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How long did it take to become consistently profitable?

  • #41
  • Edited 12:06pm Jun 2, 2009 4:45am | Edited 12:06pm
Quoting Dopey
Intellectually, trading is not very difficult, it just isn't. However, the proper application is extremely hard and anyone interested in it should know all the reasons why. I can tell you that the key for me was developing myself as a person. It almost sounds cliche but it's true (all cliches are based on a truth). I spend more time every day working on myself than I do in trading, yet my trading is better now than ever.
Fantastic post, Dopey. My life also went "off the conventional rails" when I took a sabbatical from my last year at university to see what the Beatles had been doing in India some years earlier (I'm also in my 50s). I went for 2 months and stayed 3 years...

After 10 years trading, I still don't meet my personal definition of Trading for a Living - which is to make $10k or more per month - although I often have long winning streaks with very high % winners (around 80%); I have still not succeeded in my goal of having a calendar year with no losing months, as I blew it in January after a stellar Q4 of last year.

I often think that the search for spiritual enlightenment and consistent trading success have many similarities : they are both supremely SIMPLE, whilst at the same time being almost impossibly DIFFICULT to achieve.

J.
  • #42
  • Jun 2, 2009 7:08am Jun 2, 2009 7:08am
Quoting jtrade
After 12 years trading, I still don't meet my personal definition of Trading for a Living - which is to make $10k or more per month - although I often have long winning streaks with very high % winners (around 80%); I have still not succeeded in my goal of having a calendar year with no losing months, as I blew it in January after a stellar Q4 of last year.

I
J.
I think that trading for a living means to earn your living without a boss shouting at you for some mistakes you did not make, without staying in traffic for two hous on your way to work, etc... It simply means trading to earn a decent living. You have a tougher boss now - YOU! If you do not stick to the rules you will see that your goal to sit and trade is running away from you since blowing away your equity will mean a new job to put it back.

I traded stocks for 9 years and repaid all my debt - house, credit cards, car and saved some. The crisis did not blow my account since I exited early. Now I am trading Forex since september last year. I went up 80% then lost all the 80% so now I am back to the original equity but twice as smart . I am trading only demo now till my strategy will function corectly. It will have to generate constant gains for three months in a row. Then I will say good bye to my day job which I hate. I will have three bosses: me, my wife and my kid since I will have to provide for them. And is tougher than the boss at work. But I will stick to my dream. To trade for a living and to make a living from trading.
If you're not part of the solution then you're part of the problem.
  • #43
  • Jun 2, 2009 7:35am Jun 2, 2009 7:35am
that is what I think the problem with trading is...
it requires full dedication and occupies every minute of ur life ,

Im saying this cos I've not seen any part-time profitable trader...
in short , u cant just be average trader to be profitable , u need to be a pro in it...
To Live is the rarest thing in the world , Most people exist , that is all
  • #44
  • Jun 2, 2009 9:21am Jun 2, 2009 9:21am
Quoting Leonlorenzo
If your realy close to starting to trade profitably and consistently after such a short amount of time... I envy you.

Leon
That's a veiled warning hidden in a compliment if ever I saw one.

The problem with trading, and indeed life, is that you don't know what you don't know. Until you've traded different market conditions you won't really know if your trading methodology is going to make you really a consistent and profitable trader.

Keep your guard up.
The market reveals who we really are...
  • #45
  • Jun 2, 2009 9:44am Jun 2, 2009 9:44am
Dopey,

While my life has many parallels to yours I truly wish I could write as eloquently as you.

I just read your Brugge's story. Outstanding.
  • #46
  • Jun 2, 2009 9:57am Jun 2, 2009 9:57am
Quoting Dopey
Guess which post is mine.

http://worldheritagesite.org/sites/brugge.html

Wow. What a nice story. An even better job of putting it into words so we could imagine and understand so easily.
  • #47
  • Jun 2, 2009 10:04am Jun 2, 2009 10:04am
Quoting shadowninja
That's a veiled warning hidden in a compliment if ever I saw one.
I dont know what your talking about

How are you doing? Dont seem to post as much as 6 months so ago.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #48
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:41am Jun 3, 2009 4:41am
Quote
............but the best advice I can give anyone in their 20's is to follow any dream you have. Understand why people give you the advice they do, it's mainly to serve their interests, not yours. My mother was the only person who truly wanted me to have what I wanted. She supported me 100% in everything I did, no matter what it was. I was lucky to have had her support and her love. After 18 years, I still miss her terribly. Surround yourself with others that are also following their dreams....

