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Andrews Pitchfork (Median Line)

  • #621
  • Oct 22, 2009 6:09am Oct 22, 2009 6:09am
Hello PeterE

in the above comparison charts, did you use the basic 60-15-5 TRIX ? Due to your helpful comment I have been reading the TRIX manual and wanted to try this as a confirmation.

most " eaglets " or some at least seem to use the royst indicator instaed of the basic 60-15-5, or gleneagle seems to post charts if he does mostly with a 240-15-5 TRIX.

is this only recommended for experienced users, and have you tried the different versions ?

Once again thanks !
Be like water.
  • #622
  • Oct 22, 2009 7:16am Oct 22, 2009 7:16am
Hi PeterE....

trying this out without an ML indicator. I heard that there is a period converter for Metatrader that allows for 20 min.

MT5 will have that as a new feature too.
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Be like water.
  • #623
  • Oct 22, 2009 9:20am Oct 22, 2009 9:20am
Peter...could you please show where your P0 anchor originated from on this red formation.

Quoting PeterE
the red ML is what i like to call a "what if" ML because it is in its infancy due to not having many confirmations at the MLs, . . . . this also means it is higher risk
Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
  • #624
  • Edited 6:10pm Oct 22, 2009 4:17pm | Edited 6:10pm
the trix meter u can c is (from top dn) 5.15.30.60 space 240

i use the roy 05 meter, which is the one glen uses, i havent used the others

Quoting msmarple
Hello PeterE

in the above comparison charts, did you use the basic 60-15-5 TRIX ? Due to your helpful comment I have been reading the TRIX manual and wanted to try this as a confirmation.

most " eaglets " or some at least seem to use the royst indicator instaed of the basic 60-15-5, or gleneagle seems to post charts if he does mostly with a 240-15-5 TRIX.

is this only recommended for experienced users, and have you tried the different versions ?

Once again thanks !
  • #625
  • Oct 22, 2009 4:19pm Oct 22, 2009 4:19pm
period converter here
http://www.marketgeometry.com/?s=MT4&x=0&y=0

Quoting msmarple
Hi PeterE....

trying this out without an ML indicator. I heard that there is a period converter for Metatrader that allows for 20 min.

MT5 will have that as a new feature too.
  • #626
  • Oct 22, 2009 4:25pm Oct 22, 2009 4:25pm
the high (91.07) at 15.20 GMT

Quoting Scrutch
Peter...could you please show where your P0 anchor originated from on this red formation.
  • #627
  • Oct 22, 2009 10:14pm Oct 22, 2009 10:14pm
2 things that have aided my use of MLs are:

1] i have a very clear idea of the patterns i am looking for
2] for each pair i have 3 identical 20min charts sitting on my desktop and on each chart i draw 1 or 2 of the different ML configurations i have found for that pair

Drawing a variety of ML configurations on 3 different charts means i'm not crowding one chart with a variety of ML set-ups and importantly, because i have a number of ML set-up options, i am not focused on one ML set and therefore not "imagining" that this or that should happen.

Rather, with a variety of ML sets sitting in front of me I just wait for price to tell me which ML it has found frequency with.
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  • #628
  • Oct 22, 2009 10:15pm Oct 22, 2009 10:15pm
USDJPY 20min
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  • #629
  • Oct 23, 2009 2:32am Oct 23, 2009 2:32am
Hello Peter,

yes, thats a very good idea with 3 charts. I noticed already that once i look on a ML configuration i get so convinced that it is difficult to simply admit that a) I`ve drawn it the wrong way or b) PA is going its own way and I might simply not have enough experience to understand that....

Thanks for the period converter.

On your charts I noticed parallel lines going all through the chart - are these already preconfigured or from older ML studies ?

I have found an indicator drawing ML ( Andr. / Schiff / catalin ), but I still couldnt apply it to my charts.

One has to define some input levels before it shows up, but obviously I am too dumb for that.....

Anyway, thanks and have a successful end of week :-)
Be like water.
  • #630
  • Oct 23, 2009 4:18am Oct 23, 2009 4:18am
MT4 ML indicator and the custom version are not very easy to use when compared to the one i use on Fib Trader or Ensign (no offense to the custom coder). The one i use on my own software is quick and easy, just 1 or 2 clicks, and has many features.

also, the parallel lines on the charts are simply other ML sets i've drawn.

Quoting msmarple
On your charts I noticed parallel lines going all through the chart - are these already preconfigured or from older ML studies ?

