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MB Trading Futures - Introduction

  • #7,441
  • May 26, 2011 12:35pm May 26, 2011 12:35pm
Quoting jleblang
Now we’re getting somewhere.

In the screenshot that you posted (without any detail about what it was supposedly showing), you have the right column circled. I think you are now implying that this is some sort of Time and Sales, meaning that a print occurred at those prices, and since they are under your bid, you should have been hit.

We do not post a Time and Sales for FX. Those are bid/ask POSTINGS by banks, not trades. No execution occurred under your bid.

Next item?
I see, I posted this on 4/3/2011, and you respond 2 months later calling me a lier. So according to you, you don't post actual sales at all? That is very convenient. So if you don't post actual sales, why, if you right click on that column, why is there a check mark for trades?
  • #7,442
  • May 26, 2011 12:53pm May 26, 2011 12:53pm
The same platform is used for other asset classes.

Quoting wwwin
I see, I posted this on 4/3/2011, and you respond 2 months later calling me a lier. So according to you, you don't post actual sales at all? That is very convenient. So if you don't post actual sales, why, if you right click on that column, why is there a check mark for trades?
  • #7,443
  • May 26, 2011 12:56pm May 26, 2011 12:56pm
Quoting fiberangel
The same platform is used for other asset classes.
Well that is the answer. The rep here never answered the question that I had 2 months ago and calls me a lier, when a simple explanation would have ended this 2 months ago. Great customer support, ignore the customer and call him lier instead of looking at what the customer is saying.
Also, when I called MBT about this they never said that those were not sales, they said that "they do not guarantee execution and that is the risk of trading with them".
  • #7,444
  • May 26, 2011 1:00pm May 26, 2011 1:00pm
Quoting wwwin
Well that is the answer. The rep here never answered the question that I had 2 months ago and calls me a lier, when the simple explanation would have ended 2 months ago. Great customer support, ignore the customer and call him lier instead of looking at what the customer is saying.
You actually think you were clear about what in the world you were saying? I remember that post and I thought you were circling the fact that the size on the top bid was a 0. I have no idea how you think he was supposed to grasp what your question was...especially since the entire text of your post was...oh wait, there was no text.
  • #7,445
  • May 26, 2011 1:16pm May 26, 2011 1:16pm
Quoting wwwin
The right most column with the black background and white letters are ACTUAL TRADES with the time of the trade, the market depth are the colored columns to the left of the ACTUAL TRADES taking place.
ah ah you are always sure pretty sure of what are you saying right?
THIS ARE ACTUAL TRADES .. then finally you found out that fx ecn is different as this are NOT actual trades. OHHH the problem now is the custumer rep of MBT that did not explain this to you correctly...
so is always somebody else fault right?
  • #7,446
  • May 26, 2011 1:16pm May 26, 2011 1:16pm
Quoting IndyTrader
You actually think you were clear about what in the world you were saying? I remember that post and I thought you were circling the fact that the size on the top bid was a 0. I have no idea how you think he was supposed to grasp what your question was...especially since the entire text of your post was...oh wait, there was no text.
Thank you for the input, but this does not concern you.
  • #7,447
  • May 26, 2011 1:26pm May 26, 2011 1:26pm
Quoting wwwin
Thank you for the input, but this does not concern you.
I think it concerns all of us since you have spent the last two months harrassing this thread and interrupting any productive conversation that we could be having (and usually have over the years) with something so ridiculous. You're telling me you have 1900 posts on FF and don't know that there isn't a Time and Sales for FX?

To be honest, the problem isn't your question. The question is a valid one for a noob. The problem is...that you in no way, shape, or form made it clear what you were getting at. If you are telling me now that all of the nonsense over the last two months is because you think he skipped over your "question" that you never asked...I think you might be the most ridiculous person I've ever met.
  • #7,448
  • May 26, 2011 1:28pm May 26, 2011 1:28pm
Quoting jleblang
Is your account USD based?

Yes,my account is USD based.
  • #7,449
  • May 26, 2011 1:36pm May 26, 2011 1:36pm
Quoting wwwin
I see, I posted this on 4/3/2011, and you respond 2 months later calling me a lier. So according to you, you don't post actual sales at all? That is very convenient. So if you don't post actual sales, why, if you right click on that column, why is there a check mark for trades?

