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THV system, final edition

  • #12,161
  • Jul 17, 2009 5:18am Jul 17, 2009 5:18am
Quoting IrishPips
The thin line of the trix is the signal line--you had a valid trade.--however notice on your trade it told you a bigger picture--- your divergence trend ultimately didn't end up going very far.

On the bigger picture this was a very nice divergence trade within the major trend. Way to go.

[happy dance]
Not sure if I understand, IP. Would you mind to elaborate?
Trading Makes Money!
  • #12,162
  • Edited 6:26am Jul 17, 2009 5:38am | Edited 6:26am
Quoting Cencored
Thank you for your thoughts IP. How high a tf do you check before you pull the trigger on the m1? do you go all the way up to H1?
LOL..I always pull the trigger--however, I always [I mean always] especially on a major trend that you traded against , that there is nice free fall and the trend has gone on a while --where the trend is taking a breather of sorts.

Looking at the 15M charts you rode a 15M "wave"

Divergence trades I never expect much--and I don't "aim" for lines-- with any given valid trade I only aim for a small bite--- on this example you can see the initial effort to get back to the pivot was tremendous-- almost to the 61 fib-- taking that intoconsideration, I would be extremely cautious with a next trade, only aiming for the 61 line until I know where things were going. [most waves within a continuing regular trend only "pullback" 61 percent--sometimes 38 when it's super strong.

Here is your trade from a 5M standpoint [MTF trix will look different becasue it's stretched out like a funhouse mirror on 1M] always best to look at 5M analyse chart

trend reversals start slow [in most cases] this could have been perceived as a breakout since the first initial effort was so great [although a skilled eye would see it as a false one]

PS-readers: please forgive me if you see typos: I am dyslexic and have difficulty typing--[always editing to make it look good]

People who use auto fib drawers aren't getting accurate results-- you should always draw your own from the top/bottom of last "wave" and should always be drawn from the next higher TF up.


I put the vertical line after your entry beacuse you got in on the bullish engulfing candle and you hopped off at the little red candle
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: trade2.jpg Size: 130 KB
--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
  • #12,163
  • Jul 17, 2009 6:32am Jul 17, 2009 6:32am
Wow.. I really like this tip...lets one see a much larger period of time on a particular TF. Thanks for sharing!! Gives some more perspective on my previously unknowingly narrow view.

Thanks for posting a seemingly obvious tip to many... but not all.




Quoting Cencored
Lol, how was the movie?

I wanted to share something with you that I found really helpful, which I am sure, many of you have discovered already, but it cant hurt to say it again:

instead of changing the tf from 1m to 5m, I find it very helpful to just zoom out one or two levels. Very quickly this reveals t/l's on PA and trix, very handy if you are into drawing heaps of trendlines
Pipnosis "Mistakes are the portal of discovery." - James Joyce
  • #12,164
  • Jul 17, 2009 7:56am Jul 17, 2009 7:56am
I think a few shorters got caught with their pants down...... I guess we all make sily mistakes the trix on the 5 min was clearly showing up when that candle pierced the T/L...if you don't pay attention, you get burned...nice retest of the 23.6 which gave an indication of the break down after the spike...
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Deprive a man of everything and you give him nothing to lose.
  • #12,165
  • Jul 17, 2009 9:44am Jul 17, 2009 9:44am
Let's see if it will give more than 10 Pips...5 min looks ify...

Considerations:

1.) 15 min Analysis - 3 time rejected at 23.6% Fib and TrendLine
2.) 1 min Break of T/L and Trix Cross
3.) ICCE Break of Top to 61.8
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: thv mtf 1076.jpg Size: 173 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: icce 116.jpg Size: 170 KB
Deprive a man of everything and you give him nothing to lose.
  • #12,166
  • Jul 17, 2009 9:44am Jul 17, 2009 9:44am
IrishP,

I like your personalization of THV and its clear, uncluttered look .
Have been trading it on a 1min chart for 3 days now and good success.

Thanks!
  • #12,167
  • Jul 17, 2009 11:02am Jul 17, 2009 11:02am
Quoting Heilpraktike
Congratulations, but i had only losses with THV today
If you post your losing trades, with corresponding charts, we can try to help you improve your THV trades.
  • #12,168
  • Jul 17, 2009 11:26am Jul 17, 2009 11:26am
Could someone explain to me how to determine the stop loss using the ATR. I would appreciate it so very much.

