james16 Chart Thread

my charts talk to me & i listen
what im looking at now.....do we make a tripple top @ 91.50 and bounce back or do we break through and make higher high
i really dont know, all im doing is reacting to what the mkt does.....we might not even make it there & reverse..... (need rac's crystal ball....lol)
ill act according or ill just watching
forexxxxxxxxx

That's a good point. Will keep that in mind. ATM just watching and wating.

Today i was at college all day long and i came home now and i looked at my trade on EURUSD. I couldnt believe that this take profit wasnt triggered!!!

Just look at the picture ... (im not angry because this trade was on demo account, i was just testing if the 150EMA )

Don't forget about the spread factor........price actually has to go below your Take Profit by whatever spread you get from your broker. For instance, if your Take Profit order was 1.4300 price needs to get to 1.4298 if your spread is 2 pips.

Nathan

yeah i didnt think about that

Hi Mike,

Not sure you'll read this but I thought I'd ask anyway.

I remember reading on the thread about how new traders go through a series of stages, like stages of development.

Can you expand on that?

P

Just to see if I have a developmental delay!

phew that would be a huge rant. I wish I could find a post of mine and also another post someone made(may have been diallist) about this topic.

Basically the stages are huge and numerous but I will try to be brief and general.

Most people start of green as the grass, trying everything under the sun. Putting every indicator on the chart etc. I am going to skip this rant b/c if you are here reading this I believe you are past that or close to it.

Then comes the absorption period. Reading and reading and just learning. But learning is not doing. But this phase is absolutly necessary. The need to learn and knowing there is MORE out there. This is usually when we first say. Sh%t. There is more to this then I thought. Maybe I better buckle up. This is hugely important. Many are at this stage reading this thread. I know this part, it is exciting, yet very straining.

Then comes the action part. You start to put the pieces together. Not in a very coherent way. This is usually the person(keep in context of this thread), who sits down opens their chart at their convenience, sees any old pinbar(b/c hey I read a few pages about it over at j16) and fires off. They might win they might lose. This person is ahead of the very first stage, but they still have no idea how much more work comes in.

Remember each stage lasts very different for each person. Sometimes we move up and down the ladder too, not uncommon. Next is the stage where the "trader" from above says "wow there is more then just finding a pin". They scratch their heads, get fed up usually. Try not to believe it. Maybe even go back to some fancy indicator. Leave price for awhile but if smart enough return to realize for hopefully the last time. There is NO holy grail and it still takes work(see having a business mentality). This person gets back to studying, digging deeper. Re-reading material that they see some glimmer of light from.

Now that trader gets back to it. They start to develop a PLAN. WHOO! This person I am very excited for b/c you gave yourself a chance. They realize this is a game of probabilities, they need money mgmt, get their head right, and have some method to the madness. This can be a very very long stage. Most people it is. Some get lucky and fast track this to some profitable trading. I think of this as the b/e stage.

The stages beyond this differ. Some people just need to fix a few things(usually mental) to get things right. Some just are over trading, not being patient(which funny enough I just wrote a little "rant" over on the PF maybe I will post in supplement to this). ETC etc. This stage continues with learning, we never stop learning and growing and developing as a trader. Some will get to this point(or at each stage), realize it wasn't what they expected and quit. No big deal. This isn't life and death. If you gave yourself a chance and decide it isn't for you, there are a million other things out there I am sure you can and will be great at. I could prob go on and on here about different things, but I think you get the idea.

This is extremely rough idea of what "stages" their are. I just type what I have on my mind so I probably will come back and add somethings or take away. I just wanted to give you something to chew on.

Mike

I make one good trade. Then I'm taken over by enthusiasm and I make 3 bad trades.

Thank God I'm on demo.

ok man some people are going to want to punch me b/c I know my rants are long. But I will post this other one I just made today. This was the patience one I said I put in the PF.

Please remember these are just my thoughts and don't take anything personal anyone.


_____________________________

I probably will go over a few topics that are almost psychological and I will preface them all by saying. If you have not yet spent a great deal of time in fijis corner, you are doing yourself the biggest disfavor I know. Most people think once you have the tools you can become a good trader. This is false. The tools are one component. It is not a myth that so many people you probably look up to say things like "it is what is b/w your ears that stops so many" or "I knew what to do for so long but I got in my own way" etc etc.

So I can just tell you be patient but what does that mean. Well I will talk about my own patience and how my trading evolved.

I can remember a point where I was more or less breaking even with certain things. It was very frustrating to have good days followed by bad days, and Friday would come and I would be no better off then Monday. Deep down I knew it was my lack of patience. A decent setup would appear(based on my methods at the time) and I would trade it. I knew it wasn't the best but thought it was good enough. It probably still was good enough. The problem is when you take enough of the "decent" setups that two things happen.

1. You mismanage these trades and you end up taking more losers. What I mean is that while the trades might still be good enough for some, you still have to manage them properly. I believe at the time I wasn't good enough to do this.

