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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #60,921
  • Apr 15, 2010 11:04am Apr 15, 2010 11:04am
Quoting 2010
Hello everyone,

I have been reading this thread for a month. I learn a lot from all helpers. Thank you all unselfish senior members.

Here is my question:
Different brokers have different system time, so that the data on charts is different. For daily charts, there is only slight difference; but on h4 charts, I think the difference is quite big.
The following 4h charts are from FXPro and AlpariUS.
Which broker's system time setting is more matching the market? Which broker do you recommend?

Thanks

Jason
FXPro for Daily TF closes. Alpari is fine for 4hr examination.

K.I.S.S.
  • #60,922
  • Edited 11:30am Apr 15, 2010 11:08am | Edited 11:30am
Quoting 2010
Hello everyone,

I have been reading this thread for a month. I learn a lot from all helpers. Thank you all unselfish senior members...
I've watched charts from every broker for the past 2 months just to find an answer to that question, and I've realized that the questions a bit pointless.

Its like trying to pick heads or tails on a coin flip, heads might come out 4x in a row, but just because heads came out a lot recently doesn't mean heads has +probability of being right.

From a personal experience, whenever I asked myself that question it was usually me getting impatient with myself for a trade.

So my opinion is to just stick to one broker until one gets "pro" because it'll even out eventually in matters of success and failure.
  • #60,923
  • Apr 15, 2010 11:19am Apr 15, 2010 11:19am
Quoting 2010
Hello everyone,

I have been reading this thread for a month. I learn a lot from all helpers. Thank you all unselfish senior members.

Here is my question:
Different brokers have different system time, so that the data on charts is different. For daily charts, there is only slight difference; but on h4 charts, I think the difference is quite big.
The following 4h charts are from FXPro and AlpariUS.
Which broker's system time setting is more matching the market? Which broker do you recommend?

Thanks

Jason
Hey Jason

Welcome

Since forex is not a centralized market there are no official times. So this means you can use any you want really. Remember these price bars are only an aggregation of price and as you will see ultimately location is everything and these price bars more become our trigger bars. I prefer a daily close near 5pm est(like fxpro as kiss says). But I personally watch a 4hr close for each of the 4 hours and have 4 mt4s running with that. I don't find one better then the other.

Hope that helps
Mike
  • #60,924
  • Apr 15, 2010 11:50am Apr 15, 2010 11:50am
I thought I'd share yesterdays trade on this pair which I don't think was discussed and share with you my difficulties and indiscipline in trade management.

I took the trade because:

 

  1. The small relatively poor pin was bouncing off an existing trend line;
  2. Trade with the trend
  3. off BRN (14700)
  4. 14700 is daily ppz
  5. pin and 14700 ppz has confluence with 61 fib from previous swing low and 25 EMA
  6. Pressure to close the Sunday gap at 14638

Against trade:

 

  1. Very small only just a pin
  2. To close the gap price will need to go through the strong weekly and daily resitance at BRN 14500

Based on the above:

 

  1. Entry at 14630 (10 point buffer below the Pin)
  2. SL 14729 (10 points above the PIN
  3. 1st TP set just above FTA at 14571
  4. 2nd TP set just above BRN 14500

Order to open at midnight GMT after daily close. I actually entered two orders at 14630 because I spread bet and its the only way to split a position. Each order 1% of account:

 

  1. Order 1 with Limit to TP at 14571 (59 points)
  2. Order 2 with Limit to TP at 14505 (125 points)
  3. R:R Order 1 = 0.6
  4. R;R Order 2 = 1.3

The R : R is purely given for information I rarely take this into account. I am highly selective - this is only my second trade this month.

The first order was filled yesterday with a profit of 59 points. I work full time and did not monitor this part of the trade.

The problem occured when I came home last evening and started monitoring how the second half of the trade was going on the 1M chart - big mistake! Price had retraced after filling my first oder and I moved my SL to BE. I'm now in a free trade. I watched price hovering around the 14600 falling below the climbing back up above and I managed to convince myself that the 14600 was going to hold. I closed off the second - now free trade at 14595 pleased that I had manged to find a low below 14600 and gain another 35 pips. Total pips gained 94.