Wwwin,

First of all, let’s be clear. I did see that post a month or so back, but you put zero text describing what you were trying to say. It’s like roughtrader’s “Trade Context is Busy” screenshot. Big deal. Place a trade during rollover, you get that message. It’s not a bug or a problem, it’s just the message that MT4 returns under certain circumstances. He offers no detail as to when he is receiving it or how often, just a single screenshot of something that anyone could replicate that means nothing at all. That’s just like your original post. Here’s a Level 2 with two circles. No detail. Finally now, you reference back to that and your first post today on it sort of suggests that you are implying that something is wrong because there is a trade under the bid price. It wasn’t until fiberangel asked for clarity that you came back with the detail we need…you thought those were prints. Had you said two months ago “Why are people getting filled under my bid,” I would have answered right then and there.

As fiberangel commented, he is pretty familiar evidently with our API, so let me give you a complete answer here so there is no question as to what is going on.

We were a stock brokerage FIRST and foremost. We added options and futures. Forex came along in 2004 for us. All of it uses the same platform, which we allow others to program to directly via the SDK/API or FIX. Desktop and Desktop Pro are built on the API and SDK that we make available for others. It all has the same functions no matter which asset class that you trade. In stocks, options, and futures, there is a centralized time and sales. For example, if 200 shares trades on MSFT at 26.10 between Goldman and ISLD, that’s a print of 200 MSFT 26.10 with a timestamp for everyone everywhere to see (not who the participants are, just the size, time, and price). In stocks, options, and futures, thanks to oversight and regulation, all prints go to a central feed so that everyone has equal access. You can’t trade 200 shares of MSFT in the market without the world knowing that the exchange happened.

This is simply not the case for FX. There is no time and sales. Trades that occur at broker XYZ between Customer A and their Desk are only known to those two participants. It’s the same reason that charts in FX are based on Bids instead of prints…we don’t know the prints. That’s why there is a push occurring to consolidate to a handful of ECNs and maybe some exchanges, and at some point down the road, I would expect that you will see a global time and sales chain for Forex pairs. It didn’t exist initially in stocks either when the ECNs like ISLD and ARCA came along and volume started happening away from the exchange. Took a few years to get it all sorted out.

Now, do we know the prints that occur through our system (i.e. between our customers with other customers or between our customers and the banks in our system)? Of course. We have to clear those trades at the end of each day and the accounting for each goes into your account. But Time and Sales is not something that FX brokers display. I think mostly the approach is simply “No one else does, why should we?” I’m sure it will start happening. Heck, maybe we will, I don’t know. No idea. I’m just saying that brokers don’t show Time and Sales in FX.

But, we do have our platform which has all of the features and windows that work in all asset classes. In other words, just because you are pumping a FX feed through our platform instead of stocks or futures doesn’t mean that the Level 2 window is just turned off. It exists, and we like it to exist to show bids and asks and size of those (market depth…the left half of your screenshot). And with that, because it exists for the other asset classes, is the right part of that window, which has to pull something. Since there is no global time and sales and since we don’t just show our customer’s prints, something had to go there. The thing that the developers thought would be the most useful is a display of banks adding size at various prices near the market so you can see bids and asks above and below lining up.

I hope that answers that question. As always, I’m happy to answer in great detail any questions that you might have, as long as you actual explain them enough for me to understand what the question i
  • #7,450
  • May 26, 2011 1:51pm May 26, 2011 1:51pm
Quoting jleblang
Wwwin,

