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I think Oanda FXTrade is unreliable

  • #361
  • May 19, 2010 3:23am May 19, 2010 3:23am
Quoting Monroe
I see how your factoring the slippage and interest, but are you saying 2 pips roundtrip on the trade or are you saying real spread is 2pips in and 2 pips out out?
I think you need to try and get away from just thinking about spread as the only overhead, that's exactly what they want and expect you to do. Overall, taking everything that the bròker is doing into consideration, the cost is roughly 2 pips per round trip, sometimes more. Like all retailers Oanda will have a break even point below which their business model is not viable. Some highly profitable (larger) retailers use similar 'loss leader' tactics where they sell a product at/below cost, on the face of it beating their competitors, but it's only a marketing tactic to get customers through the door, they know full well they'll profit overall from that customer in other ways. There's big bucks is consumer analysis and strategic retailing, some chains spend more on that than they do on advertising!

Quoting Monroe
well.. all I am saying is I'm not getting 2pip true spread on my entries... maybe 1-1.2 on overall average of a bunch of scalps, including slippage. But also, you have to average in positive slips.
Sure, like I say we'll never know how Oanda's algos work but everything is definitely skewed in their favour at the trader's expense.

Quoting Monroe
whatever the case, if you know what your doing, you'll get great spread at oanda, if your taking spike break entry scalps, you're going to see a higher average spread on your trades, and your 2pip+ figure would be reality. But I think it just depends on your trading and other factors like when your trading and volume.
Regardless of strategy or anything else, no-one is paying 0.9 overall, there's no free lunch!
  • #362
  • May 19, 2010 3:38am May 19, 2010 3:38am
Quoting Cocoflanel
The big advantage of Oanda is that they are doing big volume so that means they don't need to play all the games of the other shops when they can make decent money ONLY from the spread
The old 'stack em high and sell em cheap' philosophy would work great but these shops get greedy, why not take advantage of mug punters especially when they probably won't even notice!

I don't know how Oanda's volume and market share compares to bròkers who cater for the more professional trader, Oanda probably has a higher proportion of small clients trading nickels and dimes.
  • #363
  • May 19, 2010 3:52am May 19, 2010 3:52am
I know what your saying about the marketing and all that, and I agree, but my costs are never 2 pips roundtrip on my scalps and I think it does matter about your entries.

There business model doesn't bother me. I still profit, and there costs are definitely lower then any broker in this class... even ECN brokers in this class that claim lower or similar spread costs then you have to add on there crazy commissions and the fact that they are market maker models too. They can profit and do there thing, take the other side of my trade, i dont care as long as my account is going up... and there is definitely no free lunch. If they start to seriously manipulate and all the other claims... I will know about it and be the first to admit they are bullshit and screwing me over, but so far i haven't seen this.
  • #364
  • May 19, 2010 3:58am May 19, 2010 3:58am
Quoting Monroe
I know what your saying about the marketing and all that, and I agree, but my costs are never 2 pips roundtrip on my scalps and I think it does matter about your entries.

There business model doesn't bother me. I still profit, and there costs are definitely lower then any broker in this class... even ECN brokers in this class that claim lower or similar spread costs then you have to add on there crazy commissions and the fact that they are market maker models too. They can profit and do there thing, take the other side of my trade, i dont care...
That's great, you're an ideal client and exactly the type of person they want on their books. You make money and you're not really bothered how much it costs you to make it, as long as spreads appear tighter than anyone else and you get filled at more or less the price you click then you don't really give a crap what they do. You're a marketers dream!

I'm surprised other firms are still in business, surely every forex trader should be trading with Oanda, right!


Quoting Monroe
so far i haven't seen this
Yep, I know, you and a few thousand others by the sound of it, if you did we wouldn't be having this conversation.

