steps to follow when a broker scams you?

Very good advice for this individual yet what does he do?

http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...55#post4170255

Some people are just addicted to pain and some people are just too stupid to feel it.

He'll get scammed for a third time, some will never listen. How foolish can one guy be?

Jackdan stop p!ssing your money away and give it to a good charity instead.

Why should i stop? i make my 5% daily in dukas, manual trading, and use some mt4 autotrading in mig bank. i, overall, am very profitable, and thank you for worrying for me but on that front, i have no problems whatsoever,.

I am not here to discuss trading skills or not, i opened this discussion because i never saw the step After FPA claim.

An i refuse to believe that there is no way to actually act Vs those bandits, scammers, swindlers, crooks or whatever you want to call them.

The whole discussion in the thread has been driven apart by the othe member that actually just gave the answer of asume the lost and keep on... witch is to me not a valid answer.

Well, can you have a further look in the thread and ttell me your opinions about the other "unregistered" brokers?

I'm not sure if this might be helpful to anyone but here is something alarming about some brokers in Cyprus. I see some names on the list that I recognize and I'm worried when I read what CySec has to say about them!

http://forexsee.blogspot.com/2010/11...st-theyre.html

This is what surprises me. You see the list, you know these are unregistered brokers, we all know it now, and CYSEC has bee telling around that they will persue those unregistered as it is Criminal Offense to be broker in Cyprus without registration....

Criminal Offense, so something should be possible to do, at least in cyprus, and by ordinary people. I doubt you need 50k usd to denounce for a criminal offense.

Not a solution but here's what I do. Whenever I open an account with a less known broker I put in just enough money to trade, usually they allow 400:1 leverage so I utilize this to the max, I still trade my normal lots but use more leverage. This way if the broker goes under or there are problems I only use 10-20% of my total forex capital.
It's all about managing risk, am I willing to accept that broker going under or will it be too devastating for my trading.
You say it might be a criminal offense in Cyprus, but many of these brokers are owned by non-cyprus citizens(it looks that way at least), so to go after them some kind of international police needs to get involved, and for small amounts that might be impossible.
So at the end of the day these guys are going to get away with it, and we can't do anything about it.

Why dont you just open an account at a well known broker and then you wont have to worry about this issue?

Gee, guess that is just too easy...

jackdan
Why do you go to places like Cyprus?
Having said that I am still struggling to find a SAFE OTC broker even in US/UK/AUS for FX

But when I raised this issue people shouted me down just like they are shouting you down.

M

Next time, do not go for Cyprus, Belize British Virgin Island (et al) brokers.

Secondly, go for brokers that accept Credit Card funding. If they refuse withdrawal, file a dispute claim with your credit card company.
Of course, credible and secure brokers dont need to have CC Funding option; but if you are a newbie not knowing which is which, this is your best option...

Thirdly, NOT ALL ECN/STP/NDD are really ECN/STP/NDD; many are scamming wolves wearing sheep skins.

Thanks for the simpathy i read between your lines!


The whole point of the thread i opened is what to do AFTER having been scammed by a broker that still exists on the market.

This place has plenty of advises of what to do before, and even then we still fall in the trap..

Well, i wrote to cysec, let's see what they answer.

Honestly, we have lots of poor folks scammed one way or another by brokers. I myself scammed 2x by USA/NFA/CFTC brokers and 1x by a disguised FSA(UK)/NFA(US) regulated broker.

Complaining to the appropriate authorities is the first step. This everyone should already know how to do. It is a self-help step. From here-on-in, it is basically a 'your-job' thing. Hiring lawyers could help, but considering the expenses involved, it could cost more.

After I made complains, to date, nothing happened. Well, US is actively pursecuting 1-world, but I dont expect to get a single cent out of it. Another scam UGM closed shop, moved out before NFA could hear the case.

Bottom line of what most of us said is, getting scammed is part of forex. What you will do next to avoid getting scammed is the lesson.

As for me, I learned that CC funding is the best weapon against scamming brokers. And last year, one broker (disguising as FSA/NFA registered broker) almost got away with my money when they refuse withdrawal... A quick CC dispute got it all back.

Getting scammed then looking for advise afterwards? Well, you are not alone. I just hope the amount of money they stole from you is not going to break your back.

Thank you BurgerKing for bringing your thoughts.

Let's say we could assume that scam is part of the forex world, but, i , somhow, refuse it. There must be something to do. Not only talking about rcecovering the money, even if this is an important part of it.

As i said, i am involved in 500 usd in my personal case ( the amount deposited), but i read about big moneys around, form me anything bigger than 5k, is big money. If you take the thread of Prime4x in FPA, you will be really surprised.

you raised a good point with the CC matter. I would have thought that it is dangerous, but,no, actually, you're protected...

I don't agree with the posters that say don't go with brokers in Cyprus. Don't go with unregistered brokers anywhere. That includes UK, US or anywhere else in the world.

