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The System II (Yes with irony)

  • #8,261
  • Oct 2, 2009 9:54pm Oct 2, 2009 9:54pm
Hi Paul, FX, Feb, Moneda,

I am certainly not quitting. I have a long way to go before I can look myself in the mirror and say I have tried and given it my all. dont worry, I will be here Monday morning taking those Asians down one trade at a time

My wife considers me on of the most stubborn personshe has ever met (I take it as a compliment , I don't think she takes it that way sometimes). Stubborness = tenacity. The little pitbull that bites and does not let go.

Let the new week come around. I love Mondays

Quoting PaulLangham
Hey Enox,

I hope you don`t mind if I come in and give you my thoughts.

First up, your posts are amongst the most valuanble on this thread, so please bury any idea of throwing in the towel brother - that ain`t gonna rub with me You are needed here.

OK so to the problem in hand. Yep like others are saying there will be rough days and weeks, thats gonna happen, like Fx and Feb have said make loosing part of your agenda.

About quitting, yep who on this thread hasn`t thought,"oh man isn`t it easier to not do this rather than do...
Survive and Preserve
  • #8,262
  • Oct 2, 2009 11:17pm Oct 2, 2009 11:17pm
Hi PaulL
As every day I wait to see your posts .
Great job !
Looking at trades 1 & 2 , it looks that for the time being you have changed your policy , that intsead of playing #2 you wait for the price to check your hard SL .
Is my observation correct ?
How do you "feel" about that ? Do you trade more relaxed or on the contrary ?
I know Feb's post to give the price some space ... but how much is "some space" ?
Do you decide about that on every single trade ?
I am struggling with this issue ALL the time...
Looking forward to read your comments.
Regards
david4u
Quoting PaulLangham
Hi

Here are my trades for today.

I stopped pretty quickly during the London session, just two trades.

After the NFP I took one trade and added a second positioon whilst I was in profit. Not sure what I was doing coming out whwre I did on the second postion, a little too eartly to say the least.

Any comments welcome.
  • #8,263
  • Oct 3, 2009 2:52am Oct 3, 2009 2:52am
Quoting en0x
Hi Paul, FX, Feb, Moneda,

I am certainly not quitting. I have a long way to go before I can look myself in the mirror and say I have tried and given it my all. dont worry, I will be here Monday morning taking those Asians down one trade at a time

My wife considers me on of the most stubborn personshe has ever met (I take it as a compliment , I don't think she takes it that way sometimes). Stubborness = tenacity. The little pitbull that bites and does not let go.

Let the new week come around. I love Mondays

Good on you Enox, we will all be there doing our best
Survive and Preserve
  • #8,264
  • Oct 3, 2009 4:35am Oct 3, 2009 4:35am
Quoting moneda
FOURX,

So what is your point?

Feb asked you to support your statement as to why you find the addition of the FCR approach ambiguous etc.. and you have not responded here so that we can all follow your reasoning. Instead you choose to respond defensively to FX and accused him of being "touchy".. I guess you find it easier to be sarcastic than to give an answer that requires some thinking and accountability for what comes out of your mouth.

We are waiting for your explanation..... I know that Feb will try to help you with your ambiguity.
Hey moneda.

lets get this straight' i made an observation to feb, because he was around.

i was not asking for guidance,if you read the post again you should realise that, but everybody gets defensive


where i feel the the ambiguity is with the fcr, is that not everybody recognises the same levels, AT TIMES.

In some instances a one bar pullback will be hailed/seen as a fcr, and at other times it will not be,this is AMBIGUITY.

I was not critical of the method, in fact i like to use it.


But on another point.