First of all, let’s be clear. I did see that post a month or so back, but you put zero text describing what you were trying to say. It’s like roughtrader’s “Trade Context is Busy” screenshot. Big deal. Place a trade during rollover, you get that message. It’s not a bug or a problem, it’s just the message that MT4 returns under certain circumstances. He offers no detail as to when he is receiving it or how often, just a single screenshot of something that anyone could replicate that means nothing at all. That’s just like your original post....
Fair enough, but the reason I posted only the picture is b/c I had actually described this earlier, where I said "you see bid or ask trades at your price", see this post,
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...55#post4484655
and all I get is attacks instead of explanations. So that picture post was just one of more on the subject. In addition, I called support and they did not say those were not sales, they just said that MBT does not guarantee executions.
Perhaps the thread would work better if everytime someone has a problem, you don't have the few fans jumping on that person trying to discredit that person instead of figuring out what the person is saying, instead of saying that the person is a competitor, that the person has a slow connection or foolishness like that. You need to be above FF members and not join them or encourage them by statements such as "don't feed the trolls" or other stupid assumptions that a person is a competitor. You are representing a company and cannot act the same as posters whose identity is unknown.
  • #7,451
  • May 26, 2011 2:24pm May 26, 2011 2:24pm
i think mbt is a good broker for small trades under 1mill, i notice sometime there bid and ask size can be 0 to 1mil that is very low LIQ
  • #7,452
  • May 26, 2011 3:25pm May 26, 2011 3:25pm
Quoting PoundTrader
i think mbt is a good broker for small trades under 1mill, i notice sometime there bid and ask size can be 0 to 1mil that is very low LIQ
I can tell you that what the banks execute on their system is often way more than what they display. I think if they show big size, they have to fill it, and instead they'd rather show less in case news hits, then they can just fill a few million. However, keep in mind that they have liquidity out to 5 decimal places and were one of the first to do that, so while a broker might take 20 million at a pip, on the MB system, you might have banks for 5 million at each tenth of a pip, etc. Problem is, I have heard people say "well I went to sell and I got filled at three prices, each a tenth of a pip apart, to get my 10 million" or whatever. I don't think that's a bad thing. Rather have that than 1 fill for 10 million at the rounded pip.
  • #7,453
  • May 26, 2011 3:49pm May 26, 2011 3:49pm
Quoting IndyTrader
I can tell you that what the banks execute on their system is often way more than what they display. I think if they show big size, they have to fill it, and instead they'd rather show less in case news hits, then they can just fill a few million. However, keep in mind that they have liquidity out to 5 decimal places and were one of the first to do that, so while a broker might take 20 million at a pip, on the MB system, you might have banks for 5 million at each tenth of a pip, etc. Problem is, I have heard people say "well I went to sell and...
they only offer 10mill per click if not lower, you can see on the bigger broker where there offering 20+mill per click and you can do more because they hide more LIQ, im just saying mbt is a got ECN for small lot traders
  • #7,454
  • Edited 8:03am May 27, 2011 7:47am | Edited 8:03am
Quoting PoundTrader
they only offer 10mill per click if not lower, you can see on the bigger broker where there offering 20+mill per click and you can do more because they hide more LIQ, im just saying mbt is a got ECN for small lot traders
PoundTrader,

That is simply not true. We have plenty of executions where traders enter two orders of 10mio* and get filled back to back totaling $20 million at one price in our system. What you see displayed on the Level 2 is not always the total size that a bank will execute.

*10million is the largest we accept per order.
  • #7,455
  • May 27, 2011 7:55am May 27, 2011 7:55am
Quoting raymund
Yes,my account is USD based.

Justin,

I hope you could see the reply,and respond me please.


Raymund
  • #7,456
  • May 27, 2011 8:35am May 27, 2011 8:35am
Quoting raymund
Justin,

I hope you could see the reply,and respond me please.


Raymund
Could you contact me directly at [email protected] so I can get some more info regarding your transaction and account number please.
  • #7,457
  • May 27, 2011 11:25am May 27, 2011 11:25am
Quoting jleblang
PoundTrader,

That is simply not true. We have plenty of executions where traders enter two orders of 10mio* and get filled back to back totaling $20 million at one price in our system. What you see displayed on the Level 2 is not always the total size that a bank will execute.

*10million is the largest we accept per order.
good
  • #7,458
  • May 27, 2011 11:32am May 27, 2011 11:32am
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  • #7,459
  • May 27, 2011 6:47pm May 27, 2011 6:47pm
Quoting IndyTrader
I think it concerns all of us since you have spent the last two months harrassing this thread and interrupting any productive conversation that we could be having (and usually have over the years) with something so ridiculous. You're telling me you have 1900 posts on FF and don't know that there isn't a Time and Sales for FX?

To be honest, the problem isn't your question. The question is a valid one for a noob. The problem is...that you in no way, shape, or form made it clear what you were getting at. If you are telling me now that all of the...
You are mistaken, FXCM has FX actual times and sales. Interactive Brokers has time and sales for FX. Just b/c your dearest broker does not provide it does not mean it does not exist. You are a too dumb noob infatuated with one broker to know what other brokers do.
  • #7,460
  • May 27, 2011 6:49pm May 27, 2011 6:49pm
Quoting wwwin
You are mistaken, FXCM has FX actual times and sales. Interactive Brokers has time and sales for FX. Just b/c your dearest broker does not provide it does not mean it does not exist. You are a too dumb noob infuatated with one broker to know what other brokers do.
Says the guy that couldn't explain himself for two months.
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