Without being registered with a controlling body of some kind, you have no recourse if something goes wrong. Anybody saying that Cyprus in particular is dodgy hasn't kept up to date with their regulation. In 2009 it was made a criminal offence to operate a forex/investment business in Cyprus without being regulated by CYSEC. That meant if they are not regulated by CYSEC no bank in Cyprus is allowed to do business with them, they are not allowed to be domociled in Cyprus and they are not allowed Cypriot employees. Failure to be regulated means a term of imprisonment of up to 5 years and a 350,000 Euro fine. So its simple, if the company says they are Cyprus based go to the CYSEC website and check they are registered and if not, keep away. Why people still want to go with unregistered companies anywhere in the world astounds me.

Don't also be lulled into thinking that if they are unregistered and based for instance, in the US or UK you are any better off, you're not, there is not one good reason you can give for going with an unregistered company.

Jackdan, I can't say I've got no sympathy for your lost funds, but you have been trading forex long enough by the sound of it to know better. You have an account with Dukas and yet you still go to unregulated brokers, you have to know thats gambling with your money, and this sentence
thats EXACTLY why they do it, and all the while there are people around like you that still put money in with them, why not, its easy money surely. Make a website (very cheap) buy mt4 (still cheap) show you a "price feed" and wait for you to send them money, then disappear.

There was a company around for a while calling itself fx-pro.com (notice the hyphen) now when you go there after probably thousands of people wanting their withdrawals, there is a hostgator suspended page.

Even regulated brokers can scam you.

Do you know how long it takes for a complaint to get acted opon? It takes months, years!!!!! By the time the regulatory bodies start the gear, the broker could have packed up and run!

My ultimate advice is to really go for regulated brokers that accept CC funding. DO NOT go anything less. with these two ingredients, you wont be scammed!

Alot of traders belittle the "CC funding option" saying, legit brokers dont need to accept CC funding as they are proven legit already. Yeah, yeah sure... alot of scam brokers also claim themselves "proven legit brokers".... I am sure alot of victims fell for this "we are legit brokers, trade with us"...

Ask yourself: How fast will CFTC/NFA or CYpres or FSA or whatever alphabet regulatory body you have can process and hear your complain vs How fast your Credit Card company would act on your Dispute Claim..

NFA hasnt responded to my complain and after 5 months, UGM closed shop leaving me with less money in the pocket.
But when I filed Dispute Claim with my CC against a broker, I got my money back in less than a week!

What brokers accept CC and is also regulated? Alpari UK is one such broker.

FXPro, IBFX, FXCM, FXCM UK the list of regulated companies that accept credit cards is long.

I'm not saying you can't be scammed at all by a regulated broker, stop hunting all sorts of tricks maybe (luckily not had it happen so I can't comment on that) but thats why I prefer UK or EEC regulated companies because if the whole company goes down, client funds are segregated (this is checked by the FSA or other regulating body) which isn't required in the US.

Your advice about CC is probably good but not everybody has one.

BK,
Your advice is normally sound but I am surprised by your above statement...
WHY is it that people ( as consumers) should accept this situation with OTC /FX marketplace? Will we accept it with LSE/NYSE/ ASX berokers?

What amazes me is instead of uniting to fight scams people are keen to tell others to put up with the status quo ( read the abuse I got on my comments on FSA/ ASIC and client money safety)

Also the thing about FSA coverage is really questionable.. in my correspondence with FSCS I never got a clear cut answer to the following question
_ in case of a FSA regulated FX broker ( not a Exchange traded facilitator broker) goes belly up does the 50K insurance covers the consumer .

Like UK Australian money rules also stipulate that client money should be in a seg account... but it is still prone to abuse... because it is co mingled and if fraud happens the money is gone... ASIC may take criminal action but your money is gone

The CC option you mention is interesting... but that won't protect you from broker going out of business! Say you deposit money today and the brokers goes belly up after 6 months? what does CC company has to do with that?
correct me if I am wrong

Getting scammed is a part of forex. BUT you are right that "being scammed" is NOT acceptable and we all should do something to stop it. Unfortunately, newbies kept falling into the marketing gimicks of scammers like "we offer smallest spread of 0.1 pip even for GBPJPY" or "we offer 100% deposit bonus" etc... Why cant newbies just follow the veterans in placing their money on well established brokers ....

Oh yeah, because newbies kept hearing/reading about cool-aid cheerleaders who would post "i am happy with xyz broker they gave me $1000 sign up bonus" etc... and these cheerleaders would condemn negative posts about certain brokers... A friend who got scammed by UFXBANK was even attacked by these group... While newbies kept falling into these traps, there will always be scam brokers.

WHAT can we all do about it?
Firstly I propose FF (being a more established website than FPA) to get a team of lawyers for the purpose of pursuing scamming brokers. But even this I think is not enough...

The only real solution is avoidance. I have once posted it here at FF Forum to put a sticky on a thread about SCAM brokers. This way, we know which to avoid.

