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How did trading change your life?

  • #21
  • Jan 28, 2011 9:21pm Jan 28, 2011 9:21pm
The fate of a trader
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  • #22
  • Jan 29, 2011 3:39am Jan 29, 2011 3:39am
Quoting highlander2

There are to types of trader, those who think of it as science, statistics and excel spreadsheets. And those who thinks its art and crafts. Im more the art type!


I agree with you, everybody has to find it's own way, the important thing is to don't forget that we are all playing with probabilities. Some people thinks they are very good drawing trendlines, but they are not, remember the third chart? it passed form -200 to +1800 in about 500 trades, with a coin!! now think of a trendline trader having that streek, he makes just one trade a day so it's more than 2 years he's showing profit, he lives his day job and brag with others he is a great trader, having more than 100% return per year...
If you lose it doesn't matter if you beat and blame your monkey (system), it still press button randomly...
  • #23
  • Jan 29, 2011 3:45am Jan 29, 2011 3:45am
Quoting ha-pattern
(Cool! New charts!)

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It's a rat race, and all people think of each other is where to draw the personal boundary lines: What to do, what others have done, and who to do over.
With this kind of pressure, I wish I'd considered when the chips may be down, since life's fortunes change like a chart.
Your story tells how people forget to embrace the moment with others close and instead race to the next step in their own life plan.
right there that is what i'm talking about!
  • #24
  • Jan 29, 2011 3:53am Jan 29, 2011 3:53am
Quoting auxesis
The fate of a trader
lol, yes i agree!! i've met a scalper about two months ago he is 30 years old but looks like 50, gosh i would never live like that!!
that's why i trade with an iphone, two reason:
1) i can brag with others that i have an iphone, so i can give me a tone!! Lol
2) i can trade even if i'm on a mountain trekking (did it, i swear), or doing breakfast sitting in one of the italian beautiful medieval squares!! :-D


One of my dreams would be to live 2-3 months in the US, and move to Spain, Asia, England, Australia, East, Sud, West, North of Europe (yes, i love european) even if i usually pass my vacations in the US.
Hope i'll be able to do it one day
  • #25
  • Jan 29, 2011 4:59am Jan 29, 2011 4:59am
Quoting auxesis
The fate of a trader
now this is an image tha you will not see on broker websites!
  • #26
  • Jan 29, 2011 7:20am Jan 29, 2011 7:20am
staying to much in front of a screen isn't healthy... here is my trader friend... lol!
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  • #27
  • Jan 29, 2011 1:26pm Jan 29, 2011 1:26pm
Quoting alex_000
FX is just as my hobby. I couldn't manage to trade for living, not because it's not possible, but it would be to much of bore for me. I see FX as poker. Just to spend some time, win some money.
How trading changed my life? Well, i gain extra money, which allow me to do extra curricular activities.
ditto word for word for the most part.

Although the research into my style of trading is more philosophical than it is technical. I could make money on any system because it's about playing the 'hand' and not necessarily the system. I trade my style because it's damn effective and it's a practical application of my studies into what makes the universe tick.

It was until I started treating forex as a poker table that I became profitable. Setups and risk reward. check or bet. call, raise, or fold. simple.

As far as the trading effect on my life... I stopped caring so much about making millions. The satisfaction for me is the result of nailing a great trade. the money is just bonus. If I focus on the money, I find that I can't sync myself to the chart. Same at the poker table. Play to play well and the chips take care of themselves. Focus on the chips and you might as well just hand them to the guy next to you and walk away.

I've applied that thinking to my job. I really enjoy my job now even though I'm sure I could be making more elsewhere or if I raised a stink.
  • #28
  • Jan 29, 2011 1:37pm Jan 29, 2011 1:37pm
Quoting JR97
ditto word for word for the most part.

Although the research into my style of trading is more philosophical than it is technical. I could make money on any system because it's about playing the 'hand' and not necessarily the system. I trade my style because it's damn effective and it's a practical application of my studies into what makes the universe tick.

It was until I started treating forex as a poker table that I became profitable. Setups and risk reward. check or bet. call, raise, or fold. simple.

As far as the trading effect on my...
Yeah your so right, the satisfaction of being able to make good trades is worth more than the money, especially after all the work we went through to get to where we could see results.

I have a part time job, so it takes the pressure off the trading part of things. makes me feel that i dont have to make money.
  • #29
  • Jan 29, 2011 2:06pm Jan 29, 2011 2:06pm
My profits from trading last year were £30 000

My salary is £18 000.