Remember...1 method , 1 pair,1 timeframe.(well we actually use 2 methods)

But take a look at Dukes trades yesterday(nice trades by the way mate), nothing to do with these methods at all, he used entries based on support and resistance, double tops etc. how many more will be introduced? confusion wil reign!



peace guys!
  • #8,265
  • Oct 3, 2009 5:27am Oct 3, 2009 5:27am
Quoting moneda
tghfbt8,

Can you please explain in more details where is the truth to FOURX 's statement that introducing the fcr has created ambiguity here? I could clarify a couple of things for you...but I prefer if you do the thinking since you are the one sharing your perspective.

tgh,
Why do you ask Moneda to make a explanation? it came out of his (fourx)mouth.. and your sort of supporting it.. so put on some pants both of you and come up with your reasoning and prespectives.. I be waiting.. and if its worth my time I might respond.. but be sure to think it hard and come up with something smart and worthy of reading and not cluttering the thread, otherwise you be making a fool out of yourself and you wil be demolished by my respond with proven facts..

now i will over come your obsticles before you even think about coming with a respond and rather surrender..

here it is, listen close you two and all you doubters out there..

fcr is no different than 123.. its just a lil quicker entery and more importantly grantees you being in every or more rides.. does it have down fall?.. sure it does.. what!! you think 123 doesn't? or for that matter any other method don't? ... think about it..
but, i did not introduce fcr and just leave you guys hanging out there.. did I? I have compliment it with a defensive/offensive play which is your #1&2 play.. and that is nothing more than our regular expectancy which was inplant by feb from the begining.. I just have broken it down to minute details with lil structures so it be easier to understand and follow for you guys that might have difficulty..
and I am here everyday of the week with you guys tow to tow try to fine tune you guyses skill by my live trades, live charts, before the fact commentary and responding to every one of your questions and concerns.. explaining shit when its happening at that MOMENT..
with the help on Moneda and the some rising star from this very method such as PaulL.. Jplo.. and afew others that are slowy but surely steping to the plate such as.. elizo.. andrewb.. macdaddy.. afew that come in mind..

the fact of the matter is that every method, system, stragegy or etc.. is got its own flaws and benefits.. you got all kind of tools here available for you here to become better and more well rounded trader.. this is what this thread is all about.. i reapet, don't treat it as a "system".. this is not a damn system.. nobody is holding you back from stricktly trading the 123.. if that fits you the best then stick with that.. and master it..
but thread is gonna move forward to even more advance levels.. this ship must and will keep moving forward..
we got 123.. we got fcr.. and we got FR_ _ .. .. oh what? another ffrrrccccxxxx something? yes.. but i wont even gonna dare to talk about that with you for now.. you guys got to work your way up for that.. pay your dues and show some hard work and reall understanding of this thread's purpose and direction.. and someday maybe once we got a sound group of serious trades who have taken one step out of time and build a solid ground and mastered each step.. then it might be shared, but i doubt it for now and for a very long time from what I am seeing.. and don't even ask me about it.. i will not respond to your pm's in this regard..

anyways.. think before making a comment.. your sound questions, concerns with solid explenations are always more than welcome to me and the rest of Vip's..

have good weekend guys..
  • #8,266
  • Oct 3, 2009 6:04am Oct 3, 2009 6:04am
I am lost.........

why is the whole deal about FC'rs...1-2-3's etc....


We actually don't trade 1-2-3 but the RESULT of it......

If we're playing a true 1-2-3, we will placing and order on #2 which could be for the fibo freaks the 50% or 61.8% line....but we're not.

Ok children let's repeat after me...

1)initial swing

2)retracement (pullback)

3)continuation AT THE BREAK of the initial swing...yes here's where you should have your limit in place already....baby!!!!

So U have 1-2-3 - the dow theory...whatever U wanna call it...I don't know..

The 1-2-3 is our only "indicator"

#1 = initial swing - heads up
#2 pullback - place your limits...
# 3 continuation of the swing......... trade....


If there's anything else, please someone enligth me......
Peace
  • #8,267
  • Oct 3, 2009 6:22am Oct 3, 2009 6:22am
Quoting en0x
Hi Paul, FX, Feb, Moneda,

I am certainly not quitting. I have a long way to go before I can look myself in the mirror and say I have tried and given it my all. dont worry, I will be here Monday morning taking those Asians down one trade at a time

My wife considers me on of the most stubborn personshe has ever met (I take it as a compliment , I don't think she takes it that way sometimes). Stubborness = tenacity. The little pitbull that bites and does not let go.

Let the new week come around. I love Mondays
Hello En0x,

You hang in there buddy...you are an inspiration to me and others...you are not alone and many of us have traveled the same path...no pain...no gain...

