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We all need pivots to win..yes or not? 13 replies

The System (Irony included) 1,175 replies

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The System II (Yes with irony)

  • #4,821
  • Sep 8, 2009 8:16am Sep 8, 2009 8:16am
Quoting Froggy10
i think jplo should take the bulls.. he's a spaniard they're very good with bulls.. go jplo.. take them down..lol
Jejeje ....
I love bulls........
also love bears...... jejeje
Both are lovely animals....
  • #4,822
  • Sep 8, 2009 8:40am Sep 8, 2009 8:40am
Hi Both,

After several years of learning two different methods and failing I have literally devoured this thread in a day, and read everything. I have cleared my system of indicators and started to use the 123.

The priciples are simple - however I am unclear having read all the pages you draw attention to what a FRACTAL is in this context - could you possibly explain it one more time for a newby - determined to become an oldie!

Many thanks for inspiring me again. I will do what I can to catch up and have intelligent and useful things to ask and contribute.

Mac
$urvive, Pre$erve & RESPECT THE TEACHER
  • #4,823
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:11am Sep 8, 2009 9:11am
Quoting mac1956
Hi Both,

After several years of learning two different methods and failing I have literally devoured this thread in a day, and read everything. I have cleared my system of indicators and started to use the 123.

The priciples are simple - however I am unclear having read all the pages you draw attention to what a FRACTAL is in this context - could you possibly explain it one more time for a newby - determined to become an oldie!

Many thanks for inspiring me again. I will do what I can to catch up and have intelligent and useful things to...
Very simple.

fractals or 123 are just guides. Let's say that they're your "indicators".

The real deal is at the time of the breakout. Here is where you need to play.

You can use either, I don't see any problem with that. They're just to keep your heads up for a possible trade. Don't worship them. It's just another tool.


The thing you need to master is the actual unbalance - breakout.
Peace
  • #4,824
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:31am Sep 8, 2009 9:31am
Quoting feb2865
Very simple.

fractals or 123 are just guides. Let's say that they're your "indicators".

The real deal is at the time of the breakout. Here is where you need to play.

You can use either, I don't see any problem with that. They're just to keep your heads up for a possible trade. Don't worship them. It's just another tool.


The thing you need to master is the actual unbalance - breakout.

One big drawback of trading "indicators" instead of price is that you begin to see a trade in every move the indicator makes. I tell you, I don't mock everyone using indicators. Actually you guys are trading off indicators...candlesticks bars ect are simply plain vanilla indicators.

But here's the deal:

The indicator is not the problem.....is how people implement them.

If you see the big picture, you should be able to see a naked chart and spot possible trades as quickly as possible. The rest is just a crutch.

Another thing is that indicators put traders too quickly in the comfort zone.....or trading in their toes.....not good.

Just a lil' advice for you my friend...


Keep on trucking.
Peace
  • #4,825
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:43am Sep 8, 2009 9:43am
2+ weeks in a row negative a lot I dont know why i cant make money with this system..
  • #4,826
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:46am Sep 8, 2009 9:46am
Ogna, Just keeping going dude, just make sure you load up lightly while you learning so dont blow yourself out the water. I am still losing each day but slowly I am seeing where i went wrong and what I am doing wrong to lose.

Today was the fact I increased the load at a bad time, also about 3 trades I could have limited my loss by I hoped they would turn into my favor.

Each day is another day of screentime, keep at it. Keep at it for 3 months at least before you decide its not working. What else you got to lose?

Quoting Ogna
2+ weeks in a row negative a lot I dont know why i cant make money with this system..
Survive and Preserve
  • #4,827
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:48am Sep 8, 2009 9:48am
Feb - after several weeks of practicing euro futures (6E) with 5min chart, I tried 144 tick chart. It seems like I see a lot more noise. Could you elaborate on the differences of trading futures with 144 tick & 5 min?

One advantage I see with tick charts is you could find a good spot to put the stop loss since there could be several smaller swing pivots on the tick chart that would just make up one candle on the 5min.

Thanks
  • #4,828
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:51am Sep 8, 2009 9:51am
Quoting Ogna
2+ weeks in a row negative a lot I dont know why i cant make money with this system..
you should bring up exactly what you're doing with charts if possible...
Peace
  • #4,829
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:53am Sep 8, 2009 9:53am
Need to clarify this, when I say lose, I dont mean a losing trade, or a streak of losing trades. I mean why am I overall so far down below then when I started the day.
Things might help that I know why I messed up today:

Position Sizing , I didnt do it correctly.
Taking too large a load in the middle of the day
Wising and being greedy. Several trades that went wrong actually broke me back to BE but I didnt pull the trigger to close. I hoped to get more profit. A BIG BIG BIG NO NO rule and I broke it.

So, I may have lost money at the end of the day, but I paid for my education I hope and will continue to until that education proves worth its money.

It will happen, I have faith.
Quoting en0x
Ogna, Just keeping going dude, just make sure you load up lightly while you learning so dont blow yourself out the water. I am still losing each day but slowly I am seeing where i went wrong and what I am doing wrong to lose.

