Opening a live account, ACM/Dukascopy

Hi all, first post so please be kind!

I am currently looking to open a live account and have narrowed things down to two brokers, AC-Markets & Dukascopy.

Prior to evaluating the demo platforms my slight preference was Dukascopy.

Evaluated the software and found the Dukascopy offering more to my liking. I think the per trade cost would be slightly better too (but that’s not my main concern).

I was contacted by someone from each company and found the ACM representative to be helpful and not too pushy. He did mention slippage as the main concern why I might not want to go with Dukascopy but generally refrained from heaping scorn on them.

The representative from Dukascopy was, shall we say ‘considerably less restrained’ in his criticisms of ACM and is very pushy about opening an account ASAP.

So now I’m confused!

From a platform perspective I still prefer Dukascopy but fell uneasy about the way their representative comes across.

I’m guessing that in the long run it probably won’t matter which broker I choose but right now the Dukascopy representative is pushing me towards ACM!

If anyone has any sensible comments that would help me make up my mind I would be very grateful.

Thank you

Decide which one you prefer losing to better.

What is the cost per pip you are willing to give up without batting an eye lid? is it $0.01, $0.05, $0.10, $0.25, $0.50, $0.75, $1.00, $10.00. See which one can accommodate you best on your terms. if theirs don't suit you go elsewhere. That is why it is called the market.

Don't concentrate on the leverage offered, look at your trading methodology, and ensure you have tested it on demo for 2-3 months with success rate of 50-75% success rate. With Risk reward ratio of 1.3 or greater, there after you should be fine. Also never practice with a level of demo greater than you will actually be going live with. The difference in moving from a $10K demo account to using a $1k live account is sooo great, that you will only realize with the frequency of the (potential) margin calls. Why? The Staying Power is all the difference.

Sure Stop Losses etc. play a part but at the end of the day do go for more than you are prepared to lose.

Makes no sense?

Then my friend do yourself a huge favour!! Spend some more time learning to manual trade, the possibly supplement your system with auto trading. But Educate yourself properly.

Remember that the Brokers and the Market Makers are the only ones making money 24/7. In fact they make up 90% 0f the 95% that always win. Simple... you miss they smile. They are professionals at winning from those who can't take the time to properly educate and prepare themselves prior to live trading.

Don't practice with live money! That is what demo is for, but as you transition ensure what you trade is what you practiced or else don’t be surprised when the results differ to your sorrow.

Remember the successful trader is the one that takes advantage of the market, by repeatedly and consistently turning a profit. So you are a great trader eh?, let’s see your account balance over the last six months of your trading? Now that’s what I'm ranting about.

May the mistakes from which you learn not be all yours

Bless you.

Regarding Dukascopy: Check the last 15-20 pages of this thread. FapTurbo Evolution peeps are SCREAMING about inability to open trades, hit tp, disconnects, etc.. The famed Duka Liquidity doesnt appear as unlimited as touted. (of course when you have 2000 traders all trying to make the same trade in a 2hr window things get crappy but...) - Casually reading the thread really turned me off of Duka. BUT they do have a sweet MT4-->>Duka bridge I've been using on demo that works wonderfully!! Just something to think about...

http://www.donnaforex.com/forum/index.php?topic=519.0

fulltime247

Thank you for your response, the experiences of those EA users give an interesting insight to Dukascopy liquidity.


pathumracled

Thank you for your kind words, I'll bear your sentiments in mind.

What exactly is it that you want to know? I mean, what would be the important information that you are looking for?

In both cases these are brokers that are regulated by the FINMA and as you probably know, due to your vast research that you have obviously carried out (I really hope you did!) this is the governing body that is making huge changes at the moment within Switzerland, all for the good. Both these brokers are in line to receive the now required bank license, something that should offer the client greater protection of funds, as well as open up new markets to trade in. The changes in Switzerland have been so severe that only 3 or 4 brokers (of major name) have survived, a positive sign you will agree.

Regarding the individual platforms of these two brokers, I know from experience that the ACM platform is very responsive and user friendly and has won a few awards, some this yera even. I honestly am not aware of ever hearing of Ducacopy receiving any awards.