RickyD
  • #12,169
  • Jul 17, 2009 3:34pm Jul 17, 2009 3:34pm
Quoting RickyD
Could someone explain to me how to determine the stop loss using the ATR. I would appreciate it so very much.

RickyD
Take the ATR amount and use that as your stop loss or just more than it...it is 3 times the Avergage True Range of the last 20 candles, if I'm not mistaken...
Deprive a man of everything and you give him nothing to lose.
  • #12,170
  • Jul 17, 2009 3:34pm Jul 17, 2009 3:34pm
Quoting RickyD
Could someone explain to me how to determine the stop loss using the ATR. I would appreciate it so very much.

RickyD
THV ATR indicator -the number it gives you- is a suggested minimum S/L you should be considering when you place the trade--and it will fluctuate as the market volatility changes /fluxes.

Higher the volatility the higher the number is going to be. Also trading on higher TF's will give you a higher number value.

It's only meant to give you an idea given the market conditions.

Hope this helps.
--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
  • #12,171
  • Jul 17, 2009 3:36pm Jul 17, 2009 3:36pm
Quoting jtpada
IrishP,

I like your personalization of THV and its clear, uncluttered look .
Have been trading it on a 1min chart for 3 days now and good success.

Thanks!
You're most welcome.


--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
  • #12,172
  • Edited 4:16pm Jul 17, 2009 4:00pm | Edited 4:16pm
What's already said about the ATR SL is Ok and answered the question, just an additional suggestion.

Lets see this USDCHF chart.

Let's say we took a short after confirmation on the Pin bar at 774 and the ATR said 45 Pips, that would be more than less what we want to risk but we have 50% Fib and a Historical R line, so we set the SL a little bit over that values ( in total 52 Pips) to protect our SL, we don't just set blindly what the ATR tells us.

When you see that there is a very good reason that your position was wrong you might consider to get out the trade before your SL.

Have a great weekend everybody.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #12,173
  • Jul 17, 2009 5:21pm Jul 17, 2009 5:21pm
Quoting IrishPips
LOL..I always pull the trigger--however, I always [I mean always] especially on a major trend that you traded against , that there is nice free fall and the trend has gone on a while --where the trend is taking a breather of sorts.

Looking at the 15M charts you rode a 15M "wave"

Divergence trades I never expect much--and I don't "aim" for lines-- with any given valid trade I only aim for a small bite--- on this example you can see the initial effort to get back to the pivot was tremendous-- almost to the 61 fib-- taking that intoconsideration,...

I just got around to reading through your post in detail. Thank you IP.
A few questions that came up:
You say a skilled eye would see that it was a false breakout. Is that because it only went back to the 61% and got rejected there?

On your attached picture you say that trix line coming from below is not optimal.
What exactly was not optimal about it?

Thanks again, I have learned a lot from your analysis. I realize how important a fib grid is to determine where abouts in a trend one is.
Trading Makes Money!
  • #12,174
  • Jul 17, 2009 5:28pm Jul 17, 2009 5:28pm
Quoting cobraforex
[font=Arial][size=2]What's already said about the ATR SL is Ok and answered the question, just an additional suggestion.

Lets see this USDCHF chart.

Let's say we took a short after confirmation on the Pin bar at 774 and the ATR said 45 Pips, that would be more than less what we want to risk but we have 50% Fib and a Historical R line, so we set the SL a little bit over that values ( in total 52 Pips) to protect our SL, we don't just set blindly what the ATR tells us.

When you see that there is a very good reason that your position was wrong you...
Hi Cobra,
a question to the RSI: the o/s or o/b indicator is obviously different on every tf.
Do you only check the RSI on the tf that you take the signal on?

Lets say you want to take a 1m thv signal, and the RSI on the 1m looks good, however the RSI on the 5m is in the o/b zone. What do you do?
Thanks
Trading Makes Money!
  • #12,175
  • Edited 9:34pm Jul 17, 2009 8:58pm | Edited 9:34pm
Quoting Cencored
I just got around to reading through your post in detail. Thank you IP.
A few questions that came up:
You say a skilled eye would see that it was a false breakout. Is that because it only went back to the 61% and got rejected there?

On your attached picture you say that trix line coming from below is not optimal.
What exactly was not optimal about it?