Well of course today the trade has gone as originally planned and hit the original TP target of 14505 and additional 90 pips more!!

I am actually quite pleased about this because if that 14600 support had held it would have convinced me that my poor trade management was the right thing to do!

Moral of story?? Have confidence. If the analysis is sound there should be no reson to change the plan.

I will in future refrain from micro managing my day trades particularly when they have reach "free trade" status. Just let price take care of itself.

Don't know if anyone else has been here?

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Spot FX EUR_AUD (15-APR-10).png Size: 15 KB
  • #60,925
  • Apr 15, 2010 11:53am Apr 15, 2010 11:53am
Thank you guys!
Quoting KissFan
FXPro for Daily TF closes. Alpari is fine for 4hr examination.

K.I.S.S.
thanks Kiss. I like your ID, and I like james16 K.I.S.S thread very much.

Quoting badhairday
I've watched charts from every broker for the past 2 months just to find an answer to that question, and I've realized that the questions a bit pointless.
....
So my opinion is to just stick to one broker until one gets "pro" because it'll even out eventually in matters of success and failure.
thank you badhairday, good point. It's hard to say one is better than the other.
  • #60,926
  • Apr 15, 2010 11:54am Apr 15, 2010 11:54am
Quoting mbqb11
Since forex is not a centralized market there are no official times. So this means you can use any you want really. Remember these price bars are only an aggregation of price and as you will see ultimately location is everything and these price bars more become our trigger bars. I prefer a daily close near 5pm est(like fxpro as kiss says). But I personally watch a 4hr close for each of the 4 hours and have 4 mt4s running with that. I don't find one better then the other.

Hope that helps
Mike
Thanks Mike.
Totally agree with you. My broker closes around 5pm est (but they offer ugly chart), so that the daily mt4 chart that closes at 5pm is a good choice. IMO For 4hr chart, comparing with few different brokers' chart helps avoiding bad set ups.
  • #60,927
  • Apr 15, 2010 12:36pm Apr 15, 2010 12:36pm
Quoting shauns1966
I thought I'd share yesterdays trade on this pair which I don't think was discussed and share with you my difficulties and indiscipline in trade management.

I took the trade because:

 

  1. The small relatively poor pin was bouncing off an existing trend line;
  2. Trade with the trend
  3. off BRN (14700)
  4. 14700 is daily ppz
  5. pin and 14700 ppz has confluence with 61 fib from previous swing low and 25 EMA
  6. Pressure to close the Sunday gap at 14638

Against trade:
[list][*]Very small only just a pin[*]To close the gap price will...

Don't worry, i did the exact same thing, but with the full position. I saw price reaching FTA, moved stop to BE and then got scared of the move up watching H4 and closed for 0.1R. A trade which now would have been 1.xR.

But hey, we're here to learn. Taking positions on dailies should be managed on dailies, like every senior here says. But until you make the mistake, it doesn't sink in.
  • #60,928
  • Apr 15, 2010 12:39pm Apr 15, 2010 12:39pm
Quoting shauns1966
I thought I'd share yesterdays trade on this pair which I don't think was discussed and share with you my difficulties and indiscipline in trade management.

I took the trade because:

 

  1. The small relatively poor pin was bouncing off an existing trend line;
  2. Trade with the trend
  3. off BRN (14700)
  4. 14700 is daily ppz
  5. pin and 14700 ppz has confluence with 61 fib from previous swing low and 25 EMA
  6. Pressure to close the Sunday gap at 14638

Against trade:
[list][*]Very small only just a pin[*]To close the gap price will...

nicely thought out pre and post trade analysis thanks for sharing Shaun!
  • #60,929
  • Apr 15, 2010 2:18pm Apr 15, 2010 2:18pm
Quoting mbqb11
nicely thought out pre and post trade analysis thanks for sharing Shaun!
Thanks Mike. I know I'm on the right path. Finding and selecting good trades, identifying FTA's etc is not a problem once you have had enough chart time. I'm past the stage of always wanting to be in the market and trading for the sake of it and I've even managed to get over a problem with "pulling the trigger"

The real key to all this is sticking to the rules! I'm pretty sure that getting the psychology right is the last hurdle for me to becoming a successful trader. Yesterday was an important lesson!

