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Thoughts on 50:1 Leverage

  • #201
  • Sep 9, 2010 12:03am Sep 9, 2010 12:03am
Hey! You stole my avatar!
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
  • #202
  • Sep 9, 2010 12:17am Sep 9, 2010 12:17am
Quoting Pipsqueak

Is it just me or does the forex market seem "dead" the last couple of months after the 100:1 leverage rule took effect?


Oh boy, it's a hard decision to make.......nope, I think kibescorp's post about "Leverage isn't just about what position(s) you have open, the sum of all your open orders are also included when the margin is calculated." takes first prize for the most inane comment of the thread! It was pretty close but sorry Pipsqueak, no cigar!

hehe, boxes of soap, compulsory 400:1, leverage and risk not connected, margin on pending orders, clean minds, pure hearts.....this thread just gets better and better each time I open it!
  • #203
  • Sep 9, 2010 1:09am Sep 9, 2010 1:09am
Quoting Monroe
You can get more then 10% a week with 10-20:1 leverage... and that's just being conservative.
Monroe I highly doubt that you are profitable at all. Like your argument is that a bunch of people are undercapitalized and whining as I pointed out 90 percent of stock daytraders blow up their accounts as well will with far lower leverage. For the record I trade extremely low leverage and my broker has always been at 1:10. I use options to manage the risk for my clients however to actually generate and profit consistent profits which may consist of upfront expensive costs. Anyways...rolling eyes, the reason I doubt your profitable is that your a scalper like the daytraders that lose 90 percent and the forex traders that lose 90 percent and I see you have only been on this forum since 2009 and have very little faith in making 6 figures in the forex market which is an easily attainable goal. As I have so often said, I believe scalping and overtrading is the bane of forex traders and I have seen time and time again forex traders blow up their accounts because of it. Should I now enact a rule on scalpers banning scalping because I am against and statistically it does lead to high level of blown up accounts

answer: absolutely not

Once again I really doubt your profitable Monroe, if you are a scalper and I agree that there is most likely a 5% chance that you will generate "holy grail profits"
  • #204
  • Edited 3:36am Sep 9, 2010 2:40am | Edited 3:36am
Quoting Maxsmart
Monroe I highly doubt that you are profitable at all. Like your argument is that a bunch of people are undercapitalized and whining as I pointed out 90 percent of stock daytraders blow up their accounts as well will with far lower leverage. For the record I trade extremely low leverage and my broker has always been at 1:10. I use options to manage the risk for my clients however to actually generate and profit consistent profits which may consist of upfront expensive costs....
Ok so what does bringing my ability to trade have anything to do with this thread? I highly doubt you are that profitable either, and turning weak annual percentage for clients in a fund is pathetic. Furthermore, I don't know any long term traders that are very profitable, yet I do know of consistent profitable intraday traders and scalpers who trade with PB's.

I don't think scalping has anything to do with the numbers... I think lack of understanding of the market is why there are 90%+ losers. This thread is full of them, trading charts with indicators and TA nonsense and using high leverage in the process.

If those same people went to longer term position trading, it would be the same, they would just lose all there money slower then if they were scalping.

[edit: I did some bragging but decided to take it out as my profits and performance doesn't need to be stated or proven]

I don't trade a TF, so calling me just a scalper would be a wrong. Though it usually is somewhat of a scalp or short swing.
  • #205
  • Sep 9, 2010 3:04am Sep 9, 2010 3:04am
Quoting Maxsmart

I highly doubt that you are profitable at all
Sorry, what does that have to do with anything? Better to argue the subject rather than start guessing whether someone is profitable or not, it's irrelevant in this discussion.

Quoting Maxsmart

a scalper like the daytraders that lose 90 percent and the forex traders that lose 90 percent
Yeah I'm not sure timeframe or trading style is really going to help those guys, they'll probably lose regardless.