If I didn't say it before, as long as you're happy, having fun, and making money then everything is good in your trading world, what more do you want?
  • #365
  • May 19, 2010 4:08am May 19, 2010 4:08am
Well I do care how much it costs to make it, thats why I trade with oanda and not these other brokers. Overall, I would be paying more there. They may be better then oanda in other ways depending on your strategy and whatever else you like in a broker, platform, etc... but for me, oanda is perfectly fine.

yea I'm pretty happy, of course I wish things were better for retail traders, but... at the same time I'm happy to be able to do it.
  • #366
  • May 19, 2010 4:15am May 19, 2010 4:15am
Quoting Monroe
Well I do care how much it costs to make it, thats why I trade with oanda and not these other brokers. Overall, I would be paying more there. They may be better then oanda in other ways depending on your strategy and whatever else you like in a broker, platform, etc... but for me, oanda is perfectly fine.

yea I'm pretty happy, of course I wish things were better for retail traders, but... at the same time I'm happy to be able to do it.
That's cool, so let's leave it there shall we, this is getting just a little bit repetitive and non-productive!

Good trading to you!
  • #367
  • May 19, 2010 4:18am May 19, 2010 4:18am
yea I'm cool with that.

good trading to you too.
  • #368
  • Edited 6:50am May 19, 2010 6:27am | Edited 6:50am
Did someone ever think to use lower and upper bounds(then you'll definitely have 0.9 pips spread)? Even for market orders, you can set them automatically and you won't have any slippage again. But if price moves a little then you won't have a fill either. That is what one-click orders are good for..
  • #369
  • May 19, 2010 6:51am May 19, 2010 6:51am
pipmuff, when you login to oanda you have to look at the chart automatically because the chart is implemented into their platform. So when you try to trade there your eyes also automatically stare at their charts even if it is for a slight of a second. Looking at their charts means you are using their charts. Funny guy.

And you are telling me that you don't have slippage at an ECN or any Metatrader bucketshop. You wanna tell me that you get the price you see on your screen although having a crappy ISP? Shrike has already mentioned slippage in his excel file (in favor, not in favor). Your facts are relying on hearsay and tired brain assumptions. "I think this, I guess that, ... , my fantasy island rocks, ...."

Where are you facts?

Oh yes, I forgot, I have to google it.

lol
  • #370
  • May 19, 2010 6:59am May 19, 2010 6:59am
Quoting pipmutt
I'm off to do some trading, have a great day all!

Where do you trade? At Google?
  • #371
  • May 19, 2010 7:29am May 19, 2010 7:29am
Quoting A_3
To quote pipmuff aka you: "Use Google"

lmao
And you add such valuable contribution to this thread.
  • #372
  • May 19, 2010 7:29am May 19, 2010 7:29am
Quoting A_3
Where do you trade? At Google?
More invaluable insight. Go take a walk jack ass!
  • #373
  • May 19, 2010 7:32am May 19, 2010 7:32am
Quoting A_3
pipmuff, when you login to oanda you have to look at the chart automatically because the chart is implemented into their platform. So when you try to trade there your eyes also automatically stare at their charts even if it is for a slight of a second. Looking at their charts means you are using their charts. Funny guy.

And you are telling me that you don't have slippage at an ECN or any Metatrader bucketshop. You wanna tell me that you get the price you see on your screen although having a crappy ISP?[b] Shrike has already mentioned slippage...
He didnt even explain how hed quantified those stats, let alone what they meant. Still im sure the fact that they were merely presented, without any kind of explanation of what they meant, & how they were comppiled, & how accurate they are, or, even if they are real at all - will satisify sheeple.

"Hey here are some stats in a spreadsheet!! I havent a clue what they are, what they mean etc. but they sure look nice & pretty!"
  • #374
  • May 19, 2010 7:35am May 19, 2010 7:35am
Quoting Pollux
Did someone ever think to use lower and upper bounds(then you'll definitely have 0.9 pips spread)? Even for market orders, you can set them automatically and you won't have any slippage again. But if price moves a little then you won't have a fill either. That is what one-click orders are good for..
But they require continual manual adjustment. Not feasible for most traders.

You wont definately have the 0.9 spread will you, unless you've set the bound to the current price.

