James16 is not credible

it was a bit past my sleeping time when i last posted last night, but i slept soundly, as usual.
i love such discussions... so my BP is/was normal.

To finally upload your real account statement to http://www.myfxbook.com ?

The problem is that these people were not scamed, they were fooled.
It was just service that they paid for. Of course 95% found after the fact that its useless but they got what they paid for. Educational service. Isnt it weird that there are no live statements, no stats from members, how many of them succeeded? I dont get what is the problem if it works and if service is helpfull. Probabbly it is not.

@ Trader KGB

I was merely trying to point out that our individual perspective will greatly influence our interpretation of a situation.

I am not defending James as such. I think the method he teaches is nonsense....but that is based on my own comprehensive study. But then again I have come to the conclusion that pretty much every aspect of technical analysis is nonsense. (This is not the thread to start discussing our individual views of the market or trading techniques).

The point I am trying to make is that it seems a little harsh to me to call James an outright scammer just because we think it is a waste of time to pay someone on a cheap forum to teach his own style of trading. Is his forum and method a waste of time and money? For me, absolutely. I think anyone who thinks they are really going to become a financially independent profitable trader from such a low cost service offered to such a large number of people, is a fool. But then again, take the time to read enough on this forum and it seems fairly obvious that 99% of the people on here are foolish. Human beings are naturally lazy. We all want quick fixes and fast solutions. That's what has led to some of the greatest inventions in history. And at the same time it's what leads people to seek out "mentors" who will show them the answer without the individual having to do any work. People want the comfort blanket offered by people like James, and he's merely giving them what they want. They may not need it, but they want it.

But I still can't see how he's a scam. What is he doing that is illegal? He trades pin bars, and other people want to learn about his method. So he says "pay me and I will show you". They pay, he shows! Seems like they get exactly what they paid for.

Has he taken money in the offer of trading for them and disappeared with the cash? Did he take their money and then refuse to teach them his method? I haven't seen anyone making those kinds of claims....just someone yelling "scammer, call the FBI because he's teaching a crap method"!

We really don't know his situation, circumstances or personality. It may be near impossible for the vast majority to believe, but there is of course the chance that he makes multiple millions each year from trading, so the forum really is small change to him. He may only spend a couple of hours updating the site on weekends, so it is a hobby to him. He may genuinely get his kicks/happiness/power trip from helping people, and so he's running the site for apparent altruistic reasons. Granted, all those things may be remote possibilities, but nevertheless they could be the case, so I think it's worth keeping an open mind. Especially when there are absolutely zero facts to back up claims he is a scam.

And just to be clear to everyone, I am not a James shill or even James himself. As I've clearly stated, I personally believe his trading method is nonsense (just my individual opinion), but I still don't think it's right to accuse him of being a scammer without any evidence.

Good trading all (whatever strategy you use)

It doesn't seem like this is a reply to anything I said in the previous post (which was really just an intriguing discussion of assumptions & logical fallacies).

Given the number of times you mention the word "scam", it appears you are really replying to onlydragon, who seems to have lost his cracker.. I can't distance myself enough from that poster. The concerns I brought up are nowhere near the level of his nonsensical allegations.

Apologies if I'm not making clear sense. I'm actually in full agreement with you about the red flags that just don't add up quite as James makes out. I thought your original post was the first intelligently posed post on this thread, quickly followed by SupremeChaos. This thread could be reduced to the two of you plus a small handful of other comments.

Yes, my issue about the scam is with the insane ramblings from onlydragon.

What I was trying to get across regarding your comments was simply that although highly unlikely that the forum is simply a part time hobby earning pocket money out of the goodness of his heart for James, we don't know his situation, and it could very well be exactly that. I think it is massively constructive that intelligent people like yourself raise extremely valid points for people to think about. I was merely trying to offer the other side of the possibility in an attempt to keep things balanced.

Just to clear something up, as I think i was misunderstood.

@Mr Smith, @Jlr, @Dan Gilbert - my comment on J16 'inventing' that stuff was sarcastic and of course meant at the insano with the massive blue fonts.
(also, i might pursue stand-up if what i said made you laugh your @$$ off Dan... you should hear my knock-knock jokes ;-])

I've read the free thread (some time ago now) and all I saw being taught on there was a way for people to spot potential, high-probability setups, some self-confidence, risk management, patience... you know, all the 'good stuff'.