My best wishes for you.
Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno
  • #8,268
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:09am Oct 3, 2009 7:09am
Quoting FOURX
feb
I feel this thread should have been left as classic 123 break, as the introduction of fcr (which is a method of its own) led to a lot of ambiguity
Quoting tghfbt8
Well, in some respect it's true.
Classic 123 is trend is your friend while fcr is about trend reversal.
Hi,

Let me add my 2 cents on this thing....

I really cannot understand what is the problem with FRC's....

You both are talking about the validity of 123 setup, trend, etc, etc...

As Feb says,

1 = swing (nothing to do with trend, or whatever..... We are trading noise guyz)
2 = Retrace
3 = Continuation
4 = If continuation fails, then FCR setup on the other side..... being first in line for the possible new 123 on the other side, even before 1(swing) is formed........
* What happens if FCR fakes?-------------------- #2 on play. Defensive play
* What happens if FCR semifakes?---------------- #1 on play. It means waiting for the retrace, after the swing and wait if the continuation have place.............. so what we have here??? c'mon.... a 123 setup in place, took since the very begining, and being located on the driver seat....... Amazing guys, isn't it...... can you ever imagine being in a better situation???
It is simply a gem, an incredibly well thought progression of the original 123....... Sooooo.....

Apart from that, I can assure both of you, that there is nothing in this thread that it was not aprove by FEB...

So, please, please, DONT CREATE CONFUSSION to those who wanna really be serious and master "System II",......
  • #8,269
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:22am Oct 3, 2009 7:22am
Quoting FOURX
hey guys Derren Brown is live on TV here in the uk right now and about to place a £5000 bet on a single number on a roulette wheel to win viewer £175,000 @ 35/1

They guy's a fraud - an entertainer - it's filmed out of sequence. It's fun but bullshit.
$urvive, Pre$erve & RESPECT THE TEACHER
  • #8,270
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:39am Oct 3, 2009 7:39am
Feb, Fx and jplo,

Great posts and clarifications ... I have no idea how many times this will be needed again... and again...but for the sake of the integrity of this thread and those who are seriously interested in our approach...thank you again.

Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno
  • #8,271
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:56am Oct 3, 2009 7:56am
Quoting en0x

I said this before, the market is certainly the most humbling experience for me. As soon as I feel cocky, it cuts me straight down to size with a damn blunt and rusted knife.

I was at a wedding on friday and could only watch the thread from my mobile phone...couldn't trade - so FRUSTRATING...This thread was the best soap opera in town!!! Wow, full of wit, observation, bickering, reinforcement, despair, triumph, more bickering - teaching and learning from experience - FRIGGING DYNAMITE!

Man, Enox, you have character in SHED LOADS. You say later that you can't wait for Monday...I have the same feeling -EXCITEMENT...possibility...challenge.

It seems to me like a war that is never won - and the moment I think I have it handled it comes back a kicks my wallet (much, much more painful than my ass!) - we win a battle then lose six, then win another battle, lose another two...no time to nurse the bleeding wounds... back on board IF and THEN...then comes the big one! And if I'm sitting out feeling sorry for myself and haven't been in the heat of the fight then I miss it when it comes...and all that is left is to wait for the next battle. But it always comes... just when I go and make coffee, or go to the gym, make a phone call...and really I just want to be in there riding "the fuck out of it" as the Jedi Master puts it so succinctly!

I don't understand your comment FOURX - I like your challenges, you often put the spotlight on my poor judgement and that helps me learn, but I think you're missing the point with the FCR...With respect to you and just to put in my two penny worth -


We have summarised this over and over again - and as a relative newbie still there is nothing confusing about it at all. For me the 1,2,3 and FCR are exactly the same things - 123 at the start
of a swing forms the first FCR - reverses the previous swing or establishes a move with greater momentum - however and FCR may not be 30-40 pips that Feb talks about in the thread at the beginning of things. With every FCR comes the power of the #1 and #2 exit strategies which demand feel and experience to execute at the optimum - and being one step ahead through IF and THEN... so I can let the price trigger my next step - so I can be on the conveyor belt when it breaks for the border.

