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Do you still believe in the perfect trading system?

  • #81
  • Jun 16, 2009 10:06am Jun 16, 2009 10:06am
Just a thought, for those of us that can not trade profitably yet, maby we should be backtesting or trading or something rather than yapping about shite?? I know Im also guilty of wasting time talking about unimportant things.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #82
  • Jun 16, 2009 10:08am Jun 16, 2009 10:08am
Quoting Leonlorenzo
Just a thought, for those of us that can not trade profitably yet, maby we should be backtesting or trading or something rather than yapping about shite?? I know Im also guilty of wasting time talking about unimportant things.
True, but im at work and my Trading and Exchanges is at home.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #83
  • Jun 16, 2009 10:30am Jun 16, 2009 10:30am
Shite serves a purpose of blowing off steam from trading those sideways moving prices.

Ok, no more!
Starting to see instead of just looking.
  • #84
  • Edited 7:06pm Jun 16, 2009 6:54pm | Edited 7:06pm
The statement "price is moving sideways" is an oxymoron...

To quote an fxstreet article in defence that markets can move sideways is ridiculous. The article is crap and nothing in that article tells me that the writer knows what he is talking about. It is written by a third party website owner in an effort to get visitors to his site "Oil n Gold". The writer can't spell, nor write English grammar and does not even use a spell checker...
Quote
Batural Gas: Net shoer positions has risen for the 4th consecutive week.
Gold: Net long position in gold futures increased by more than 10K contracts.
Silver: Contined increase in net long positions may trigger long liquidation

What makes you think fxstreet is an authority on anything?
In the days of old when sailors were bold, and seldom if ever contented.
  • #85
  • Jun 16, 2009 9:45pm Jun 16, 2009 9:45pm
Quoting smittens4212
Ooops! They must be wrong, price does not go sideways, physically impossible, RAWRRRRRRR. You're a petulant little child who needs to grow up .
I can sense irritation, frustration and many more in that sentence. Ya, this happens when your knowledge is challenged, and especially when you know that you are right.

But you have only few options now.
1) Give another justification (this time better than fxstreet, maybe CNN)
2) Admit you are 15 years old.
3) Leave the thread.
4) Quit trading since you don't know a simple fact "PRICE DON'T GO SIDEWAYS"

I am eagerly waiting to see where this thread is going in the coming days.
  • #86
  • Jun 16, 2009 10:31pm Jun 16, 2009 10:31pm
Quoting epilogue
I am eagerly waiting to see where this thread is going in the coming days.
Evidently it's gone from a discussion about belief in a metaphor to splitting hairs about the definition of a common trading term.

"Sideways market" (NOT price) is generally accepted and widely used trader's jargon.

It's amazing what people will get their panties in a twist over.
  • #87
  • Jun 16, 2009 10:48pm Jun 16, 2009 10:48pm
Quoting tunera
Hi all, after many years of trading, a question come to me, and it make me very curious about what other people think.

Well, the question is, do you still belive in the holy grail?

Be sincere, tnx
Yes. Yes and Yes. and there are more than one.

I know this because my father found one, used it and made a lot of money. He never told me what it was, but after his death i researched, met several of his friends, read his notes, went through his records and workings, etc. etc.

"Having odds in one's favor" is the grail. Go get it. It is just an arms lenght away.

And please don't challange me. Ask any successful trader, they will tell you the same.
The Thief of Wall Street
  • #88
  • Jun 17, 2009 12:19am Jun 17, 2009 12:19am
Quoting opie999
"Sideways market" (NOT price) is generally accepted and widely used trader's jargon.
Yeah, market moves to only one side that is right side, never to the left side. May be you mean that.

Or maybe not. Who knows? You might be talking about perception. Just change the perception of the chart BY 90 degrees and see what you get!!! SIDEWAYS MOVEMENT man!!! See the picture...