I have found an indicator drawing ML ( Andr. / Schiff / catalin ), but I still couldnt apply it to my charts.
  • #631
  • Oct 23, 2009 7:39am Oct 23, 2009 7:39am
You have to change the name of the MT Andrews Pitchfork in the properties dialog to match the name used by the AML indicator. Then it's just a matter of changing the colors and line styles to your preference.
Quoting msmarple
Hello Peter,
I have found an indicator drawing ML ( Andr. / Schiff / catalin ), but I still couldnt apply it to my charts.

One has to define some input levels before it shows up, but obviously I am too dumb for that.....

I've used several dozen charting programs over the years and Ensign is one of the best charting programs I've ever used...A++
Quoting PeterE
MT4 ML indicator and the custom version are not very easy to use when compared to the one i use on Fib Trader or Ensign (no offense to the custom coder). The one i use on my own software is quick and easy, just 1 or 2 clicks, and has many features.
Attached Image
Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
  • #632
  • Edited 3:13am Oct 28, 2009 3:01am | Edited 3:13am
i've been inspired of late to explore bigger time frames, there are opportunities there that i have ignored due to being absorbed in 20min charts, so thought it time to branch out

i dont mind sitting in front of a computer throughout the day, but i also like the idea of being less dependent, in the future, on PC time, trading daily charts can facilitate this

so i've marked up a EURUSD daily using MLs

the 3 circles are classic ML trade set-ups, very easy to spot real-time and not complicated

circle 1: simply waiting for price to meet the red ML and show some support, which it did, BUY @ 1.4225

circle 2: again, simply waiting for price to come back to the red ML where a second position can be taken, BUY @ 1.4516

circle 3: very nice trend in place and that lower ML becomes increasingly robust the more confirmations it has, BUY @ 1.4787

so 3 open positions: +595 +304 +33 = +932 over 8wks, and holding with cash stop . . . . hmmm!? 50ish, 60ish

now before you get excited, of course it is hindsight, but it's still a worthwhile exercise in order to get me thinking about the bigger timeframe plays

note: what i dont like about this 3rd position is what the pink arrow at right is pointing to, plus the fact that the AUDUSD MLs are not showing any 'obvious' and immediate upward strength; much better if both pairs are in synch. Nevertheless, the probabilities are still favourable, . . . . with stops
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  • #633
  • Oct 28, 2009 8:58am Oct 28, 2009 8:58am
Peter, my recent Schiff seems to have a different angle than yours. My P1 is located a bit different than yours but it's not enough to make this kind of difference...
Quoting PeterE
i've marked up a EURUSD daily using MLs
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Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
  • #634
  • Oct 28, 2009 3:09pm Oct 28, 2009 3:09pm
thanks for pointing that out, this game's challenging enough, you dont want to be battling the technology as well.

whilst your schiff would have kept me out of trouble on this third trade, it would also have (using my entry set-ups) kept me out of the first 2 trades, so +932 - 150ish stop (3 trades x 50) = +782 vs. zero using your schiff

not trying to be a smarty-pants . . . . but it is interesting that different data feeds/ technology changes the trading experience




Quoting Scrutch
Peter, my recent Schiff seems to have a different angle than yours. My P1 is located a bit different than yours but it's not enough to make this kind of difference...
  • #635
  • Edited 5:07pm Oct 28, 2009 4:35pm | Edited 5:07pm
Quoting PeterE
thanks for pointing that out, this game's challenging enough, you dont want to be battling the technology as well.
Agreed...

Quoting PeterE
whilst your schiff would have kept me out of trouble on this third trade, it would also have (using my entry set-ups) kept me out of the first 2 trades, so +932 - 150ish stop (3 trades x 50) = +782 vs. zero using your schiff
Not sure I agree with this...your Schiff shows support off the Lower Median while mine is showing support off the 1/8 line. Support is support, and your Median Line shows very good harmonics...plenty of support/resistance places to get in or out, on either formation.