This is no good for exits, cos regardless of slippage, you want out of a trade you no longer should be in.
  • #375
  • May 19, 2010 7:50am May 19, 2010 7:50am
Quoting jimbil
But they require continual manual adjustment. Not feasible for most traders.

You wont definately have the 0.9 spread will you, unless you've set the bound to the current price.

This is no good for exits, cos regardless of slippage, you want out of a trade you no longer should be in.
Yes, this is why I said that if you set them by default to 0 pips and if the price moved even for 0.1 pips you won't have a fill. But you can also set default trading size and trade with one click orders. I didn't try it, but if you're in a long position and sell the same amount, won't you have the buy order closed, since Oanda does not allow hedging? It's not comfortable, but we should admit that even on ECN with 0.1 pips spread for EUR/USD you'll encounter slippage (I would say a large one given the liquidity for that spread). I see on ATC spreads of 0.6 pips for euro$ but which is the amount of money you can buy/sell at that price? 1 million? maximum 2? Plus 0.8 pips commission = 1.4. Slippage is both on Oanda and any other broker so, unless news events, the first one is still the cheapest around.

Cheers
  • #376
  • May 19, 2010 7:58am May 19, 2010 7:58am
Its not just regarding oandas slippage when the 0.9 pips is in place. When oanda spread is 1.5 pips, i still suffered the oanda slippage "hidden tax", equal on average to over 1 pip per trade.

Therefore, when the oanda spread is 0.9 pips, the real terms spread is 2 pips.

When oanda spread is 1.5 pip, real terms spread is 2.5 pip etc etc.

SO OANDA DOES NOT HAVE THE TIGHEST SPREADS - IN REAL TRADING TERMS.

So you may as well find a broker offering fixed 2 pip spreads & segregated funds/client funds safety.
  • #377
  • May 19, 2010 8:10am May 19, 2010 8:10am
Quoting jimbil
He didnt even explain how hed quantified those stats
And how have you quantified your "stats"?

26 pages so far and all we have from you is "trust me" and from pipmutt, "Google is your friend".
  • #378
  • May 19, 2010 8:21am May 19, 2010 8:21am
Quoting jimbil
Its not just regarding oandas slippage when the 0.9 pips is in place. When oanda spread is 1.5 pips, i still suffered the oanda slippage "hidden tax", equal on average to over 1 pip per trade.

Therefore, when the oanda spread is 0.9 pips, the real terms spread is 2 pips.

When oanda spread is 1.5 pip, real terms spread is 2.5 pip etc etc.

SO OANDA DOES NOT HAVE THE TIGHEST SPREADS - IN REAL TRADING TERMS.

So you may as well find a broker offering fixed 2 pip spreads & segregated funds/client funds safety.
Again where are your facts that there is always an unfavorable slippage in place?

What is the slippage factor at other brokers including ECNs including commission?

And where is it claimed that Oanda has the tightest spreads?

There is no such thing as fixed spread. A broker who claims to have fixed spread is the real scam.

And you are a real idiot.
  • #379
  • May 19, 2010 8:24am May 19, 2010 8:24am
Quoting bugscoe
And how have you quantified your "stats"?

26 pages so far and all we have from you is "trust me" and from pipmutt, "Google is your friend".
I havent.

It is based on what i saw consistently happening in front of me on the screen over a long period of time. I trust my eyes. I trust my brain.
I have no incentive to quantify what i have stated, in the form of stats.

My messages have served as a warning to others here. If you were not aware of these issues before, if you understand the theory of the issues of what i have brought to your attention, you will all be able to see it for yourselfs.

Your need for stats & proof suggests to me that you havent grasped the full magnitude of this issue.

I have provided all the info i can on this subject. I posted it to help fellow traders. Ignore it at your peril. I have nothing more to add. Goodbye.
  • #380
  • Edited 11:45am May 19, 2010 8:26am | Edited 11:45am
The average spread at Oanda in EURUSD for example including the news spread is 1.17 pips.
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