I think its safe to say without trading my life would be a hell of a lot different and not in a good way. I will continue to work until I am absolutely confident in my ability to produce an income purely from trading. I figure I will need an account of a least £100k so a few years of working left for me.
  • #30
  • Jan 29, 2011 7:03pm Jan 29, 2011 7:03pm
Hi,
I think the only reason of not breaking even in the long run is because of the Spread in our forex trading. Right?
Every trade you had to pay at least 1 or 2 pips per trade. Even in my demo account, when my trade was in profit, the price was also about 1 or 2 pips lower than the price presented on the screen. So, if you trade 1000 times based on the Coin strategy, and you get 500 win and 500 loss. And suppose you has a RR ratio at 1:1. For every lost trade, you lost X pips + spread. For every wining trade, you gain X pips - 2 Spread (in my case).

Therefore, after 1000 trades, the result would be the loss of: -(1000 *3 spread).

So, if we rely on 50/50 chance, then my chance of winning in the long run is negative.
What about having RR differs from 1:1. If we have a 2/1 profit/risk, would it simply make us become profitable trader? I don't know and the answer is still depending on a lot of different factors. But one thing for sure is with RR change, win/loss ratio would also change.
I would like to hear your comment.
  • #31
  • Jan 29, 2011 7:12pm Jan 29, 2011 7:12pm
Quoting highlander2
Quite frankly a coin toss system will probably beat a lot of traders out there who are simply consistent losers. thats if you are placing equal tp and sl. The only thing that you should be down is the combined spread after a large number of trades. You only need to out perform a coin by a percent or so to make money although i was never that interested in statistics with trading. i prefer real time results.

There are to types of trader, those who think of it as science, statistics and excel spreadsheets. And those who thinks its art and crafts....
I believe that trading is both an art and science, but I'm more oriented to science. I believe in probability of a trade. It all depends on the trader to decide which way he wants to go. There maybe no right or wrong answer in trading, the trader must decide for himself which answers are right or wrong related to his trading personalities.
  • #32
  • Jan 29, 2011 9:32pm Jan 29, 2011 9:32pm
i'm a newbie and still learning...

what you're doing here is really very interesting for me... as a noob at least i have some good reference...

i'm subscribing!
  • #33
  • Jan 29, 2011 11:09pm Jan 29, 2011 11:09pm
Trading successfully (for a living) is probably one of the toughest things you will ever accomplish (if you choose to). If you're not willing to put in the time and effort, then you're simply "wishing or hoping".

It's also not all it's cracked up to be. No high priced hookers, no coke, no mary jane, no $10000 a night hotel rooms, no yacht, and no Ferrari.

However, it will allow you a little more free time, allow you spend a little more time with your loved ones, allow you to be your own boss (when Mr. Market isn't kicking your ass), and allow for a couple of the finer things live has to offer.

Other than that ... it's just another job that happens to pay well when you play well. If you don't play well, then Mr. Market expects YOU to pay him. His take can be a lot better than what he pays you. Be careful.
  • #34
  • Jan 29, 2011 11:40pm Jan 29, 2011 11:40pm
Quoting GulfCoastPip
It's also not all it's cracked up to be. No high priced hookers, no coke, no mary jane, no $10000 a night hotel rooms, no yacht, and no Ferrari.
Haha! Dude, those are the only reasons to trade.
Don't wish it were easier, wish you were better. ~ Jim Rohn
  • #35
  • Jan 30, 2011 4:23am Jan 30, 2011 4:23am
Quoting Kambing
i'm a newbie and still learning...

what you're doing here is really very interesting for me... as a noob at least i have some good reference...