Quoting Maxsmart

have very little faith in making 6 figures in the forex market which is an easily attainable goal.
'making 6 figures'

You need to quote some other numbers for that to mean anything! 6 figures on what, a million, 100k, 200 bucks?


Quoting Maxsmart

"holy grail profits"
What are 'holy grail profits' please?
  • #206
  • Edited 3:46am Sep 9, 2010 3:14am | Edited 3:46am
Quoting Pipstrumpf
Very deceitful to even suggest something stupid like "anybody can make easily 10% or more on a conservative strategy a week". That is just in its own a blunt lie, go and look up what conservative means.

Firstly why would anybody with the right mind even look at weekly gains trading Forex?...
You completely miss-quoted and put words in my mouth. And who said I look at weekly gains? The guy said that he needed high leverage to amplify his gains because 10% a year won't do it for him, I said over 10% in a week is possible with less then 50:1. Did I say conservative or every week?

In the future I would like to help people here and give value instead of argue with the likes of these people, I don't know why I tend to get caught up with the back and forth's between such hopeless individuals, the people that cry about there brokers hunting there stops and government taking away there much needed 400:1 leverage and rights and the list goes on and on. Anything they can think of as to why they can't get profitable when the real problem is themselves. You don't need 400:1 leverage or 200:1 leverage or even 100:1 leverage. You need to learn how to trade and the profits will come. 50:1 is more then enough buying power to make it happen, along with sufficient starting capital.
  • #207
  • Sep 9, 2010 4:07am Sep 9, 2010 4:07am
Quoting Monroe
You completely miss-quoted and put words in my mouth. And who said I look at weekly gains? The guy said that he needed high leverage to amplify his gains because 10% a year won't do it for him, I said over 10% in a week is possible with less then 50:1. Did I say conservative or every week?

In the future I would like to help people here and give value instead of argue with the likes of these people, I don't know why I tend to get caught up with the back and forth's between such hopeless individuals, the people that cry about there brokers hunting...
That's right. 50:1 leverage is sufficient. But you're still not getting it. It's about the freedom to make the choice. Just like you want to have the freedom to be able to trade, period. Some people want the freedom to choose higher leverage.

And who would want. ask for or need your help is beyond me.
  • #208
  • Sep 9, 2010 4:20am Sep 9, 2010 4:20am
Quoting TradeRunner
That's right. 50:1 leverage is sufficient. But you're still not getting it. It's about the freedom to make the choice. Just like you want to have the freedom to be able to trade, period. Some people want the freedom to choose higher leverage.

And who would want. ask for or need your help is beyond me.
I get it, I totally get it trust me... save that freedom crap for someone else, cause your a fool talking about that shit.

And believe it or not, I have been asked for help. I'm sure there are a lot of things are beyond your comprehension, trading most likely being one of them.

lol not sure why people are acting weird, messing with my words, attacking me, questioning my performance and trading... getting strange now.
  • #209
  • Sep 9, 2010 4:43am Sep 9, 2010 4:43am
Quoting Monroe
I get it, I totally get it trust me... save that freedom crap for someone else, cause your a fool talking about that shit.

And believe it or not, I have been asked for help. I'm sure there are a lot of things are beyond your comprehension, trading most likely being one of them.

lol not sure why people are acting weird, messing with my words, attacking me, questioning my performance and trading... getting strange now.
If you actually "got it" then you would have had a much better choice of words, so NO, you most assuredly DON'T "get it".

It is you that fails to comprehend the words that you read because you're to dull to consider another point of view besides your own. And yes, I find it hard to believe that someone would ask for your help.

And you're not sure why people are attacking you? Now that's really funny !! What do you call the post you just made? Is that your way of making pleasant conversation?

Finally, I think you're a very sad person. If you think any mention of freedom is crap.... I just pity you.
  • #210
  • Sep 9, 2010 4:59am Sep 9, 2010 4:59am
Quoting TradeRunner
If you actually "got it" then you would have had a much better choice of words, so NO, you most assuredly DON'T "get it".

