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Pivot strategy for newbies

  • #1
  • First Post: Dec 27, 2009 2:34am Dec 27, 2009 2:34am
I understand that trends should be established on the daily chart. How far into the past is relevent?
If using the 5 minute or 15 minute chart and a set up is not on, how often do you check the charts ie hourly?
If the trade goes against you should you cut and run or ride out the storm and back your stop loss?
  • #2
  • Dec 27, 2009 3:50am Dec 27, 2009 3:50am
Quoting The Chis
I understand that trends should be established on the daily chart. How far into the past is relevent?
If using the 5 minute or 15 minute chart and a set up is not on, how often do you check the charts ie hourly?
If the trade goes against you should you cut and run or ride out the storm and back your stop loss?
Seems to me that you are convinced that time plays a factor in a trend. you might be right.... or might not be. What is to say you shouldn't look for a trend on the century chart or the million-year chart?
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #3
  • Dec 27, 2009 6:49am Dec 27, 2009 6:49am
Surely you bet with the trend?
I didn't fully understand your comment?
  • #4
  • Dec 27, 2009 7:14am Dec 27, 2009 7:14am
Your much better off trading what the trend is currently doing, ie M1 21EMA is my primary trend then as the move establishes push this out further. ( 55ema, 200ema, 500ema ) to catch bigger moves.


What happened yesterday will have no bearing as to what's going to happen over the next 30mins
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #5
  • Dec 28, 2009 3:43am Dec 28, 2009 3:43am
Quoting The Chis
Surely you bet with the trend?
I didn't fully understand your comment?
Let me answer you by asking some questions.

question 1 : what is a trend?

question 2 : consider the following chart 'trends'...

1min - trend up
5min - trend down
10min - trend up
30min - trend down
1hr - trend up
1day - trend down
1week - trend up
1month - trend down
1year - trend up
1decade - trend down
1century - trend up
1millenium - trend down
....
......
........
......... and so on

question 2, part a) at what point do you stop zooming-out

part b) explain your reasoning to (a)

part c) based on the above chart 'trend' data what is the current 'trend' ?

---

I'm not suggesting that there isn't something important about time. I'm suggesting that perhaps time is not important, or perhaps it is... or perhaps it is something else entirely. You do not need to reply with actual answers (of course), but if you think about the questions then it may give you things to think about that expand your perspective a little.

down the rabbit hole we go.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #6
  • Dec 28, 2009 4:52am Dec 28, 2009 4:52am
The Actual Time is more important cause at a certain times the market is quite likely to reverse direction or have a big move start.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #7
  • Dec 28, 2009 5:12am Dec 28, 2009 5:12am
Quoting Turveyd
The Actual Time is more important cause at a certain times the market is quite likely to reverse direction or have a big move start.
true that, but again this could imply an hourly perspective... does this then matter to someone looking at daily or weekly's ? it's all perspective. in those cases one might look more to financial news events expected on whatever day etc as their lighthouses in the dark stormy seas. this still follows what you just said in that in this case the important Actual Time is more a particular 'day'.

perspective.

this comes back to what tweaked me in the first place about this thread...

Quote
I understand that trends should be established on the daily chart.
... says who? And why? What perspective is this under, and does this then follow anything relevant, or relevant to the OP. It's all well-and-good to follow good advice, as long as it is good advice. It's far better to understand why it's good advice and if it applies to the circumstances of the individual.

"it's a good idea to do vigorous exercise for 30 mins each day to maintain a healthy body" - yes, unless the individual has a weak heart and would die following this ideal.

One should understand the perspective and the situation they find themselves in. Words that the original post conjure in my mind are "blind leading blind" and "kool-aid". I'm open to being wrong, but this is the feelings I get from what was posted.

This is not in any form an attack on anyone, more-so thoughts to consider in ones journey of discovery.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #8
  • Dec 28, 2009 5:22pm Dec 28, 2009 5:22pm
Quoting nubcake
Let me answer you by asking some questions.

question 1 : what is a trend?

question 2 : consider the following chart 'trends'...