Attached Image


Man, I am just joking. You are getting serious. Just go through whole thread. Do you think people here will ever realize there is a "Sideways Market"? I don't think so.
  • #89
  • Jun 17, 2009 12:41am Jun 17, 2009 12:41am
Quoting epilogue
Yeah, market moves to only one side that is right side, never to the left side. May be you mean that.

Or maybe not. Who knows? You might be talking about perception. Just change the perception of the chart BY 90 degrees and see what you get!!! SIDEWAYS MOVEMENT man!!! See the picture...

Attachment

Man, I am just joking. You are getting serious. Just go through whole thread. Do you think people here will ever realize there is a "Sideways Market"? I don't think so.
Lol!! Ok, you got me good, epilogue. You're right of course. I'm taking this entire thread WAY too freaking serious. Sorry.
  • #90
  • Jun 17, 2009 9:20am Jun 17, 2009 9:20am
Quoting markmm
Price does not move sideways, it can only go up or down, when people say the market is sideways they don't actually mean that price has not changed. Go to a chart and zoom in to see. Would you ever say "My weight moved sideways today"? There might be a period where no orders are made, and price stays still, but it isn't moving at that point.
That sounds an awful bit like my first post, doesn't it?

Quote
I think you are making a semantic point, price itself either goes up or down, this is true.

Which is what this is, a stupid argument over semantics. Price doesn't go sideways, but it's a commonly used phrase and it's quite obvious what someone means when they say it moved sideways.

Quote
I can sense irritation, frustration and many more in that sentence. Ya, this happens when your knowledge is challenged, and especially when you know that you are right.

I just happen to think it's funny that Rastaman who has been trading for less than a year, believes he's some authority on trading terminology and had the gall to tell people they have "either never made a trade, or never should", along with calling people 15 years old, being in kindergarten, etc.

All the while ignoring the fact that I stated "price itself either goes up or down" in my first post, saying it's an issue of semantics and one that anyone with half a brain knows what the person is saying when they say something traded or moved sideways. But hey, at least I can read, having successfully completed kindergarten and all that-- you should think about it some day, Rastaman, it's an investment well worth your time (unlike trading hurrr I can make petty insults just as well )
  • #91
  • Jun 17, 2009 9:39am Jun 17, 2009 9:39am
Quoting pt49
The statement "price is moving sideways" is an oxymoron...

To quote an fxstreet article in defence that markets can move sideways is ridiculous. The article is crap and nothing in that article tells me that the writer knows what he is talking about. It is written by a third party website owner in an effort to get visitors to his site "Oil n Gold". The writer can't spell, nor write English grammar and does not even use a spell checker...


What makes you think fxstreet is an authority on anything?
Heh, in a post about grammar you seem to misunderstand what an oxymoron is (the phrase "price moved sideways" is not even close to one ), but the point was to illustrate that it's a commonly used phrase. It doesn't have to be fxstreet, it could be one of the thousands of results that comes up when you google something (be it equities, fx, commodities) trading sideways.

How about: "Sensitive Oil Price Moves Sideways as Market Eyes Opec Output"
"Fuel prices going sideways - where to next? Indian jet fuel prices kick up"
"Wheat prices to remain sideways to down"

It has nothing to do with being an authority on anything, it's a common phrase whether you want to be an asshole about it or not.

(for the record, oxymorons are two directly contradicting terms-- extremely average, same difference, etc., silly )
  • #92
  • Jun 17, 2009 9:56am Jun 17, 2009 9:56am
If there is no such thing as a Sideways Market I am now devastated at all that Time I spent in ICCE. What a waste.
  • #93
  • Jun 17, 2009 10:37am Jun 17, 2009 10:37am
Quoting LizardGizzard
The Holy Grail is discipline and trading S/R breaks with MM. It takes (for me at least) many years to come to the realization. The Holy Grail is an "understanding" of how the market moves. Also, trading about half as small as you think you should is crucial. You should never feel nervous when entering a trade. If you feel the slightest anticipation, then you are trading twice too big. But yes, there is a Holy Grail. And no, its not a magical system or indicator. It is simple understanding and disciplined implementation.
My man hit the target on this one. Experience speaks here.
  • #94
  • Jun 17, 2009 11:46pm Jun 17, 2009 11:46pm
Quoting Bemac
If there is no such thing as a Sideways Market I am now devastated at all that Time I spent in ICCE. What a waste.
No, that's not a waste man. You see people here now seem to believe there is actually a sideways market. They were asking for a chart and I posted the chart. Now they have no answer!!!
  • #95
  • Jun 18, 2009 6:21am Jun 18, 2009 6:21am
Let us suppose we are trading a 1 m chart (but this could be any tf).
Here are the prices for the Euro:
2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3939
2:03 - 1.3938
2:04 - 1.3937
2:05 - 1.3936 etc