2. The variance of losing/winning comes in. What happens is maybe in the long run taking these decent trades you can come out on top, but the short term variance of losing is so psychologically detrimental that I found it not worth it.

Losing traders always ask me if I had to do it ALL over again what would I do. Part of me always wants to say I would do everything the same. Because the journey no matter how rough or bad some of it was , was still what makes you who you are. But of course if I could go all the way back I wish I would do certain things different. One of the biggest things I wish I could have understood is how RIDICULOUSLY important patience is. When you sit down and if you feel any butterflies feelings of I HAVE TO BE IN, anything like that you are simply not in the right state of mind. This makes you short term results oriented. IMO this is a bad thing. Now of course we are human and are feelings will come out(they still do for me, I am not going to lie). But there is a difference when you get to the point that you recognize it and shake it off fast, vs someone who is just so high on trading it distracts them from what their bigger goals should be(or even might be).

So maybe that is all repetitive, and I think to some degree there will be people reading this saying, "yeah I need to stop doing this or that, and tighten the screws". But the fact was for me until I literally said I WILL BE MORE PATIENT. And had it as the priority every time I sat down I was not. I still believe I need to be more patient and picky. Many of you know I don't trade a very large account yet. I am fine with this as my goals are treating this as a business and planning for the future. I want to be prepared for the days when my account is huge. I think everything James say is true and have experienced it even with my growth. So are you preparing for your future? Or are you still doing things to stunt your growth. If you know the answer then ACT on the answer. Sure it isn't instantaneous but I guarantee you will see improvement and you build from there.

I cringe sometimes when I see some people doing the same things over and over. They will then come back and say I KNOW I NEED TO DO XYZ. Yet they continue to not. I always say you either beat yourself up long enough and quit or you beat yourself up and change. Even small changes are better then none. I get the must psyched when those few people msg me about how they are now battling with the fact they have gotten so picky. The reason being is b/c I know they have a chance at this. B/C sure they wont be increasing their accounts by wild % every month, but they can grow that way. It is very hard not to make money on the very best bars. I think most of us agree on that. So why doesn't everyone losing build from that point?

So why am I talking about this now. Well a lot has to do with the last few months, both for my trading and others. When holidays run around we can usually trade less(which is what almost every trader I respect I see do), or we continue to trade just to trade. Then after the holidays we have that urge to get back in it. Believe me I do. I almost feel lazy from the holidays, sluggish from all the beer and food. But just pulling the trigger doesn't equate to the +EV we are looking for in the long run. Pulling the trigger to our methods will. My goal for this year, to become even more picky. Will i sacrifice ROI%. Most definitely. I did last year, and the year before. But will I gain a lot more for the future of my business? I know I will.

So are you being patient?

ok now I am winded and sick of myself for a bit

lol - don't be - two valuable insights - unbelievably helpful, and obviously reaped from determined experience - appreciate...

Thanks for answering Mike.

I guess right now I'm still in the phase of controlling impulsive trading and learning the basics. This thread has convinced me that s/r and PA are the fundamentals. Infact even though I'm an absolute beginner I had a few good trades too.

There is one importnat aspect of this chart that I'm not sure has been highlighted. As you read the post you actually get to witness traders in the making, from their embryonal stage to their stages of success. These are the guys that keep me motivated, give me the strength to wake up early and read more or stay a little later even if I'm exhausted.

They are common mortals that have made it, making us believe that it is within our reach!

So to all of you guys who have made it and still take the time to post, a big THANKS from the heart.

P

(Ooops sorry if that was too long)

Neither did i

Again thanks Mike.

I will definitely try develop patience to the best of my ability.

Thanks very much, Mike. I am trying to grow my patience now, so your post really helps.

ha you dont have to !

Thank you for your insights, this two posts should be added to the summary.

And guess what ? reading your stuff i see myself and thats the best part of it.

You see how someone went through all this and you see your own way.

Keep this two posts and the thoughts in mind, stick to the script and someday you will trade like 2-3 times a month and spend the rest of the time with the most important things in your life, whatever these may be.

Superb posts Mike. Thank you also from me.

I haven't seen anyone describe the stages of becoming a trader before; usually its one of two camps either noobies or seniors/expert/profitable. Really helpful.

on ibfx i have a 100 pip spike and retrace on one minute candle on gbpnzd does anyone else have this with a different broker

You guys dont know how lucky you are - Mikerants are rarer than... something really rare. The Hope Diamond, four leaf clovers, girls as hot as Kate Beckinsale, etc.

...

This was my framework i made for a friend who wanted to 'learn daytrading'

retard - me click buttan on interwebs 4 PiPz!@#
newbie - read books/forums, get headache
learner - misapply things they read, lose money, blame everyone

--------most people stop here and system hop-------------

losing trader - knows a little but misses the big picture
breakeven trader - knows how, but still doesnt have all the pieces
winning trader - understands how to apply correctly

---------people who are happy trading systems stagnate here---------

ninja trader - tailors rules to the environment
scholar - understands why, as well as how.. uses concepts, not rules
teacher
Master

----------------------

Jim, Johnny 5.