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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #44,201
  • Sep 19, 2009 10:24am Sep 19, 2009 10:24am
Would welcome some thoughts on the chart and pin bar below.

Up until now I have not traded using price action, just using S/R levels, trendlines, 50% fib and round numbers - i.e. as per 'Jacko's' style of trading. However, I'm always looking to learn new methods that can compliment my existing trading style hence been slowly reading through some posts and watching some guest videos on J16 group website.

My analysis (be gentle!) of the pin bar in question is as follows:

1. The low of the nose is within 13 pips of the recent high bearish bar
2. The low is protruding near the 61.8% retracement of the July / Oct 2008 high / low
3. the low is protruding near the 23.6% retracement of the recent swing high.
4. Pin is not at a swing high / low in that it is not signalling a reversal...it is signalling a continuation.
5. MACD is showing divergence.
6. If I took the break of the top of the pin bar...where would we expect the price to head:

a) 1.4767 - recent swing high
b) 1.4800 - next round number
c) 1.4867 - 22-09-08 daily high

Thus, if I were to take this trade (top of pin is at 1.4744), maybe it would be prudent to wait for a break of the recent high before entering i.e.1.4770 for example. Or you could enter at the top of the pin and then move stop to B/E when/if price gets to the swing high...

Where would you put your initial stop...length of the pin is 98 pips...thus not attractive from a risk/reward perspective.
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  • #44,202
  • Sep 19, 2009 10:52am Sep 19, 2009 10:52am
No,Oanda does not support MT4. They have their own charting software which is not very good. The worst part of using Oanda, in many people's opinion, it the charting software. Many of use use MT4 for the charting and use Oanda for placing trades only. It's been a while since I transfered money, but I don't think they charge for deposits or withdraws.

Quoting benji533
Hey guys,

Does Oanda support MT4?
What are the fees of bank deposits and withdraws?

Ben
  • #44,203
  • Sep 19, 2009 11:02am Sep 19, 2009 11:02am
Hi, lovejoy.

Many folks here will recommend that price action beginners only buy when a pinbar forms at or near a swing low. I would pass on this setup, simply because I am not an advanced J16 trader and the pin is not at a swing low.

Also, regarding "4. Pin is not at a swing high / low in that it is not signalling a reversal...it is signalling a continuation.".... Some people actually will consider the candle on your chart a reversal signal. I believe it is called a "hangman"...There is a trader on this thread called Ghous who calls the pattern an "inverted pinbar". Ghous also trades these as a reversal in certain situations.

Someone with more experience may provide a more helpful reponse, but I am thinking that most of the traders in this thread would not buy on a break above that pin.

Quoting lovejoy80
Would welcome some thoughts on the chart and pin bar below.

Up until now I have not traded using price action, just using S/R levels, trendlines, 50% fib and round numbers - i.e. as per 'Jacko's' style of trading. However, I'm always looking to learn new methods that can compliment my existing trading style hence been slowly reading through some posts and watching some guest videos on J16 group website.

My analysis (be gentle!) of the pin bar in question is as follows:

1. The low of the nose is within 13 pips of the recent high bearish bar
2....
  • #44,204
  • Sep 19, 2009 11:10am Sep 19, 2009 11:10am
Quoting Jazflyer
Ryan, where did you have your div. line drawn on this chart? Guess it would have to be prior to the swing high PB otherwise there wouldn't be any div. Is that correct?

I was a little late to the party because I did not get up until 11:30AM EST so I missed the 1st short but I played it on the 2nd one and it worked. It's all odds.
Keep taking CT trades, I need more money
  • #44,205
  • Sep 19, 2009 11:13am Sep 19, 2009 11:13am
Quoting PipGator
No,Oanda does not support MT4. They have their own charting software which is not very good. The worst part of using Oanda, in many people's opinion, it the charting software. Many of use use MT4 for the charting and use Oanda for placing trades only. It's been a while since I transfered money, but I don't think they charge for deposits or withdraws.

Ya Oanda charts SUCK, also the few times I pulled money by check it took forever like 10 days and it came from Canada if I remember but it was around the end of the year so mail was heavy. I would say do a wire if you need it faster. I know I can get a wire from DBFX in under 3 hours
Keep taking CT trades, I need more money
  • #44,206
  • Sep 19, 2009 11:13am Sep 19, 2009 11:13am
Quoting PipGator
No,Oanda does not support MT4. They have their own charting software which is not very good. The worst part of using Oanda, in many people's opinion, it the charting software. Many of use use MT4 for the charting and use Oanda for placing trades only. It's been a while since I transfered money, but I don't think they charge for deposits or withdraws.
Thank you PipGator.