Today was the fact I increased the load at a bad time, also about 3 trades I could have limited my loss by I hoped they would turn into my favor.

Each day is another day of screentime, keep at it. Keep at it for 3 months at least before you decide its not working. What else you got to lose?
Survive and Preserve
  • #4,830
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:54am Sep 8, 2009 9:54am
Quoting Ogna
2+ weeks in a row negative a lot I dont know why i cant make money with this system..
Onga, I reckon you starting trading too late and missing good trades at beginning of London session.
  • #4,831
  • Sep 8, 2009 9:57am Sep 8, 2009 9:57am
[quote=cunparis;3034238]Feb - after several weeks of practicing euro futures (6E) with 5min chart, I tried 144 tick chart. It seems like I see a lot more noise. Could you elaborate on the differences of trading futures with 144 tick & 5 min?

One advantage I see with tick charts is you could find a good spot to put the stop loss since there could be several smaller swing pivots on the tick chart that would just make up one candle on the 5min.

Thanks[/quote

I don't trade off charts. But.....

Honestly, as far as I can see, I don't see a whole lotta difference between the two charts other than noise..
Peace
  • #4,832
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:00am Sep 8, 2009 10:00am
I would also like to find out more please.
  • #4,833
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:06am Sep 8, 2009 10:06am
Quoting en0x
Need to clarify this, when I say lose, I dont mean a losing trade, or a streak of losing trades. I mean why am I overall so far down below then when I started the day.
Things might help that I know why I messed up today:

Position Sizing , I didnt do it correctly.
Taking too large a load in the middle of the day
Wising and being greedy. Several trades that went wrong actually broke me back to BE but I didnt pull the trigger to close. I hoped to get more profit. A BIG BIG BIG NO NO rule and I broke it.

So, I may have lost money at the end of the...

ohhhh that's a "behavioral" problem LOL.


If you quit now, that will be your biggest loss right there...
Peace
  • #4,834
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:08am Sep 8, 2009 10:08am
Yip, its called discipline and I lack it. The only way to get it is to well start doing it.

Nah, I can't quit. I am too close
Quoting feb2865
ohhhh that's a "behavioral" problem LOL.


If you quit now, that will be your biggest loss right there...
Survive and Preserve
  • #4,835
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:12am Sep 8, 2009 10:12am
1. go short at 4467 after 123
2. took the other side at 4495 after breaking the last hh
3.same as 2 (at4501)
4.took the short at 4464 after breaking the last ll
the question is what did i do wrong?
should i take this trades?
thnx a lot
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it's a huge gap tony, a huge gap.
  • #4,836
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:20am Sep 8, 2009 10:20am
I took those trades but in hindsight my brain turned off and hope turned on when I was in them.

here we go
1, tough,we got nailed there
2, tough again, we got nailed there.
3, double reversal candle and the lower of that candle broke and candle couldnt close over resistance.
4, that was play number #2 in action, you should have closed at BE when price came back and failed to break it
well that is what I see I should have done.

Losses happen
Quoting gevellber02
1. go short at 4467 after 123
2. took the other side at 4495 after breaking the last hh
3.same as 2 (at4501)
4.took the short at 4464 after breaking the last ll
the question is what did i do wrong?
should i take this trades?
thnx a lot
Survive and Preserve
  • #4,837
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:24am Sep 8, 2009 10:24am
Tomorrow, my action plan
Position size EVERY trade. No more then 1% on ANY trade.
If in trade and trade turns,exit as close to 0 as possible if price does NOT hard stop me out.
Survive and Preserve
  • #4,838
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:26am Sep 8, 2009 10:26am
Quoting gevellber02
1. go short at 4467 after 123
2. took the other side at 4495 after breaking the last hh
3.same as 2 (at4501)
4.took the short at 4464 after breaking the last ll
the question is what did i do wrong?
should i take this trades?
thnx a lot
o yeah.... you shoud take the trades.

You did nothing wrong. Losing is part of this business....it happens that we're in a middle of a bull run....

Remember, we don't have a crystal ball. If we do, we won't be posting here instead we will be forming a secret cult called "The Wet Junkies" or some sort of a crazy name like that.

capishe???


on the other hand....give me one reason why you shouldn't take those trades.

??????
Peace
  • #4,839
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:32am Sep 8, 2009 10:32am
Quoting feb2865
on the other hand....give me one reason why you shouldn't take those trades.
Because Euro was in a trading range and it's bound to poke out a few ticks and have false breakouts??

I didn't take any of those because I was waiting for a swing to develop. I finally entered long at 11:30 (EST) on the breakout and just exited for a small loss cause cable fell down hard.
  • #4,840
  • Sep 8, 2009 10:37am Sep 8, 2009 10:37am
maybe because in that time it was after a 160 p run?(for long)
and maybe like you side before, it's not a good day to mess with the bulls (for short)
just maybe....???
it's a huge gap tony, a huge gap.
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