As far as the Ducas sales guy you had, I think that it is down to the individuality of the person on the phone, had you landed on another Ducas rep, he might have been less scathing of their competitors and more professional than the firs guy.

Only other point i can think of is to consider the amount you are wanting to open with. With Dukas you need a minimum amount of $50,000 (I think there is a limited time $10,000 minimum to open offer if you want to trade the slowly failing Fapturbo they have)
With ACM the minimum is of $2000. So have a look at your wallet first....

Hi JoeyG and thanks for your reply.

In an ideal world what I'm really after here is some reassurance from real live traders who have used ACM or Dukascopy for say 12 months + that these brokers are sound and give their traders a fair crack of the whip.

Searching through the various FX Forums it's relatively easy to find the 'those thieves stole my money' / 'hunted down my stop' / 'deleted my profits' posts.

Whether these posts are from disgruntled newbies having blown their first account, employees of competing brokers or just genuine traders getting a raw deal is not always completely clear.

Harder to find is testament that real traders are getting a fair deal. Again, not someone new to the Forum with 17 posts all saying 'this broker is great!' if you get my drift. I guess if you are a successful trader you would probably not spend too much time leaving messages on Forums like this but I live in hope!

FINMA was set up just nine months ago and as I understand it is the organisation that will grant the banking licences. As these licences have not been granted yet do current claims to be ‘regulated by FINMA’ really mean anything?

From a day to day trading perspective I don’t believe being granted a banking licence will make any real difference to me other than the confidence that the company has been checked out and rubber stamped as sound. It might enable the brokers to offer segregated account with lower minimum deposits though.

Regardless of whether or not I have the acumen to actually turn a profit as a trader, Refco, Aleccohfx, Crownforex etc– all make me nervous.

I am worried that I will place my $50,000 US with a Swiss broker only to find that irregularities uncovered during the review for the banking licence lead to them going the same way as CrownForex (along with my money).

Coming back to the platform issues, both are undoubtedly good but I marginally prefer the way the Dukascopy platform displays completed trades, stops and limits on the graphs. Seems easier to attach and manage stops and limits too.


Thanks again for your time

There is a possibilty to trade with Dukascopy via

www.sparenfx.com

e.g. look up EURUSDk to trade e/u

I can give a few words on ACM, I traded live with them for my first experience. What they have to offer is definitely good, they are going to be implementing MT4 at some time in the near future. They don't stoploss hunt from my experience, they are STP from my live evaluation. There is absolutely no delay when requesting funds, you'll recieve it within 3-4 business days, even if it's for your original investment which is a good thing.

Their WYCIWYG is real, I've entered when there were some quick movements, and I always got it for what I clicked, even if there was a delay that would have otherwise entered me 2-5 pips later.

They only allow hedging on accounts $50,000+ so your good there, they do deal with the largest LP's in the world, it's deffinately not a back alley bucket shop.

That's all I can really tell you.

ACM = Certified Crap - YOU WILL GET YOUR MONEY STOLEN FROM YOU!! - Police Raided Them Not Long Ago - http://www.forexpeacearmy.com/public...ac-markets.com

Yeah, that's definitely going on, I personally didn't have a problem with anything, but research is key, some people have good experiences, and some have bad, at this particular point, my advice is to not put $50,000 into ACM, if you want to give them a try, use a smaller amount.

Thanks all

I never have problem with ACM, I trade with small standard account ($200-$50000). My money back to me is good, never delay unless there is a week end between. It have nice, good execution. A good idea is to do the demo and to keep learning (which mean keep a record when a mistake happen so you learn to recognise ahead of time and avoid it again, this also teach you to have a good plan B in your sleeve) , when you feel ready, at beginning open small live account (+- $5,000) BUT also keeping to use the demo next to it to try out trading idea before doing it on live. Quickly you will feel more confident in the market.
If you like to try the MT4 you should ask if they offer yet as demo before they do it for live.