Quoting Dopey
Thanks. I think trading suits people who are used to making their own decisions.
Dopey,
U are an .....
1 of the best posts many will learn from & be inspired with.
Affirms my beliefs & principles.
  • #49
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:42am Jun 3, 2009 4:42am
Quoting aediaz1
That's a really great story, I got the chill when reading it. Been to Brugge myself (summer-festival) and really enjoyed it. I'm not even going to try writing more about it after reading your post lol. Btw, what the hell are you doing trading ? You, my man, should write books.
I second aediaz1 here. awesome, Dopey.
hope u create a travel blog which will house all your travel memoirs.
  • #50
  • Jun 3, 2009 2:03pm Jun 3, 2009 2:03pm
Quoting Leonlorenzo
I dont know what your talking about
Leon, you said you envied the OP for becoming profitable within 9 months. I think the 'veiled warning' means that the shorter the perceived learning curve, the more likely it is that the knowledge attained may be incomplete. In other words, a trader who has studied the markets for 5 years is more likely to have experienced more different types of market conditions than one who has studied for 9 months.

Well, that's my take on what Shadowninja is saying. If so, then I can relate to it. I am profitable, in that I win more than I lose, but I only trade part time, and in demo. What is meant by being 'consistently' profitable? 12 winning months out of 12? 10 months? 8 months? I recall a post by TheRealThing where he said "A couple of great trades, or a month of great trades, or a year of great trades is nowhere near enough. To make 50 thousand-plus trades and be ahead, to be able to survive years of changing markets, politicians, governments, wives, ex-wives, good health, bad health--- while trading profitably is what you need from an edge." How will I ever know that my 'edge' is robust enough to last a lifetime?
  • #51
  • Jun 3, 2009 3:04pm Jun 3, 2009 3:04pm
Quoting hanover
Leon, you said you envied the OP for becoming profitable within 9 months. I think the 'veiled warning' means that the shorter the perceived learning curve, the more likely it is that the knowledge attained may be incomplete. In other words, a trader who has studied the markets for 5 years is more likely to have experienced more different types of market conditions than one who has studied for 9 months.

Well, that's my take on what Shadowninja is saying. If so, then I can relate to it. I am profitable, in that I win more than I lose, but I only...
A serious edge is robust enough (and there is only one, who found it know what i mean)
  • #52
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:21pm Jun 3, 2009 4:21pm
Quoting tunera
A serious edge is robust enough (and there is only one, who found it know what i mean)
So, if there is only one edge...... are you saying that Technical Analysis is worthless? Just trying to get a handle on where you're coming from.
  • #53
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:24pm Jun 3, 2009 4:24pm
Quoting hanover
How will I ever know that my 'edge' is robust enough to last a lifetime?
My guess is that its impossible to know.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #54
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:25pm Jun 3, 2009 4:25pm
Quoting tunera
A serious edge is robust enough (and there is only one, who found it know what i mean)
Just a guess, but are you saying that 'the trend' Is the only edge? I hope not.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #55
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:30pm Jun 3, 2009 4:30pm
Quoting hanover
So, if there is only one edge...... are you saying that Technical Analysis is worthless? Just trying to get a handle on where you're coming from.
Well, "technical analysis" is a concept that have soo many things inside of it, so no it's not worthless, technical analysis is the only way to analize the market and understand what's going to happen soon (so, make good trades), but surely of course here we're not talking about indicators.
  • #56
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:32pm Jun 3, 2009 4:32pm
Depends on the timeframe, if you trade monthly you are taking a lot less trades than 5 min. IF you make 6 trades a day and are profitable for a year then I think you have an edge.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #57
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:35pm Jun 3, 2009 4:35pm
it took me 4 years
  • #58
  • Jun 3, 2009 4:37pm Jun 3, 2009 4:37pm
Quoting Leonlorenzo
Just a guess, but are you saying that 'the trend' Is the only edge? I hope not.
No no sorry, i've expressed myself badly, sorry
  • #59
  • Jun 3, 2009 5:14pm Jun 3, 2009 5:14pm
some will spend 1 year behind the screen and will be profitable, some will spend 1 year refreshing the forum pages and ask oh god, i cant become a profitable trader, some will spend 1 year changing methods and systems, some will get the game right and realize that its the discipline not the system you use, those who'll get the game right in no time.

it's been almost 1 year and half, and still i cant achieve more than 7-10% monthly, why? because i've been one of those who kept changing systems!!!
I recommend you read something else as this sentence is now concluded.
  • #60
  • Jun 4, 2009 1:14am Jun 4, 2009 1:14am
Quoting Obaidah
some will spend 1 year behind the screen and will be profitable, some will spend 1 year refreshing the forum pages and ask oh god, i cant become a profitable trader, some will spend 1 year changing methods and systems, some will get the game right and realize that its the discipline not the system you use, those who'll get the game right in no time.

it's been almost 1 year and half, and still i cant achieve more than 7-10% monthly, why? because i've been one of those who kept changing systems!!!
Nice words
we cannot succeed without a well defined risk management.
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