Thanks again, I have learned a lot from your analysis. I realize how important a fib grid is to determine where abouts in a trend one is.
Trends just don't reverse--- they start on a small TF and build into a bigger one. A classic one is starting with a small retrace from the existing trend, then heading back in the other direction, but doesn't quite make it there--[on a bigger TF looks like hangman or hammer] Making such large moves so quick isn't typical--and one might say "smells funny" - some call these whipsaws. I have never seen a trend change that starts out on a small TF like that with a 61 retrace straight away.

While I've become quite good at recognizing patterns with in the trend, it's ever the constant game to figure out which sequences the retraces are going to happen--retrace from the prevailing H/L of the last wave I can see, the retrace from the next higher TF , the hourly retrace, 4hr, or even the daily....weekly, monthly... there's so many variables that it boggles the mind, and I find it hard to put into words...and it would take me loads of pictures to convey my thoughts.

The singal line coming from below [ or taking a trade in this condition] means that the overall momentum of the trend had an anomoly - you took that trade when there was a surge-- what goes up fast falls fast. Glad you took that trade on the 1M level--on the 5 I definitely wouldn't have touched it. [the prevailing trend was too long, also showing hits of divergence that the overall trend was going to change with the change of the signal line.

Your very best trades are going to happen when both lines change the same color really close to the 0 line and you get in on the "wave" at the very beginning or shortly thereafter this happnes. Having teh trix been a color for a while and then getting in when it crosses 0 [but has been that color for some time] puts a flag up that I shouldn't expect too much out of the trade.
--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
  • #12,176
  • Jul 18, 2009 9:42am Jul 18, 2009 9:42am
Hi guys,trying to catch up on the 609 pages of posts for this system,the question is do the divergences arrows signals from the thv trix indicator repaint ?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: yyy.gif Size: 34 KB
"Everything subject to destruction before even be created"
  • #12,177
  • Jul 18, 2009 9:53am Jul 18, 2009 9:53am
I check all TF's.

As more OB or OS signals you have at the same time on different TF's as higher the probability of the trade, mostly together with touch of R&S or fibs.

Quoting Cencored
Hi Cobra,
a question to the RSI: the o/s or o/b indicator is obviously different on every tf.
Do you only check the RSI on the tf that you take the signal on?

Lets say you want to take a 1m thv signal, and the RSI on the 1m looks good, however the RSI on the 5m is in the o/b zone. What do you do?
Thanks
  • #12,178
  • Edited 12:26pm Jul 18, 2009 12:02pm | Edited 12:26pm
Quoting plasvegas
Hi guys,trying to catch up on the 609 pages of posts for this system,the question is do the divergences arrows signals from the thv trix indicator repaint ?

after the candle closes for that bar no they do not-they do, however disappear after a time [ as well as the trix indicator] [depending on which version you use takes more bars [think the 5.0 is 750] to save on system resources
--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
  • #12,179
  • Jul 18, 2009 9:57pm Jul 18, 2009 9:57pm
Quoting IrishPips
after the candle closes for that bar no they do not-they do, however disappear after a time [ as well as the trix indicator] [depending on which version you use takes more bars [think the 5.0 is 750] to save on system resources
Thanks for the info ; those divergences signals are very powerful on 5 TF ,is anyone with some experience with divergences on the THV V3 would be kind to tell me if the direction given by the CORAL trend should be follow when entering theses divergences trade or be disregarded.
Just trying to get the best reward/ratio percentage ?
Regards
Pierre
"Everything subject to destruction before even be created"
  • #12,180
  • Jul 19, 2009 1:31am Jul 19, 2009 1:31am
Quoting plasvegas
Thanks for the info ; those divergences signals are very powerful on 5 TF ,is anyone with some experience with divergences on the THV V3 would be kind to tell me if the direction given by the CORAL trend should be follow when entering theses divergences trade or be disregarded.
Just trying to get the best reward/ratio percentage ?
Regards
Pierre
It may seem like that to you at first glance, but from my own experience, those arrows are just a warning --could be just a 1 candle divergence, or perhaps 2 or 3--perhaps the trend reversal, a retracement, or just a stall in action. Your best bet is to just trade the system as it was meant to be traded with all the right signals for almost flawless trading.

Not quite sure if this was the answer you were looking for, but if you were to ask me if I would trade the color of the arrows [green for long and red short short] just from those arrow signals I would have to have to say no.
--- Gone --- RIP 11/27/09
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