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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #44,641
  • Sep 25, 2009 7:36pm Sep 25, 2009 7:36pm
Quoting StoragePro
This was a nice one - although not a Daily TF trade, it was of the 4 hr variety. Noon local time bar which closed at 4PM was a no-brainer.

Nice size BEOB, formed at a solid Resistance area (a Head and Shoulders - if you go in for that kind of thing) and the size of the bar was sweet. Don't let anyone fool you - size matters.

So now, the trade is up 3R - AND we have busted the 1.6000 cleanly. I had the luxury of being able to move my stops behind the bars as it got to and through that major PPZ.

It would not surprise me if we consolidate...
Nice chart SP.

Your chart also illustrates why we look for BEOBs at swing Highs and not BUOBs, which is also shown.
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
  • #44,642
  • Sep 25, 2009 8:02pm Sep 25, 2009 8:02pm
LOL

How did I know that you'd say this. I swear it, I did.

What you are calling common sense is, in fact a set of rules you follow to get in a trade and then to manage it.

Tharp has explored this very phenomenon with traders like yourself. He has found that everyone of them actually has a firm set of rules - criteria if you will, that governs their feeling - aka "common sense".

It works for you, and I would not change a thing.

But as for rules or criteria, you have them. You just do not look at things that way. You are not supposed to, you rebellious teenager!

Quoting benji533
Rules? what rules?
This is the point I feel different. I didn't find any single article which didn't mention that "YOU MUST HAVE RULES IN ORDER TO MAKE MONEY".
I don't have rules. Funny. I have never wrote down a list of rules and followed them.
Maybe this is the reason it's so important for me to find sense in everything? I trade a method which made up from knowledge and almost 100% common sense.
Rules confuse me. You need this and this and that and...to fit together in order to pull the trigger.
I just look at a setup and find if there...
I'm pretty much done with all this ...
  • #44,643
  • Sep 25, 2009 8:07pm Sep 25, 2009 8:07pm
Quoting benji533
I just look at a setup and find if there are good enough reasons to trade it, or reasons why not to trade it.
Hey Benji,
How you doing? Good I think. And I see you you are in the process of signing up at Oanda. Good stuff, I'm sure all will be fine with them. I have demo and live accounts with them and I have not experienced any problems.

I like your post about rules and just wanted to offer a opinion. I am in agreement with you about about this and I would say the statement I have quoted above is good enough rules in my opinion.

You see the set up, it fits with your method or style, so trade it and apply your money management. That's it right!?

Cheers
Boca
  • #44,644
  • Sep 26, 2009 8:33am Sep 26, 2009 8:33am
Quoting TC East
Thanks Benji...actually, I find this post quite helpful....
I'm happy you think so. When I posted it I thought I will get a bunch of arguments that I trade wrong, and not like I should.
I just don't care anymore about what is "right" an what's not. I read several psychology books, and I disagree about some things there. I just follow what works for me.

Quoting StoragePro
LOL

How did I know that you'd say this. I swear it, I did.

What you are calling common sense is, in fact a set of rules you follow to get in a trade and then to manage it.

Tharp has explored this very phenomenon with traders like yourself. He has found that everyone of them actually has a firm set of rules - criteria if you will, that governs their feeling - aka "common sense".

It works for you, and I would not change a thing.

But as for rules or criteria, you have them. You just do not look at things that way. You are not supposed...
LOL SP I love your posts


Quoting Bocajunior
Hey Benji,
How you doing? Good I think. And I see you you are in the process of signing up at Oanda. Good stuff, I'm sure all will be fine with them. I have demo and live accounts with them and I have not experienced any problems.

I like your post about rules and just wanted to offer a opinion. I am in agreement with you about about this and I would say the statement I have quoted above is good enough rules in my opinion.

You see the set up, it fits with your method or style, so trade it and apply your money management. That's it right!?

Cheers
Boca...
I'm all good buddy, hope you are as well
Yea you and SP make sense...it depends how you look at it.

Ben
  • #44,645
  • Sep 26, 2009 9:17am Sep 26, 2009 9:17am
USD/CAD Daily:

Bearish Monday?
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  • #44,646
  • Sep 26, 2009 12:13pm Sep 26, 2009 12:13pm
Hi.

I have a question to the more experienced members here. Dont you think that I overact with this PPZ.I am kinda confused. It is a mess in my head with this PPZ. I see everywhere PPZ I took only one trade for 2 weeks because of those PPZ. Should I look for more valuable PPZ or something ? Please help me
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  • #44,647
  • Sep 26, 2009 12:31pm Sep 26, 2009 12:31pm
I have noticed that most of the people post only their winners. I do that as well, lol. But why?

I will start posting also loser trades when I have. IMO, many times it is more important focusing on them than on the winners. Nothing to be afraid of.
We all have losers
Most of my learning and improving comes from loses. Over time I learn how to cut them though.