Withdrawal from my broker (Dukascopy) is very quick, 3-4 days. The annoying thing for me is that unlike what I know of ACM, my broker still only accepts wire transfers! As for the sales guy you got, I agree with JoeyG, he must be new and hungry! He got a bit carried away LOL. It is also true to say that if you are wishing to start small...$50,000 may be a little steep...but nothing to stop you using the demo, you never know how confident you will feel after a few weeks of trading. One thing I do remember though, when I went demo, it only lasted under a month, to extend it I had to contact the broker who really wanted me to go live, I had to argue a little before I got a second shot of demo. If you go live, they will gladly keep your demo open alongside for you to practice on.

Hi atb,

To put your money into either ACM or Dukascopy when both do not have a banking license, but are required to do so by Swiss legislation within the next few months is extremely risky.

If ACM or Dukas had only been around since the last year or two (Crown Forex etc) then I would say yes be careful. But ACM has been around since 2002 and Dukas since about 2004/5.

The fact that they are both waiting for their license shows that they have what it takes now, as well as before, or they would be gone like all the others.

Regarding the police story, looking at the information available it was caused by an unsatisfied client and took place in April of this year, nothing was ever heard again and trading has remained as good as ever. Since that date ACM has continued to do new things like open an office in Zurich, they are about to offer MT4 to us and won an award in London...not the sign of a broker who is out to abuse you.

Hi atb,

Another word of advice: Beware broker shills...ie the "possibility" of brokers pretending to be traders telling how great their experience of company xyz was/is.

I would be particularly suspicious of comments singing praises/defending broker xyz if posted from new members (ie less than 6 months/less than 100 posts/no vouches) etc.

I would be more inclined to listen to advice given from members on this forum who have a trading history within FF.

Cravat Emptor.

Thanks to all who have replied.

Having checked out the demo platforms for a couple of weeks now my conclusion is that there are aspects of both platforms that I really like. Either would probably do fine. Have kind of come round to preferring the ACM one.

Regarding the Banking Licence issue, I'll feel a lot happier once these are in place. This is 'only a matter of weeks' according to Dukascopy! We shall see.

In the mean time and taking into account all your comments, I am going to open a $5000 mini account with ACM and trade 10,000 EURUSD mini lots. This will give me the same deposit size - trade size ratio that I intend to use with a better financed account. Only downside is a 4 pip spread but should not make any real difference in the long run.

Who knows, by the time the Banking Licences come through I may even be turning a small profit!

Thanks again all.

4 pip spread in eur/usd? Funny.

What methodology will you be using?

Manual Trading?
EA trading?
Both?

Hi all,

Quick update with info for anyone else considering opening an account with ACM.

Account opening process.

Fri 11th Sep
Posted (international signed for) completed application form, my original passport (no need to pay solicitor to certify) and a recent electricy bill.

Mon 14th
ACM receieved documentation
ACM supplied funds transfer info
Instructed my bank to send funds

Wed 16th
Passport & bills received via DHL
ACM 'Compliance' email received asking for:
1. more information on your professional activity
2. your work address, website (if exists)
3. your job title and a description of the activity
4. more details on the origin of your funds.

My answers were (broadly)
1. None, semi retired
2. None, semi retired
3. None, semi retired
4. Savings and profit from property sales

Must have been ok!

Thu 17th
My bank actually make the trasfer after much messing around!

Fri 18th
ACM receive funds and open my trading account

Mon 20th
Make my first trade!

So overall a pretty painless process apart from my bank dragging their heels!

Live trading

Only 7 trading days completed so far and only with 10k lots, but observations are:

Stops and Limits are honoured with no slippage
Spreads only widen a little during news events
(say from EURUSD normal of 4 pips to 5.5 - 6.5)
Spreads widen 1 min prior and a couple of minutes post news event.

Scalping does not seem to be a problem although stops can only be set at 2 x spread (for my mini account thats usually 8 pips off the current
bid or ask price).


Get the occasional red 'trading temporarily suspended' box, twice for about 30 seconds, once for about 15 minutes (Friday evening) when the ACM web site was also jammed. Hasn't caused me a problem yet and does not seem to be tied into news events.

Hope this helps someone!

Cheers