Ben
  • #44,207
  • Sep 19, 2009 1:13pm Sep 19, 2009 1:13pm
Quoting PipGator
Hi, lovejoy.

Many folks here will recommend that price action beginners only buy when a pinbar forms at or near a swing low. I would pass on this setup, simply because I am not an advanced J16 trader and the pin is not at a swing low.

Also, regarding "4. Pin is not at a swing high / low in that it is not signalling a reversal...it is signalling a continuation.".... Some people actually will consider the candle on your chart a reversal signal. I believe it is called a "hangman"...There is a trader on this thread called Ghous who calls the...
Just wanted to say hello to lovejoy, and second Pips response.

We want to look for those pins at swing low points, that is a swing high like Gator said. What happens is buying into a fresh high like that, we can have lots of sell orders above that area, and people get caught in a quick reversal. Yes it certainly can signal a continuation, but we want to put ourselves in the best position, and I would be nervous buying new highs on just that bar alone(if it was a breakout + pullback that would be different for me).

Take care
Mike
  • #44,208
  • Sep 19, 2009 2:11pm Sep 19, 2009 2:11pm
Quoting StoragePro
Anyone using the new windows yet? Is it working well with MT4?
works like a charm...
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  • #44,209
  • Sep 19, 2009 2:52pm Sep 19, 2009 2:52pm
Quoting raczekfx
works like a charm...
Thx Mang.
I'm pretty much done with all this ...
  • #44,210
  • Sep 19, 2009 3:37pm Sep 19, 2009 3:37pm
Hello everyone,

I have noticed that when we select the preferences of our oscillator (MACDRSI) etc - we have to choose on what we want to base it's calculations. The default preference we probably all use is "close". So if I get it right, all the oscillator's information is based on the close points of the bars.

Divergence means that the direction of price is opposite than the direction of the oscillator.

BUT, do we calculate it right? If our oscillator is based on the close point of the bars, so we need to use the close points of the bars in order to check if there is any divergence. Does it make sense?

Bellow it a chart.
The orange line shows what we are regular to draw when we check divergence - from bar low to another bar low, or from a bar high to another bar high.

The blue lines are pulled between the same bars exactly, but this time between the close point of the first bar, to the close point of the second bar.

It is easy to see that the orange lines show divergence, but the blue lines show no divergence. The question is what's right to draw?

How can you check the difference between two completely different factors?

Sorry, but this is fascinating not my fault.

Ben
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  • #44,211
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:00pm Sep 19, 2009 5:00pm
Quoting Ryanmcd
Money changes it all
This is exactly the problem.

If all my trades where = a nice car, I would probably be making only 20% of my results.
If you exit a certain trade at 9R on demo, but at 1R on real money, only because you see $$$, this is involving emotions. This is the damn problem of all trades which are successful on demo, and blow their accounts on real money.

The market doesn't have a clue, and doesn't care about your position size. It will still move the same. I can't understand the trades which automatically set their targets according to their R:R or $$$ targets. What these have to do with how the price will move and retrace next?

For me it's easy to say and do - but when I trade I don't even look at my profit by $$. I see only numbers, not money. There are trades which I didn't even look at how much my profit was by $$.

Now, the only thing that separates me from making real cash in this market is the change of $$ having value. My mission when opening a real account will be minimizing the $$ window during my trade, and keep looking at it only as numbers and not $$.
I believe that if I can do it, I'll be fine.

If I can summarize all the trading psychology books I ever read in one sentence, it will be - "prevent yourself from looking at the $$ bar during your trade, and think only on numbers". This is maybe the hardest task of any trader, which makes the difference between the 5%, to the 95%.

Easy to say though...

Ben
  • #44,212
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:08pm Sep 19, 2009 5:08pm
Quoting benji533
If you exit a certain trade at 9R on demo, but at 1R on real money, only because you see $$$, this is involving emotions. This is the damn problem of all trades which are successful on demo, and blow their accounts on real money.
Thinking on it - this is the thing that can kill traders like me, who like to trail their stops and get large R:R most of the time. This R:R is what keeps me in picture after a draw down. If I will prevent my winners from running, I'll be in a deep problem.