Looking at the bars on the screen, I think we would all agree we could say that price is moving down across the screen from left to right (we are in a downtrend).

Now consider

2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3941
2:03 - 1.3942
2:04 - 1.3943
2:05 - 1.3944 etc

Looking at the bars on the screen, I think we would all agree we could say that price is moving UP across the screen from left to right (we are in an uptrend).

Now consider (however unlikely)

2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3940
2:03 - 1.3940
2:04 - 1.3940
2:05 - 1.3940 etc

How would you describe how the bars on the chart are moving across the screen from left to right if not 'price is moving sideways'?

Quoting Rastaman
Shite serves a purpose of blowing off steam from trading those sideways moving prices.

Ok, no more!
  • #96
  • Jun 18, 2009 7:25am Jun 18, 2009 7:25am
Quoting MissPips
Let us suppose we are trading a 1 m chart (but this could be any tf).
Here are the prices for the Euro:
2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3939
2:03 - 1.3938
2:04 - 1.3937
2:05 - 1.3936 etc

Looking at the bars on the screen, I think we would all agree we could say that price is moving down across the screen from left to right (we are in a downtrend).

Now consider

2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3941
2:03 - 1.3942
2:04 - 1.3943
2:05 - 1.3944 etc

Looking at the bars on the screen, I think we would all agree we could say that price is moving UP...
Using a chart yes, not everyone uses charts, if you are looking at a quote board at price, then price only moves up and down.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #97
  • Jun 18, 2009 8:16am Jun 18, 2009 8:16am
No.

There's no system or indicator that could be defined as holy grail.
But here are a lot of systems or indicators that could turn profitable if wisely used.
  • #98
  • Jun 18, 2009 8:25am Jun 18, 2009 8:25am
Quoting MissPips
2:01 -1.3940
2:02 - 1.3940
2:03 - 1.3940
2:04 - 1.3940
2:05 - 1.3940 etc

How would you describe how the bars on the chart are moving across the screen from left to right if not 'price is moving sideways'?
The example above is of price being static, the only reason It appears as 'moving sideways' is because time has passed, and time is an axis in your charting.

Although, I do recognise that this is just an arguement about wording. You might say 'price moving sideways' and I may say 'price not moving', were still both talking about the same thing happening.

Price moving sideways = Price not changing but time is passing

If nobody can find a problem with what Ive said above, then were all on the same page.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #99
  • Jun 18, 2009 10:12am Jun 18, 2009 10:12am
Quoting markmm
Using a chart yes, not everyone uses charts, if you are looking at a quote board at price, then price only moves up and down.

actually, no

if you are looking at aquote board, price doesnt move at all. you see changes in price, with upticks and downticks. you dont actually see the price move. visual price movement only deals with charts. no charts, no movement, just changes in price.
  • #100
  • Jun 18, 2009 10:35am Jun 18, 2009 10:35am
Quoting blacksun1
actually, no

if you are looking at aquote board, price doesnt move at all. you see changes in price, with upticks and downticks. you dont actually see the price move. visual price movement only deals with charts. no charts, no movement, just changes in price.
When I say move I mean changes to a higher or lower value, moving up and down the range of possible prices. Not physical movement.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
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