i'm subscribing!
Hope this will help you! and good luck on your journey.
  • #36
  • Edited 6:19am Jan 30, 2011 4:44am | Edited 6:19am
Quoting mtrader87
Hi,
I think the only reason of not breaking even in the long run is because of the Spread in our forex trading. Right?
Every trade you had to pay at least 1 or 2 pips per trade. Even in my demo account, when my trade was in profit, the price was also about 1 or 2 pips lower than the price presented on the screen. So, if you trade 1000 times based on the Coin strategy, and you get 500 win and 500 loss. And suppose you has a RR ratio at 1:1. For every lost trade, you lost X pips + spread. For every wining trade, you gain X pips - 2 Spread...
Yes, we have to take in account spreads, absolutely right, but since we have spread not commissions we have some control over it, if you trade placing a 300 pips SL/TP spread will not affect too much (but it still affects), you'll need longer winning streek, but you can still get in positive territory.
Having a better RR from my studies doesn't help, if you place a 10 Tp and 100 Sl you still will get to BE, how? you'll have 90% win and 10% loss do the maths... BE!!
So how can we take advantage about this statistics? i think we have a good edge since most of the systems will get to BE, all we have to do is to wait for it.
If you don't want to be affected by this statistic just don't place a SL (SORRY I MEANT TP HERE) and you'll be fine.
What do i do? i use Sl and Tp into my day trading strategy (if i loose more then 2% in a single day i close out all my positions, in this way i can earn 1 to 6-7%, but i can't loose more then 2%) while i live my trades to go for months in my long term, it's a year and half that i'm making good money, am i lucky? i really don't know, probably time will tell.
My edge? it's that i'm conscious about it, i know i have to live with uncertainty, that's where most traders fail, they think they're the next Tudor Jones, while they just had luck!
  • #37
  • Jan 30, 2011 4:49am Jan 30, 2011 4:49am
Quoting mtrader87
I believe that trading is both an art and science, but I'm more oriented to science. I believe in probability of a trade. It all depends on the trader to decide which way he wants to go. There maybe no right or wrong answer in trading, the trader must decide for himself which answers are right or wrong related to his trading personalities.
Oh yes absolutely, 100% agree. I didnt mean to sound like i was dismissing the science part. like you say the trader must find whats right for him/her. if like me you trade with PA and discretion its pretty hard to work out exact probabilities. but i do keep solid records and review the data from time to time.

sorry if i did seem very bias.
  • #38
  • Jan 30, 2011 4:54am Jan 30, 2011 4:54am
Quoting Beman
Yes, we have to take in account spreads, absolutely right, but since we have spread not commissions we have some control over it, if you trade placing a 300 pips SL/TP spread will not affect too much (but it still affects), you'll need longer winning streek, but you can still get in positive territory.
Having a better RR from my studies doesn't help, if you place a 10 Tp and 100 Sl you still will get to BE, how? you'll have 90% win and 10% loss do the maths... BE!!
So how can we take advantage about this statistics? i think we have a good edge...
I don't know, I have quite a different opinion on all that.
The market is not normally distributed & take spreads and slippage into account then the 10 tp and 100 sl will very fast get very unprofitable.
Also I still don't understand how you wanna profit from B/E or losing systems. There is no edge in b/e systems, otherwise they would be net-profitable systems. From what I understand it is impossible to know in advance when a b/e system will get back to the b/e point.

However, I think the way you trade with small sl's and holding onto for months has a good edge and is very likely not a b/e system but a net-profitable system.
  • #39
  • Jan 30, 2011 4:54am Jan 30, 2011 4:54am
Quoting GulfCoastPip
Trading successfully (for a living) is probably one of the toughest things you will ever accomplish (if you choose to). If you're not willing to put in the time and effort, then you're simply "wishing or hoping".

It's also not all it's cracked up to be. No high priced hookers, no coke, no mary jane, no $10000 a night hotel rooms, no yacht, and no Ferrari.

However, it will allow you a little more free time, allow you spend a little more time with your loved ones, allow you to be your own boss (when Mr. Market isn't kicking your ass), and...
so true, and its why i believe its a good idea to have another source of income. I only trade part time, i am doing pretty well now, but i would not like to have to pay bills from my income. A-my account is to small for this and B- i dont want to add the pressure to my trading as it would probably ruin my results. maybe some day in 10 years i will rely on trading, but not yet.

No hookers here either......or ferrari's....
  • #40
  • Jan 30, 2011 4:56am Jan 30, 2011 4:56am
Quoting LasVahGoose
Haha! Dude, those are the only reasons to trade.
that's where expectation kick's in, i think both of you are right.
You can trade to have more free time, or to make big bucks, depends on you...
my expectation? i like the Xaron mental mood (he has journal called 1k to 1 million) i'll try to make millions (i'd like 10) with 100k, then to retire and do what i want.
I know it could sound newbish, but it's not, i'm risking 100k (not peanuts) but i'm conscious i can loose them, trying to earn 10 millions so if i'm gonna have a lucky winning streek i'll stop trading. If i'll have a losing streak i'll wait to go to BE. Obviously you can't do it risking a 2.5% a trade, chances to loose everything is too high... patience...
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