Thanks again!
  • #60,930
  • Apr 15, 2010 2:23pm Apr 15, 2010 2:23pm
Quoting neutro
Don't worry, i did the exact same thing, but with the full position. I saw price reaching FTA, moved stop to BE and then got scared of the move up watching H4 and closed for 0.1R. A trade which now would have been 1.xR.

But hey, we're here to learn. Taking positions on dailies should be managed on dailies, like every senior here says. But until you make the mistake, it doesn't sink in.

Thanks ffor that Neutro it's good to know I'm not alone. You're absolutely right about learning and this was a good lesson that I will not forget. You're dead right about having to make the mistakes for it to really sink in:

I hear, I forget

I see, I remember,

I do, and finally I understand!
  • #60,931
  • Apr 15, 2010 2:32pm Apr 15, 2010 2:32pm
great article on day trading, and also applies to longer term:

Do not overtrade. Some people erroneously believe that day traders have to take a lot of trades. That is not true! You should take high quality trades, and keep out of the market if your entry conditions are not met. I take at most ONE trade each day. For example, in February I made 39% return on my capital and took just 14 trades. The leverage on futures trading is such that just one or two trades can give you an excellent monthly return, so why look for more? You need to be honest with yourself - are you looking for profits, or are you more interested in "action"? If you are addicted to the action, you are not a serious day trader.

Have a plan. Day trading requires quick decisions. Sometimes you have to react to market situations within seconds. There is no time to mull over decisions, consider what has happened in the past, and agonize over your next step. You must have a plan which tells you precisely when you will enter a trade, what size position you will take, where your stop will be placed, how you will manage the trade, and when and where you will exit. I use a software control panel to specify each element of my plan, but if you do not have automation you must clearly write down all elements of your strategy and LEARN them so that you react instinctively to any market situation.

Implement the plan flawlessly. Good plans are simple. They get you into high probability trades so that over time you have a statistical edge in the market which leads to profit. Good day traders implement the same simple plan day after day. Perfect execution is vital. You would be surprised how many traders fall down in this regard. They miss a signal. They press a wrong button and find themselves long when they should be short. They make an ad hoc decision to move a stop loss, even though it is not part of their plan. They grab a quick profit even though the profit target in the plan has not been met. Suppose you are risking 2.5% of your capital for a 7.5% gain and you make a mistake giving you a loser instead of a win. That is a 10% swing in your monthly return! Even if you just miss the trade, it is a 7.5% swing. One or two errors in a month has a huge impact on performance. That is why novice traders trading exactly the same strategy often achieve widely different results. I use software to achieve perfect execution of my plan, but if you do not have automation you must PRACTICE implementing your plan until it is second nature, and DISCIPLINE yourself to resist all temptations to stray from your strategy.

Have patience. Things sometimes seem to happen slowly even for a day trader. You may not get a trade for a few days. You may have a string of three or four losing trades and be in a "drawdown" for a few weeks. If you are addicted to trading action, these periods will be excruciating. Too many people become day traders not because, as I believe, it is less risky, but because they get more opportunities to trade. If you find yourself watching each tick of the market as your trade progresses, you are probably not exercising the discipline and patience required to succeed. If you make a 10% return on your capital each month and allow your capital to compound, you will triple your capital in a year. This is so far in excess of what most businesses have to offer that you really should keep your eye on the big picture and avoid trying to rush the process. I use software to trade for me and am not even aware when the trading takes place. If you do not have automation, you must cultivate the self discipline to walk away from the trading screen as soon as you have done whatever your plan requires you to do. Trading should be a small part of your life providing you the wherewithal to live as you wish - do not let it become your life!
  • #60,932
  • Apr 15, 2010 4:48pm Apr 15, 2010 4:48pm
I haven't played an IPB yet. Any thoughts on the one forming on the Cable. Its tight up against a daily ppz around the 15500.

