 6:17am Jun 15, 2011 6:17am
Quoting J00
Good morning and hello.

New here, but not to the concept.

Currently reading through your wonderful thread, on page 41 and I am keen to continue my education.

You have some wonderful and very informative posts that are well described etc etc.

I have many further questions relating to VSA, but I will take my time asking.

(sometimes you have to be ready to hear the answer).
Welcome.
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
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