Does it makes sense to cut a 9R trade on 1R only because you see the $$ counter bar winking to you at 1R? this is what trading psychology is all about, and I will put all the efforts which are needed in order to get over it.

Ben
  • #44,213
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:19pm Sep 19, 2009 5:19pm
Quoting benji533
Does it makes sense to cut a 9R trade on 1R only because you see the $$ counter bar winking to you at 1R? this is what trading psychology is all about, and I will put all the efforts which are needed in order to get over it.
Unfortunately, no one can be told what trading psychology is like. You'll have to find out for yourself. You'll know all about it once you have money on the line. The more you have on the line the more hardcore it will be.
Don't wish it were easier, wish you were better. ~ Jim Rohn
  • #44,214
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:23pm Sep 19, 2009 5:23pm
Quoting LasVahGoose
Unfortunately, no one can be told what trading psychology is like. You'll have to find out for yourself. You'll know all about it once you have money on the line. The more you have on the line the more hardcore it will be.
You have said it yourself...trading psychology is the effect of having money on the line. The value off the $$ will control your decisions - the problem.
  • #44,215
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:44pm Sep 19, 2009 5:44pm
Quoting benji533
You have said it yourself...trading psychology is the effect of having money on the line. The value off the $$ will control your decisions - the problem.
Is that what I said? Interesting...

Sounds like you have it all figured out, please ignore my posts.
Don't wish it were easier, wish you were better. ~ Jim Rohn
  • #44,216
  • Sep 19, 2009 5:56pm Sep 19, 2009 5:56pm
Quoting benji533
You have said it yourself...trading psychology is the effect of having money on the line. The value off the $$ will control your decisions - the problem.
I actually think that's a pretty good thought. The more value someone holds to their cash, the harder time they'll have. If you look at money as another tool, then it becomes much easier.
I dream, therefore I become.
  • #44,217
  • Sep 19, 2009 6:04pm Sep 19, 2009 6:04pm
Quoting LasVahGoose
Is that what I said? Interesting...

Sounds like you have it all figured out, please ignore my posts.
I apologize if I sounded rude. Not meant to.
  • #44,218
  • Sep 19, 2009 6:16pm Sep 19, 2009 6:16pm
Quoting mike w
I actually think that's a pretty good thought. The more value someone holds to their cash, the harder time they'll have. If you look at money as another tool, then it becomes much easier.
Yep. That's my point.
If you are able to get rid of this money value and see numbers instead, you will be playing the market's conditions, instead of your emotions desires. IMO the money value doesn't need to effect and control you decisions.

To quote Ryan, "Money changes it all".

It comes back to fit yourself to the market instead of trying to fit the market to yourself. Controlling yourself instead of trying to control the market.

The hardest thing to do, maybe.


Ben
  • #44,219
  • Edited 7:09pm Sep 19, 2009 6:44pm | Edited 7:09pm
.....the best I've ever seen as a guest. I know that sounds repetetive but it's the story.
Thanks to the stuff I've l've learned here I'm still holding the same account since Feb 09. Suffered big losses at the beginning due to the ovetrading and beeing oblivious of a simple principles like MM and imporatance of S/R lines.
Now slowly but consistently getting my way back, learning to read the price action evoultions, mantaining stiff money management and not allowing the winners to become a loosers. It's just amazing, it works. Takes a time but IT'S PREDICTABLE AND PROFITABLE !!!


BIG BIG THANK YOU JIM !!!! Thanks to your efforts now I'm having one of those A-haa moments.
I still have to grow up to the membership I would think, still lots of stuff to read and review in the thread.
  • #44,220
  • Sep 19, 2009 7:12pm Sep 19, 2009 7:12pm
Quoting benji533
BUT, do we calculate it right? If our oscillator is based on the close point of the bars, so we need to use the close points of the bars in order to check if there is any divergence. Does it make sense?
You're shortcutting the rest of the closes between Point A and Point B as if they don't count.

Switch your chart to a line chart , look at your peaks and troughs and you'll see where your going wrong on that point straight away.

It doesn't matter if we aren't drawing them the most correct way. They're one of the strongest tools we have the way we currently use them anyway.
Bundy's status today: "Waiting..."
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