Simple...the confusion comes from my own head...thinking I can tell what is going to happen when I have no idea in reality, fantasy outcomes, denial of the reality of the PA, sitting pleading with the price to move where I want it as if it gives a shit, punching the air when it runs thinking I'm omnipotent!
I think you hit the right word Enox - it's HUMBLING. No one beats this thing because it keeps on coming back for more - it's unstoppable - and I get clearly that what sets Fx apart is that he has the same characteristic of the market - he is just remorselessly unstoppable...that is what I want to cultivate in everything I set out to do in life - even at 53 - being f***ing unstoppable. Jplo has it too - so do others - and at 27 years of age - boy I envy him getting this so early in his life.
You're unstoppable too, ENox - when it hurts you yell - you tell it like it is and it is pure support for people like me. Thanks mate...I have to work at something else on Monday (which I enjoy) but I might sleep deprive myself a little to get up really early to join in for a couple of hours.
$urvive, Pre$erve & RESPECT THE TEACHER
  • #8,272
  • Oct 3, 2009 8:49am Oct 3, 2009 8:49am
Quoting en0x
Hi Paul, FX, Feb, Moneda,

I am certainly not quitting. I have a long way to go before I can look myself in the mirror and say I have tried and given it my all. dont worry, I will be here Monday morning taking those Asians down one trade at a time

My wife considers me on of the most stubborn personshe has ever met (I take it as a compliment , I don't think she takes it that way sometimes). Stubborness = tenacity. The little pitbull that bites and does not let go.

Let the new week come around. I love Mondays
Here's a winner's attitude....if he keeps this way, sooner or later you'll gonna hear him saying " oh man this thing about making money is soooo boring" (yawwwn!!).
Peace
  • #8,273
  • Oct 3, 2009 3:55pm Oct 3, 2009 3:55pm
Quoting fxachilies
tgh,
Why do you ask Moneda to make a explanation? it came out of his (fourx)mouth..
I didn't ask anyone to explain anything to me. Moneda did.

Here is my 5 cents without arguing.

As far as I understand the power of TS II is to using your own eyes to see that market moving up or down. Or if it London opening strong move out of asian session boundary.
If market moving up trader should wait for 40 pips swing, 50% retrenchment and place stop order couple pips above high. And ride the next swing.
Also trader should see with his own eyes that market is standing still, ranging, make ugly moves and thus sit on her/his hands.

FCR means trader is establishing trade against last swing. This can be
1. Correction.
2. Turn of trend.

If it's as JL said just "natural correction" the trader should grub the 20 pips and be happy.
If it's beginning of new trend than it's time to load huge position and ride it to death.

But who knows which case is it. The classical TA talks about double tops/bottoms, H&S, etc....
The last picture which feb posted was breakout trade after double top.
  • #8,274
  • Oct 3, 2009 4:11pm Oct 3, 2009 4:11pm
Hello again,

I would like to share the enclosed picture which is my attempt to put the basic premise of this thread into something more visual.. It has been done before but perhaps my rendition can be of help... Always keep in mind that the subtleties of any method can never be put in a picture. This is where newbies and people who fail to realize that to be successful at any endeavor, one needs endure many painful lessons and persist at all cost. I will ask Feb and Fx to edit anything that is not correct.

Please do not comment on your observation that I put the attachment in a 4hr chart... lol
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: ScreenHunter_003.gif Size: 46 KB
Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno
  • #8,275
  • Oct 3, 2009 5:18pm Oct 3, 2009 5:18pm
Isn't FCR contradicts post #18
http://www.forexfactory.com/showpost...0&postcount=18

Especially with

Quote
see, the problem I have with pullbacks/retracements is that you can get caught up in the middle of a fire. Also, as we don't know what the market is going to do next, I assume that if the market continues the swing AKA trend now, it's a high probable trade when the market breaks the las swing high and continues.

If you are buying inside 40 pips swing you would save what 10 - 15 pips.
I've seen a lot in this thread that people played FCR to turn around without waiting for 40 pips swing.