This is why every trader needs more than just hanging onto a piece of registration certificate to protect their money. And this is where CC funding option is key!

If I fund my account via CC; I make it a point to always withdraw within 30 days (or the minimum duration allowed by your broker). If they remit the money (either they send it back to the CC or wire to my bank), I re-deposit. Sure it costs some $$$ wiring back home. But it is better SAFE than SORRY! I also always ask all the capital + a small profit each time I withdraw.

Always ask withdrawal within your CC's dispute duration. Give ample time for the withdrawal to arrive. Many brokers will delay for a week or two; take that into consideration. Ask your CC company about the maximum duration. Ask your Broker about the minimum withdrawal duration..

Try it out with FXCM, Alpari. I dont LOVE these brokers, but they are safe and offer CC funding. They dont offer 0.1 pip spread but you can withdraw your money. They dont offer bonus (oh yeah Alpari does), but you can withdraw your money. They dont offer ultra fast execution, but you can withdraw your money. They have huge slippage and wide spread, but you can withdraw your money.


Again I am not advertising these, just recommending them for the CC funding option. I am sure there are many other brokers that offer CC funding options.

There is also another bonus to CC funding. I dont even have to shell out the actual money to fund my account. When I fund using CC, I am given x number of days to pay it. Depending on when your CC bill is issued, it could be as short as 5 days, or as long as 50 days (in case you used it just after the billing cutoff day). And usually, I would have asked the broker to remit back the fund before I am obliged to pay the CC! The addage "it takes money to make money" is now re-worded: "I made money without money!" Moreso, my CC offers me rewards/discounts for using the CC. I get about $250 for every $50K of CC transactions. Maybe small, but it more than covers the wire fees.

* Did I spend any money to fund my account? NO!
* If I get scammed, do i lose money? NO!
* If I lost in a trade(s) and then broker tried to scam me, do I lose any money? Depending on how aggressive I am with my dispute, I can get it all back. There is an ethical boundary in this issue though but if they are aggressive in scamming me, I will aggressively disput them back as well.
* But if I lost in a trade and broker did not scam me, well, thats a legitimate loss which I dont dispute. This is a different story.


I repeat:
* Do not belittle the CC Funding Option.
* It is the best tool I found to fight against SCAM brokers!
* Regulatory bodies (such as NFA, CFTC, FSA, ASIC) require a long amount of time to resolve issues; they are not pressured to resolve it one bit. Whereas a simple email to the Broker copy furnished the CC company will resolve it within a week! They are financially pressured to resolve it in the shortest amount of time!

Finally, we are heading this thread to where i wanted from the first time.

Yes, we all know what not to do, not to join this or that broker.

Thanks god, some people here are with my idea, that this can not remain unpunished, and that we have to assume "this is it".


I spend the 3 first pages of this thread fighting against that, against the fact "assume your loss and keep on", this is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE.

I am sure that, somehow, maybe some people would joing together, lawyers or not, and strat to do something. Even from the criminal ofence part, having to forget the money.

If someone kill my son, i will not get him back, i will have to keep on living without him, "forget" him someways, but NOONE will take away the need, the right, the absolute will to bring in front of justice for criminal offense the person(s) that killed him. Why should we treat our money differently? at the end of the day, if i stay without money because someone scammed me, and i can't feed my kid because of it.....

I know i am taking it to the dramatic point of view..... But , why should we forget it and keep on?¿

we could even bring forward a special web site just for that, and put together poeple that has been scammed. i am sure that amongst those there is more than one lawyer that would end up willing to make the trial (here, there, in cyprus, mauritius or pernambuctu..), it could even be possible to get some money back, and from there finance the web, Maybe we need some more funding...well, yes...maybe "legal" brokers, tired of scammer could even sponsor that web... (if they do with F1 cars..... )

Why not?

Ok BK
To expand on your idea
"If I fund my account via CC; I make it a point to always withdraw within 30 days (or the minimum duration allowed by your broker)"

Lets look at the worst case scenario

Lets say I funded the account with CC, and nest day broker goes belly up?
Why would it be CC companies liability? would it be?
Would the CC company not just become another creditor to the collapsed broker

Another thing what if after funding I have a taken a position and then broker goes belly up?

By the way in your case (BK, two US brokers scamming) apart from CFTC is there no recourse through the Voluntary Administration process and Class action?

In the current Sonray Capital markets saga in Australia thousands are in a mess becasue some had hard cash some had CFD positions ( FX and stock) some peoples money went first in to seg account and then was deposited with IB etc

Seg account supposed to have 73 Million
A Hole is 47 million
Have spent more than 1.5 m on Administrators and lawyers so far
Many mum and Dad investors lost life savings and that too not because of Market risk but because the regulator allows this thing to happen


SO for those people on the FF who think this is not an issue JUST SHUT UP you have no moral ground to shout down those who expose this.