Quoting PeterE
not trying to be a smarty-pants . . . . but it is interesting that different data feeds/ technology changes the trading experience
Yes, started nudging the P1 and P2 up and down a bit by hand and produced a formation that matched yours, although I had to move the P0 anchor off the mid point of P0~P1. Interesting how a small difference in the high/low data makes a large difference in the slope of the formation.
Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
  • #636
  • Edited 6:01pm Oct 28, 2009 5:50pm | Edited 6:01pm
you've got me thinking about this scrutch

MLs are very sensitive to the positioning of each pivot, change it slighly at one end and you can get significant differences down the line of the ML

below is the same MLs drawn as for the daily EU above, but here i have adopted my brokers designated start of day and finish (10pm GMT, or 2 hrs before the official open time of Tokyo Fx = 0.00 GMT)

so, if you change your start/finish times for the day (not to mention data source) you can get different results as shown below, which is interesting because on one chart you could have a break of an ML and on another, price hasnt yet reached the ML

the first chart could be a false signal, or it could be leading the chart which hasnt yet reached the ML

in the end i think one has just got to select a data feed and a start and finish time to construct charts and indicators; in my case i've selected my day to start at Tokyo's official open, 0.00GMT; which if i compare the 2 charts is preferrable
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  • #637
  • Oct 28, 2009 5:56pm Oct 28, 2009 5:56pm
thinking about that 3rd EU trade, that pink arrow at right i mentioned is giving some good exit signals: price is butting up against that upper blue ML, = expectation of reversal here & AUDUSD MLs did not support longs . . . . . . hindsight trading . . . . my most profitable trading method
  • #638
  • Oct 28, 2009 6:13pm Oct 28, 2009 6:13pm
Quoting PeterE
you've got me thinking about this scrutch
... Thinking is a good thing

Each to their own, it's why we have buyers and sellers at the same price level, without that we would have no one to buy or sell to us.
For what it's worth...I've done a lot of data testing using a predictive cycle tool. The predictive value becomes very reliable if (using 24 hour data) I use the NY (5:00 Eastern) close for the day, even though they don't really close. With some of my other charting programs I'm able to control the start/end of the day very easily, not so easy with MetaTrader.

I know a lot of traders that just use trendlines and/or channels with as much confidence as I have in the Andrews. Think the major thing here is to see how the data one is using lines up with the support/resistance. Good harmonics along any line can be traded, if it's not vibrating along the line, move the line until it shows good harmonics. This was a lot easier trading futures when the market was only open so long each day with a precise open/close time. Then along came progress...

Quoting PeterE
MLs are very sensitive to the positioning of each pivot, change it slighly at one end and you can get significant differences down the line of the ML

below is the same MLs drawn as for the daily EU above, but here i have adopted my brokers designated start of day and finish (10pm GMT, or 2 hrs before the official open time of Tokyo Fx = 0.00 GMT)

so, if you change your start/finish times for the day (not to mention data source) you can get different results as shown below, which is interesting because on one chart you could have a break of an ML and on another, price hasnt yet reached the ML

the first could be a false signal, or it could be leading the chart which hasnt yet reached the ML

in the end i think one has just got to select a data feed and a start and finish time to construct charts and indicators; in my case i've selected my day to start at Tokyo's official open, 0.00GMT
Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
  • #639
  • Oct 28, 2009 6:31pm Oct 28, 2009 6:31pm
that's interesting, if i am understanding you correctly, setting my new day to start at 5.00 lends itself to a higher predictive value when using MLs (or other!) than if i used say 20.00 NY (=tokyo start)??

if i'm following you there, 5:00am is 9am GMT, correct?
and i assume day light saving doesnt play a role, just leave settings at a constant 9am GMT all year round?

thanks
Peter


Quoting Scrutch
...I've done a lot of data testing using a predictive cycle tool. The predictive value becomes very reliable if (using 24 hour data) I use the NY (5:00 Eastern) close for the day . . . .
  • #640
  • Oct 28, 2009 9:06pm Oct 28, 2009 9:06pm
Quoting PeterE
that's interesting, if i am understanding you correctly, setting my new day to start at 5.00 lends itself to a higher predictive value when using MLs (or other!) than if i used say 20.00 NY (=tokyo start)??
if i'm following you there, 5:00am is 9am GMT, correct?
Sorry, my bad... 5:00pm or 17:00
NY close is 17:00 so the open would be 17:01
1:00 GMT is 21:00 EDT (day light savings)
NY EDT = GMT -4, NY EST = GMT -5
The main place I've used this paticular data (this is daily data only) is in MetaStock and it did seem to make a difference. I really don't remember how significant it was though. Wasn't that concerened about it at the time.
I do know that the futures data has a higher hit rate than when I use the cross pair data, have no idea why this is.

Quoting PeterE
and i assume day light saving doesnt play a role, just leave settings at a constant 9am GMT all year round?
The data I use to calculate the pivot is downloaded with the current NY time...so if they are using day light savings time, the data reflects this. When they move to standard time, then the data reflects this time as well.

Quoting PeterE
thanks
Peter
You're welcome
Listen to the whispers.... You may learn something
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