1min - trend up
5min - trend down
10min - trend up
30min - trend down
1hr - trend up
1day - trend down
1week - trend up
1month - trend down
1year - trend up
1decade - trend down
1century - trend up
1millenium - trend down
....
......
........
......... and so on

question 2, part a) at what point do you stop zooming-out

part b) explain your reasoning to (a)

part c) based on the above chart 'trend' data what is the...
serious question
Do you actually make a living or better out of trading?
  • #9
  • Dec 28, 2009 7:49pm Dec 28, 2009 7:49pm
Quoting nubcake
true that, but again this could imply an hourly perspective... does this then matter to someone looking at daily or weekly's ?...
Well said that man, the BAD Logic being passed around here as good logic and facts and this is the only way to do it is well BAD!!

Daily chart is just viewing tick data with a arbitrary end and start time and recording High / Low / Close / Open data thats all, nothing magic or predictive about it infact you can find different charts with different start and end times for the D1 chart which makes reading them pointless.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #10
  • Dec 28, 2009 8:44pm Dec 28, 2009 8:44pm
Pivot points are useful. But like any other indicators, they produce lot of false signals leading to bad trades

For example: yesterday the price in eur/usd crossed pivot from above in asian session and now it is expected that price will test support 1.

But price did fell by 20 pips and after that it again crossed pivot from above to test resistance 1.
  • #11
  • Dec 28, 2009 10:24pm Dec 28, 2009 10:24pm
Quoting The Chis
I understand that trends should be established on the daily chart. How far into the past is relevent?
If using the 5 minute or 15 minute chart and a set up is not on, how often do you check the charts ie hourly?
If the trade goes against you should you cut and run or ride out the storm and back your stop loss?
1. The trend you handle depends on which chart you trade off of. I know very successful traders who trade from the 1 min. chart. Another that uses daily charts and enter 1 time each week. Both are in the 6 figure incomes. One will see an uptrend the other a down.

2. I use 5 min charts a lot. I sit at my computer for Four hours at a time. If I have no entry none are taken. At the end of my trading session I turn the computer off and walk away. Open positions are given a trailing stop.

3. I NEVER ride out a storm. I have a fixed amount I am willing to risk and if that is hit I am out of the position.

Hope this helps. If you have other questions don't hesitate to ask.

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #12
  • Dec 29, 2009 6:01am Dec 29, 2009 6:01am
Quoting The Chis
serious question
Do you actually make a living or better out of trading?
Serious answer. No. I'm on the journey of discovery, but on the journey I don't drink the coloured water some are offering and instead try to find my own supply. I think a lot of people are trying desperately to make order of something that does not have order... to make sense of something that makes no sense... to create rules for something that has no rules.

Forex is a beast far different to stocks. In stocks there is the possibility of perhaps seeing some crowd psychology, or seeing a great opportunity to purchase into a brilliant company about to become extremely valuable. With forex you have to have some pretty big balls to think you can judge what the WORLD is going to do with a currency. I don't think the world even has a say anyway, and it is likely to be a select few going about their daily business which is creating the forex beast.

forex is a puzzle that i want to crack, and if / when i crack it money will flow from the skies and pure gold will form beneath my feet. in the meantime it is a case of discovering how to walk in an upside-down back-to-front inside-out negaverse... and it sure is interesting sometimes, other times crazy and frustrating.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #13
  • Dec 29, 2009 6:11am Dec 29, 2009 6:11am
Quoting Turveyd
Well said that man, the BAD Logic being passed around here as good logic and facts and this is the only way to do it is well BAD!!

Daily chart is just viewing tick data with a arbitrary end and start time and recording High / Low / Close / Open data thats all, nothing magic or predictive about it infact you can find different charts with different start and end times for the D1 chart which makes reading them pointless.
agreed para1

agreed para2... it is hard to see the forest for the trees. to put forth the idea to people of offsetting a chart by even 30 seconds is surely a door opening to great revelations about what a chart is and isn't and what beliefs they may have which make less than zero sense.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #14
  • Dec 29, 2009 9:32am Dec 29, 2009 9:32am
Quoting nubcake

forex is a puzzle that i want to crack, and if / when i crack it money will flow from the skies and pure gold will form beneath my feet. in the meantime it is a case of discovering how to walk in an upside-down back-to-front inside-out negaverse... and it sure is interesting sometimes, other times crazy and frustrating.