It is you that fails to comprehend the words that you read because you're to dull to consider another point of view besides your own. And yes, I find it hard to believe that someone would ask for your help.

And you're not sure why people are attacking you? Now that's really funny !! What do you call the post you just made? Is that your way of making pleasant conversation?

Finally, I think you're a very sad...

Is it really funny? I was attacked and then I defended, that was the reason for my last post. I didn't start any of that.

I don't fail to comprehend what I read, I fail to comprehend any sort of justifiable reasoning for using or needing 400:1 leverage. Ever since you got on this thread you were acting stupid with weak arguments with your soap selling business analogy to trading and leverage.

worthless.

Finally I don't care what you think of me, whose really the sad person here?
  • #211
  • Sep 9, 2010 5:11am Sep 9, 2010 5:11am
Quoting Monroe
Is it really funny? I was attacked and then I defended, that was the reason for my last post. I didn't start any of that.

I don't fail to comprehend what I read, I fail to comprehend any sort of justifiable reasoning for using or needing 400:1 leverage. Ever since you got on this thread you were acting stupid with weak arguments with your soap selling business analogy to trading and leverage.

worthless.

Finally I don't care what you think of me, whose really the sad person here?
Yeah, I guess I wouldn't expect you to understand that analogy. It's way over your head.

And you still can't comprehend any reasoning for higher leverage. Imagine that. As has been stated innumerable times it isn't entirely about the amount of leverage, it's about being able to make the choice. You are simply too simple to grasp that concept aren't you?

In answer to that last question..... I guess it's obviously you!
  • #212
  • Sep 9, 2010 5:17am Sep 9, 2010 5:17am
Quoting Monroe
You completely miss-quoted and put words in my mouth. And who said I look at weekly gains? The guy said that he needed high leverage to amplify his gains because 10% a year won't do it for him, I said over 10% in a week is possible with less then 50:1. Did I say conservative or every week?
In the future I would like to help people here and give value instead of argue with the likes of these people, I don't know why I tend to get caught up with the back and forth's between such hopeless individuals, the people that cry about there brokers hunting...
Forex in its own is and will be never "conservative" as an investment / trading vehicle regardless of leverage level, time frame end of story.
So if you as super scalper make a possible 10% profit a week, then link your bloody live account to myfxbook for example and show everybody here on this thread your results.
Unbelievable, if you are happy to put your whole equity into one investment vehicle then that is your choice, but there are many others preferring to diversify, so to have a higher leverage is an option to do that.
To finish it off, low leverage does not stop anybody to blow there account up and that is a fact and yes stop hunting does exist like it or not.
If the Government wants to be kind to their people then they should take away the brainwash box and the junk food instead of leverage that may help too.
  • #213
  • Sep 9, 2010 5:58am Sep 9, 2010 5:58am
Quoting Pipstrumpf
Forex in its own is and will be never "conservative" as an investment / trading vehicle regardless of leverage level, time frame end of story.
So if you as super scalper make a possible 10% profit a week, then link your bloody live account to myfxbook for example and show everybody here on this thread your results.
Unbelievable, if you are happy to put your whole equity into one investment vehicle then that is your choice, but there are many others preferring to diversify, so to have a higher leverage is an option to do that.
To finish...
this thread is not about me and my performance for the last time.

I am very well aware stop hunts do exist, as I am hunting them. Brokers aren't going after peoples stops personally if that's what you're referring to.

anyway, I wasn't trying to offend anyone here, and I am done talking about this. If you have something personal against me we can take care of it in private message.
  • #214
  • Edited 7:18am Sep 9, 2010 7:07am | Edited 7:18am
If somebody really wants to destroy a thread it is enough to post how much he/she is making every day/week/year. If one could make 10% a week he must be somewhere on a yacht enjoying the weather and not typing useless posts on a forum.