I remember someone in this thread saying that he never checks his loses and don't care about them after the fact, and I have disagreed. So not trying to argue, but look how:

1) I am applying what I have learned from past losers.- When I saw that 4 bars in a raw didn't manage to break the pin, I just caught my risk to one third by moving my stop under the last small buob. That is because it was a reserval trade against the trend, and I saw I had lack of momentum. I t was a smart move. That way I can have three losers like that and it will still remain a loss of 1R only.

2) I have Learned (or more correct to say - I got reminded) that I have traded against the trend without divergence. This is after I have done some back testing, and got to the conclusion that when trading reversals (against the trend), most of the losers don't have any divergence. I tend to limit myself to reversals only off a round numbers which are also act as a PPZ, and with div. This trade only showed me again that I was right ( I didn't have any div).
By analyzing my whole chart, I can see that a few bars earlier, I had a big buob, off a round number, and with a real great div. It was quite the same situation like the pin bar I took, but had divergence this time. I always take all this into account.

Once a week, or a few weeks - I open my trades folder and go over all my loser trades and read all my notes I have left for myself.
It really helps, and I suggest everybody to try it.

By the way, I had another cool winner on the EURUSD yesterday, but I think I post too much now, lol

Ben
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  • #44,648
  • Sep 26, 2009 12:40pm Sep 26, 2009 12:40pm
Quoting atton
Hi.

I have a question to the more experienced members here. Dont you think that I overact with this PPZ.I am kinda confused. It is a mess in my head with this PPZ. I see everywhere PPZ I took only one trade for 2 weeks because of those PPZ. Should I look for more valuable PPZ or something ? Please help me
Hey buddy, which pair and TF is it?
  • #44,649
  • Sep 26, 2009 12:49pm Sep 26, 2009 12:49pm
Quoting atton
Hi.

I have a question to the more experienced members here. Dont you think that I overact with this PPZ.I am kinda confused. It is a mess in my head with this PPZ. I see everywhere PPZ I took only one trade for 2 weeks because of those PPZ. Should I look for more valuable PPZ or something ? Please help me
Hey Atton

You have marked both the major ppz in that area(the middle one) and then the minor ppz, both are important but it depends on the context. I see no good PA bars, and a pretty messy overall area. Don't go searching for trades. Let the trades come to you, then this information becomes more powerful.

Best
Mike
  • #44,650
  • Edited 3:09pm Sep 26, 2009 1:13pm | Edited 3:09pm
Quoting benji533
I have noticed that most of the people post only their winners. I do that as well, lol. But why?

I will start posting also loser trades when I have. IMO, many times it is more important focusing on them than on the winners. Nothing to be afraid of.
If I am fanatical about anything when it comes to trading it is this.

I have two journals on PF (intraday and daily) where I post every trade winner or loser. Even the two humbling revenge trades I took this month. Everything goes in those journals without exception.

I never post trades on here because for me it is meaningless to post a winner if I am not going to post every trade. It's different if you're a senior looking to teach, or a new person looking to learn. I am grateful for the charts that Jim, Mike, Rac, Jarroo etc post. Wouldn't have learnt a thing without them. But I'm not at their stage so I wouldn't be posting a winning chart to teach, but rather to crow. "Woohoo, I nailed it"

That's my ego talking. Pure and simple.

It's crucially important to me to lay all my dirty laundry out at least somewhere. I know Mike reads every post on PF so he sees every stoopid trade I make. Sometimes that makes me cringe. But it's a vitally important part of the honesty and accountability that I think I need to make it as a successful trader.

Notice I am putting all this in the first person. I really don't in any way claim that this is how it must be for everyone. But I know that, for now, it's how it must be for me.
  • #44,651
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:14pm Sep 26, 2009 1:14pm
Quoting benji533
Hey buddy, which pair and TF is it?
Hi there Ben. It is Usd/Chf 4H TF.

Hi Mike. Thanks for answering. I wasnt talking about a PA. My point was that I always always x 100 see only PPZ near the price and I never get in trade because of them.
  • #44,652
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:16pm Sep 26, 2009 1:16pm
Quoting atton
Hi there Ben. It is Usd/Chf 4H TF.

Hi Mike. Thanks for answering. I wasnt talking about a PA. My point was that I always always x 100 see only PPZ near the price and I never get in trade because of them.
Hey A

Post up some trades that you didn't take or did take it makes it easier to help

Thanks
Mike
  • #44,653
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:33pm Sep 26, 2009 1:33pm
Quoting TiaForex
If I am fanatical about anything when it comes to trading it is this.

I have two journals on PF (intraday and daily) where I post every trade winner or loser. Even the two humbling revenge trades I took this month. Everything goes in those journals without exception.

I never post trades on here because for me it is meaningless to post a winner if I am not going to post every trade. It's different if you're a senior looking to teach. I am grateful for the charts that Jim, Mike, Rac, Jarroo etc post. Wouldn't have learnt a thing without them....
Yea...I think I post charts because I got used to, and it's fun sharing great trades?

I think I just want to share what's going on...maybe I need a journal like you have...in FF.

Anyway, of course we all have losers, and I decided to post it because it isn't less important than the winners. Look how much I can grab from this lose...if I post winners, I will post also losers, although I keep all of them in folders as well

Ben
  • #44,654
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:34pm Sep 26, 2009 1:34pm
Quoting mbqb11
Hey A

Post up some trades that you didn't take or did take it makes it easier to help

Thanks
Mike
Hi.