That's my opinion right there, Forex is a puzzle I like puzzles hence my interest in cracking it, not just the making millions but that would be nice to

Have yourself a V for good logic there!!
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #15
  • Dec 29, 2009 9:33am Dec 29, 2009 9:33am
Quoting nubcake
agreed para1

agreed para2... it is hard to see the forest for the trees. to put forth the idea to people of offsetting a chart by even 30 seconds is surely a door opening to great revelations about what a chart is and isn't and what beliefs they may have which make less than zero sense.
Sadly, most people are of average intelligence and average intelligence just doesn't really cut it in this game.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #16
  • Dec 29, 2009 9:49am Dec 29, 2009 9:49am
Quoting nubcake
Serious answer. No. I'm on the journey of discovery, but on the journey I don't drink the coloured water some are offering and instead try to find my own supply. I think a lot of people are trying desperately to make order of something that does not have order... to make sense of something that makes no sense... to create rules for something that has no rules.

Forex is a beast far different to stocks. In stocks there is the possibility of perhaps seeing some crowd psychology, or seeing a great opportunity to purchase into a brilliant company about...

Truer words couldn't have been said. I am reading a book now on how and why central banks were formed. Last night I was just pissed off. You and I are pawns in this global economic game. They say it is for the good of the people for each decision that is made. Economic disasters, wars, etc. can all be traced back to these poor decisions by a select few. Yet here we are a pawn in the largest financial game the world has ever seen. But the pawn still has enough power to take the king. Here is a pip for you. Take millions more.

Rufus
Illegitimi non carborundum - Noli pati a scelestis opprimi.
  • #17
  • Dec 30, 2009 5:36am Dec 30, 2009 5:36am
Quoting Turveyd
Sadly, most people are of average intelligence and average intelligence just doesn't really cut it in this game.
I think perhaps there is a lot of misdirection and sensory overload for most people (or all, until they realise a few things and have had time to learn and discover). With a hundred billboards around you giving all kinds of various information how does one stand a chance of ever noticing that one little piece of paper crumpled in the corner with the key to all understanding written on it?

...

oh lol. the V... been drinkin a few V drinks lately. did not understand what you meant at first. cheers for that, now that i understand lol.

...

is this fight club? am i jack, and each night i sleep a little earlier and wake a little later... and during sleep i become tyler durden / turveyd, creating chaos in the anesthetized world of the forex trading universe?

...

rufus, if your previous post was you angry then goddamn you must be mellow as buddha!

oh, and slip that pip right in my g-string yo >)
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
  • #18
  • Jan 5, 2010 5:52am Jan 5, 2010 5:52am
I am thinking to move to weekly pivot trading with 1-3 trades per week.

Daily pivot trading is good but the problem is market does not exactly stop at that support or resistance.
  • #19
  • Jan 5, 2010 6:54am Jan 5, 2010 6:54am
Quoting nubcake


is this fight club? am i jack, and each night i sleep a little earlier and wake a little later... and during sleep i become tyler durden / turveyd, creating chaos in the anesthetized world of the forex trading universe?
Whats the first rule of fight club again ???


SSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #20
  • Last Post: Jan 5, 2010 7:15am Jan 5, 2010 7:15am
Quoting Rufus
They say it is for the good of the people for each decision that is made. Economic disasters, wars, etc. can all be traced back to these poor decisions by a select few. Yet here we are a pawn in the largest financial game the world has ever seen. But the pawn still has enough power to take the king. Here is a pip for you. Take millions more.

Rufus
Agreed! Except for the pawn having enough power...we can dream but I think the powers that be have this right on lock down ... they want us to think that money is the only thing needed to feel like a king, but that is personal opinion. Central banks/corporations all know that power is the real currency, not paper
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