Any comments?
  • #60,933
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:05pm Apr 15, 2010 5:05pm
Anyone like to comment on Daily IPB AUD/USD ?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: IPB.jpg Size: 190 KB
  • #60,934
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:20pm Apr 15, 2010 5:20pm
Quoting shauns1966
I haven't played an IPB yet. Any thoughts on the one forming on the Cable. Its tight up against a daily ppz around the 15500.

Any comments?
I like it. The IPB is good sized, it is up against the 1.5500 level, the first touch of this level since Feb 23rd (so you would think some sell orders would still be in place here).

The down side is the space (been flat the entire week and the close was 5 pips higher than the open (on my feed)).

I am going to give it a shot. Maybe I am not being picky enough with this type of bar.
  • #60,935
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:36pm Apr 15, 2010 5:36pm
Quoting unlv_tj
I like it. The IPB is good sized, it is up against the 1.5500 level, the first touch of this level since Feb 23rd (so you would think some sell orders would still be in place here).

The down side is the space (been flat the entire week and the close was 5 pips higher than the open (on my feed)).

I am going to give it a shot. Maybe I am not being picky enough with this type of bar.
I am still a learner.. I guess that is a continution bar since it is already at swing high.
  • #60,936
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:41pm Apr 15, 2010 5:41pm
Quoting unlv_tj
I like it. The IPB is good sized, it is up against the 1.5500 level, the first touch of this level since Feb 23rd (so you would think some sell orders would still be in place here).

The down side is the space (been flat the entire week and the close was 5 pips higher than the open (on my feed)).

I am going to give it a shot. Maybe I am not being picky enough with this type of bar.


Thanks for that unilv_tj Still 20 mins to closure in UK and its currently closing 8 pips down on the open. I'll let you know how it closes at midnight. I've also got some divergence on MACD. Not sure whether to play it or not. Have you seen the BEOB / DBHLC on the EUR JPY.

What do you think?
  • #60,937
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:42pm Apr 15, 2010 5:42pm
Quoting cprao
I am still a learner.. I guess that is a continution bar since it is already at swing high.
I am still learning as well. I think a continuation bar, would be a bar to tell you the trend will continue. The short term trend is up. I am playing USDGBP short, due to the IPB. So not really a continuation, as much as either a reverse (short term trend reversal) or a pull back and move back down of the longer term down trend.
  • #60,938
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:45pm Apr 15, 2010 5:45pm
Quoting shauns1966
Thanks for that unilv_tj Still 20 mins to closure in UK and its currently closing 8 pips down on the open. I'll let you know how it closes at midnight. I've also got some divergence on MACD. Not sure whether to play it or not. Have you seen the BEOB / DBHLC on the EUR JPY.

What do you think?
The EURJPY looks like a decent play, depends how it closes for you. My daily closed 45 minutes ago. And there was a tail on the EURJPY bar that kept it from being a good looking BEOB to me.

If it closed lower (stronger), I would probably be all over this one as well. I will look for shorts on the 4H, due to the near BEOB on the daily.
  • #60,939
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:48pm Apr 15, 2010 5:48pm
Quoting cprao
I am still a learner.. I guess that is a continution bar since it is already at swing high.

Hi Cprao

This is a reversal bar. If you look at posts from Ghous over the last couple of weeks they are explained. He plays them entering on the close of the bar with a tight stop.

I think they need some careful management. Not sure I will trade it might just demo
  • #60,940
  • Apr 15, 2010 5:50pm Apr 15, 2010 5:50pm
Quoting 4X=0
great article on day trading, and also applies to longer term
Hey 4X=0,

Just wanted to remind you that you should probably cite this or give credit to whoever wrote it.

Have a great day,

Cory
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