2 big reasons why the leverage shouldn't be limited:

1) I don't like transfering all my money to the broker
2) There are traders who keep their positions longer than a few days and, even they are profitable, the necessary leverage will be always calculated without taking them in consideration

So, even if I seldom need more than 10:1, I find this limitation to be stupid. The fact that some on this forum are scalpers or close their position after 1 hour is not an argument.
  • #215
  • Sep 9, 2010 7:12am Sep 9, 2010 7:12am
Quoting TradeRunner

It's about the freedom to make the choice.
Ah right, so now it's a constitutional issue is it......

Yep, when all other sensible avenues of argument fail just go right for the 'freedom of choice' card, works every time for pretty much any subject! It works better if you're an ethnic minority though, can we maybe squeeze that into the argument somewhere?
  • #216
  • Sep 9, 2010 7:18am Sep 9, 2010 7:18am
to give my few nuts....

i just scrolled through the thread and start rolling on floor laughing...
what do you guys expect from each other? : p

I don't get it...but no one got the power to move markets...
Hero calls followed by margin calls...
  • #217
  • Sep 9, 2010 7:23am Sep 9, 2010 7:23am
Quoting Sauron
If somebody really wants to destroy a thread it is enough to post how much he/she is making every day/week/year. If one could make 10% a week he must be somewhere on a yacht enjoying the weather and not typing useless posts on a forum.

2 big reasons why the leverage shouldn't be limited:

1) I don't like transfering all my money to the broker
2) There are traders who keep their position longer than a few days and, even they are profitable, the necessary leverage will be always calculated without taking them in consideration

So, even if...
your first argument was stated many times.

If your referring to me in your first comment, stating that I make 10% a week every week that is not what I meant, nor what I said. I said it was possible to make 10% in a week with much lower leverage. Holding a trade for over an hour is not considered a scalp in my book, but I guess this is debatable. Again I would appreciate if people would stop miss-quoting and misinterpreting.

50:1 is not a limitation. *in my opinion* over 50:1 is never needed, I don't care how long your holding a position. Your not getting over 50:1 on the interbank, and your not getting over 50:1 on tier 2 level either. There may be 100:1 but I have never seen that offered. Are you intending to stay with a MM or fake ECN with a MM model forever, because they give you the "right" or "choice" to trade with crazy leverage?
  • #218
  • Sep 9, 2010 7:33am Sep 9, 2010 7:33am
Quoting PhAnTi'

no one got the power to move markets...
Well lookie here, a new contestant for the SPIT (Stupidest-Post-In-Thread) Award!

Not even close buddy, you're competing with some of the best, have another go!
  • #219
  • Edited 8:32am Sep 9, 2010 8:20am | Edited 8:32am
Quoting pipmutt
Quoting Pipologist99
I don't think you still understand that leverage and actual risk per trade are ***NOT*** the same thing. If you did, you wouldn't still be talking about the *DANGERS* of high leverage....
Are you saying they're not connected? Seriously?
Quoting pipmutt
hehe, boxes of soap, compulsory 400:1, leverage and risk not connected
He didn't say "they're not connected", he said they're not the same thing, and he is spot on. Contrary to what most think, leverage and actual risk per trade are definitely not the same thing, as in: having higher leverage doesn't necessarily mean you're risking more than you should be in one single trade, duh!

Your twisting his words pretty much shows that you don't really "get it".

Just because your bröker allows you to trade a maximum of 200 lots at once doesn't mean that you're going to put your entire equity in one single trade. It just means that you virtually 100% degree of freedom to select the proper position size for your trade.

"Freedom crap"? lol

Pity indeed.
  • #220
  • Sep 9, 2010 11:24am Sep 9, 2010 11:24am
1. From a pure statistical standpoint, a scalper is up against a higher "house edge" than a swing/position trader. BUT, maths/statistics don't take into account the "readability" of price behavior, a scalper does and uses it to profit REGARDLESS of the higher "house edge". To say that scalping is worse than other styles of trading goes only to show that you haven't studied price enough to realize the potential of good scalping.

2. You guys are going off-topic.
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