Look at trade 3 here.

http://www.forexfactory.com/showpost...postcount=8254
  • #8,276
  • Oct 3, 2009 5:54pm Oct 3, 2009 5:54pm
tgh,

Post #18 is not a contradiction.... Feb is speaking of pullbacks... FCR is a reversal and it takes place after price failed to brake the HH and breaks through the FCR level..look at my previous post. FCR is an early attempt at the PROBABILITY of a reversal of an established swing...it may or it may not turn into a runner... #1 and #2 are your tools to deal with the unexpected. By the way, a swing is not what most people would call a trend.. How many pips does it need to be? 20,30,40,? most of the time it is up to the discretion of the trader...experience, familiarity, wisdom etc. plays a part... We are not dealing with dogma here...you need to think for yourself...think out of the box... let the market show you the way not the other way around. But you know this already...

As far as trade #3 by Paul L. ...he was trading the after effect of the NFP news... and managed his trade with the profit taking and risk management that suited him..is a personal thing... He even explains it in his post: After the NFP I took one trade and added a second position whilst I was in profit. Not sure what I was doing coming out where I did on the second postion, a little too early to say the least.

Paul shares his trades ...the good, the bad, the ugly as a way to learn as well as help others with their own trades.

I hope this helps you clarify some things for you..if not..please keep asking until it is clear to you...

Unus pro omnibus, omnes pro uno
  • #8,277
  • Oct 3, 2009 6:37pm Oct 3, 2009 6:37pm
This is just a guess, but I bet that almost 30% of the posts in this thread (or many threads for that matter) are: 1) newbies asking silly or none pertinent questions. This is their nature-they can't help it. & 2) Longtime and more knowledgeable thread posters replies to these questions. They just can't seem to ignore them or ( in some cases ) reply in a couteous fashion. This is their nature and they can't help it. Newbies are out to obfuscate their thread, they must protect.

My suggestion to cut down on this clutter is: feb could make it a "friends only" thread. Only people he approves would be allowed to post. He could limit it to himself, fx, moneda, mac 1956, PL, en0x, jplo and maybe a few other hand-picked people would be invited. The thread might be a little less interesting but more courteous. There may be even more options I don't know about.

I don't personally trade this method , but I have been following since day one. I like a lot of what I read but it really knocks down the integrity when anyone for any reason denegrates another.

I mean this as only a suggestion to improve this thread. It would cut down the clutter and make it a friendlier place. This kind of 'in-fighting' can, in the end, destroy a thread and I would hate for that to happen.

Trade well and prosper.
Hej.
  • #8,278
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:35pm Oct 3, 2009 7:35pm
I'm new to this thread, and I mostly trade the Asia session, but I have gotten an enormous benefit from the mentoring here. I've seen some bickering, but it seems to die away quickly, and I think that is due to the sheer integrity and lack of ego on the part of Feb, Fx and others. They are helping and mentoring us all, and I appreciate it.

Flawed Human nature is what we are up against here; cut our winners short, let losers run, promote our own ego, our own agenda, emotions rule. Trading to me is about succeeding despite our human flaws, and this thread is the best thing I've seen.

I love the thread as it is, full of integrity, energy, contributions, with some occassional noise and bickering.

For the first time in a long while, I also am looking forward to Mondays again.

regards
John

Quoting Stitch961
This is just a guess, but I bet that almost 30% of the posts in this thread (or many threads for that matter) are: 1) newbies asking silly or none pertinent questions. This is their nature-they can't help it. & 2) Longtime and more knowledgeable thread posters replies to these questions. They just can't seem to ignore them or ( in some cases ) reply in a couteous fashion. This is their nature and they can't help it. Newbies are out to obfuscate their thread, they must protect.

My suggestion to cut down...
testing the market
  • #8,279
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:44pm Oct 3, 2009 7:44pm
Quoting feb2865
I am lost.........

why is the whole deal about FC'rs...1-2-3's etc....


We actually don't trade 1-2-3 but the RESULT of it......

If we're playing a true 1-2-3, we will placing and order on #2 which could be for the fibo freaks the 50% or 61.8% line....but we're not.

Ok children let's repeat after me...

1)initial swing

2)retracement (pullback)

3)continuation AT THE BREAK of the initial swing...yes here's where you should have your limit in place already....baby!!!!

So U have 1-2-3 - the dow theory...whatever U wanna call it...I don't...

and there you have it, straight from the horses mouth!
  • #8,280
  • Oct 3, 2009 7:53pm Oct 3, 2009 7:53pm
Stick around guys, I am going to write something tonight to make things clear...is going to take a while...
Peace
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