I think people get stuck on the technicalities of the method, can't make it work and then think it's a $hitty methodology.
It is my assumption (and you know what they say about assumption...) that all the technical setups, price action, analysis etc. being posted on there is fluff covering over what he/they are probably really trying to teach/portray. As I mentioned, people soon get stuck on the technique and forget the methodology...

Personally, I tip my hat to the J16 group and hope they keep it up. For all the 'traders' that pass through there, at least the law of averages ensures a few will 'get it' and become very good market participants.

Lastly, @onlydragon - I'm sure if you can "easily find on internet for free" anything else you are looking for, you could probably find the FBI yourself. Try google'ing "FBI" instead of "pinbar" as a first step in the right direction...

Cheers all.

you mean like jacko's old watering hole where he and his claquer entourage would flleece everyone while being cheered on and vocally supported by a few prominent members who for all you know may even have been in on the scam.

I recently became aware of the Jacko debacle and then I found this thread today.

What I don't understand is why so many ppl even respond to this c**P. I also don't understand why this thread hasn't been deleted - not in the recycle bin - just delete it - it's garbage.

Anyway I got better things to do with my time, like trading - I'm off.

Extremely well said! I agree 110% with you ak4x!

Although I initially supported Dragon for requesting proof of profitability by statements, I by no means agree with the kind of defamatory or degrading wordings used by him. I think FF should warn or ban any one using foul language against anybody else in the forum, especially against a respected senior member like James16 and also making strong acusations without any proof. I believe all discussions should be conducted in polite and civil manner.

We should not easily accuse any one a scammer without evidence. We can question the methodolgy in a civil manner, or seek clarification on some questions on the methodolgy. For example, I can ask James16 why PA alone can fail sometimes in different market conditions. No method is bullet proof. It will not work in all cases. We just have to understand what works and what not.

On the other hand, it would surely help forum members if all commercial members can show verifiable proofs that their service is profitable consistently or over extended period. Live statements refreshed every few minutes are tremendous. Sound theory of methodolgy is not good enough proof that it will actually work in real life trading. Why not set up a small live account just for demonstrating the profitability of the methodolgy in real trading. This way, no one needs to reveal personal info to a public forum and yet still able to convince traders that the promoted service is worth the cost. It is never too late to start this. My humble 2c on the subject.

Post Of The Thread Award.

You mean the track record? Sorry, but I missed that trading statement.... would you care to post a link to his real statement on myfxbook.com.

lol these idiots here are not traders mate. They can sit here gossip about another man like bitches

Remember,
Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people.

Seems to me that this post discusses people. Am I right?

yes! that and the previous 20 pages behind it. so sue me

Well, Dragon is suspended so what is the point...
here is a thread from a commercial member that bans anyone that raises a question
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=247047

@wormboy
go get a life man ! you average 20 posts per day !!!
YOU dare call those who after the jacko fraud, ask the validity of another commercial member, little minds ?!
That`s incredible

There's an old saying that comes to mind... “Better to keep your mouth shut and let people think you’re a fool than open it and remove all doubt.” Seems you're opening your mouth an awful lot around here.

That is the problem, that b/c of Jacko people are over-reacting. James, as far as I know, does not manage funds. The only fee is $129 and you cancel anytime...it's not like $700 upfront no refunds, pump your trading and ask to manage your funds.
Now, if it is found that he manages funds or does not cancel the recurring subscription when asked, that would change my mind.
All these hoopla for a mere $129 is not worth it.
Just b/c Jacko is a fraud does not change what other people are. It was fairly obvious he was a fraud before he ran away. I don't see the similarity here.

OK, I do not agree with the way the thread starter posts...very bad english, big fonts and direct insults at j16 without no proof.

BUT, I find the idea behind this thread very legitimate. Anyone interested in paying those 129$ should read post #79. Trader KGB really sums up all the issues with j16 and maybe it should be made sticky.

And I wonder something else. How many members would have still payed jacko or j16 if they would have known right from the start that these guys are NOT profitable in their own accounts. OK, they present a strategy in the free thread, which may sound logical. Add to that ~ 30 years of supposed trading experience. That's quite impressive for any newbie. And it's understandable that they go to next step, paying to get even more insight.

But the real issue here is that we don't know they are profitable. How can you teach someone else, when you can't theach yourself ?
How many people would get nutrition or fitness lessons from a 250 kilo guy http://media.photobucket.com/image/f...fatguy.jpg?o=8 ?
Do you see the point i'm trying to make here ?