These are some of the trades that I didnt take because of the PPZ.
I know that the newcomers shouldnt be daytrading. But the funny thing with me is that I have around 10 months experience. Seven of them was profitable. I was daytrading with 1k acc but I was using a strategy that I didnt know why I ve been taking the signals. Some of you might think that I am crazy b/s I was profitable and I ve stopped using that strategy but I didnt know why I was doing the trades and everytime when I had a winner or a looser I couldnt figure it out why the **** it happened. It is just me I like when I do something especially when I am risking my money to know why I am doing this. To have a clue. Wanting or not I will start to trade the Daily and Weekly charts because my school started one week ago and I have many exams connected with my graduation.
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  • #44,655
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:38pm Sep 26, 2009 1:38pm
i saw benji the kid posting about losers. here are mine.

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  • #44,656
  • Sep 26, 2009 1:52pm Sep 26, 2009 1:52pm
Hey A

That first usd/cad is the only decent trade. The other 2 should be passed on and that is part of why they "look bad". Because they are. The worse a trade is the closer the trouble area.

The usd/cad you did identify a first potential problem area which gave some pips. A bit lower is the more main problem area on your chart there is more of a flip going on. With these lower timeframes you have to be nimble, and the ones you hold have to have extra super confluence, beyond just a pinbar. Now you could have many ways to actually manage this trade, depending on the trader. It isn't clean cut exactly what to do. i know for a fact no one should take a loss on that trade. I would have set a take profit at 1.0735ish and as price came close to it would have move my stop above the bar high after the pin. All about cutting your losses when you can and making sure not to be taking huge losses all the time.

Remember the price bar is such a small small piece to what we do here. It is all about location. And charts 2 and 3 are very poor poor price bars. Stick to bars that look like usd/cad one you posted and good locations and you will make great progress.

Hope that helps just my views
Mike

Quoting atton
Hi.

These are some of the trades that I didnt take because of the PPZ.
I know that the newcomers shouldnt be daytrading. But the funny thing with me is that I have around 10 months experience. Seven of them was profitable. I was daytrading with 1k acc but I was using a strategy that I didnt know why I ve been taking the signals. Some of you might think that I am crazy b/s I was profitable and I ve stopped using that strategy but I didnt know why I was doing the trades and everytime when I had a winner or a looser I couldnt...
  • #44,657
  • Sep 26, 2009 2:13pm Sep 26, 2009 2:13pm
Hi Mike

Thanks, thanks and thanks I think I know get it. Like you said we should identify our confluence zones ( by emas ppz round numbers fibo? ) and then look for a PA with a little space for our stop to get to BE. So if we have nice confluence the small PPZ will not oppose our trades is that right?
Damn when I understand something another question comes out. (human nature). I hope I dont piss you off with my questions. If we have confluence with nice PB but also we have a ppz on our close price on lets say the PB should we take the trade ?
And about the confluence is it enough to have only PA on a PPZ ?

Good Luck
  • #44,658
  • Sep 26, 2009 2:19pm Sep 26, 2009 2:19pm
Quoting atton
Hi Mike

Thanks, thanks and thanks I think I know get it. Like you said we should identify our confluence zones ( by emas ppz round numbers fibo? ) and then look for a PA with a little space for our stop to get to BE. So if we have nice confluence the small PPZ will not oppose our trades is that right?
Damn when I understand something another question comes out. (human nature). I hope I dont piss you off with my questions. If we have confluence with nice PB but also we have a ppz on our close price on...
of course your questions don't piss me off

The answer is there is no exact answer. Some people will always move stop at first trouble area. For me it depends on the bar+conflunce and what that first area looks like. I wish I had a better answer, but each situation is very unique to me and I try to look at it like that. So sometime a bar is in such a good location, I don't really work about a bar high , sometimes I do. I hope that isn't discouraging, what it means is as you get more comfortable, understand the material and gain the valuable experience it all falls into place

Let me know if you have more questions no matter how many
Mike
  • #44,659
  • Sep 26, 2009 2:39pm Sep 26, 2009 2:39pm
I knew that the answer might be something like that.So.. What was so great about the daily pin on gbp/usd, we were trading right against a big PPZ. I have PM about other issue.
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  • #44,660
  • Sep 26, 2009 3:31pm Sep 26, 2009 3:31pm
Quoting atton
I knew that the answer might be something like that.So.. What was so great about the daily pin on gbp/usd, we were trading right against a big PPZ. I have PM about other issue.
It certainly wasn't A+. So with that knowledge what do we do at that big trouble area? We protect ourselves, we can move our stops down, an dthen this thing cut right through. So even if you got your stop to b/e the thing ran. If it bounced your out at b/e and onto the next trade. This material can be used in so many ways that is the actual beauty because your method comes from what works best for you. I avoid these trades, b/c I am more comfortable with other trades. But it isn't wrong to take a trade like that either.

Best
Mike
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