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  • #781
  • Edited 11:29pm Mar 22, 2009 11:07pm | Edited 11:29pm
Quoting billye
one need to tell his profit goal and prove with his trade's track record, if it's above 50% a year, go talk to buffet... that's easy.

I believe someone could trade only this by long time of practice, but I'm not pursuing this stategy.

but 1st, this kind of trade do tell me when price are likely to bounce back or stall when I FOLLOW the trend. this is where I benefit from that... because you don't want to join a trend to follow and find it turn back immediately when you enter.

2nd but minor thing maybe is use market order to catch a trend causes...
But don't you think that a price channel works better, drawn by a resistance trendline connecting the peaks, and if you can draw a parallel line while connection the lower points, that the price will trade within that channel until broken and that it stays within the channel for a while. That is the classical example for timing entries and exits in highly leveraged markets, where your entry and exit has to be very good. See the channel in the pic, and what happens when it is broken with force.
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  • #782
  • Mar 22, 2009 11:15pm Mar 22, 2009 11:15pm
hi,,


geez everyone is getting confused here..I was replying to a question asking about something wwwin said....


The basic thing here is that without proof....the system is all guess work and there is no actual method...
  • #783
  • Mar 22, 2009 11:24pm Mar 22, 2009 11:24pm
Hi again,

Good discussion

I am a bit confused. I dont think these levels are meant for breakouts. Just bounces. According to Wisdomfx, not more than 2 bounces. As you know i just play 1 bounce.

Now what is a bounce? Say a level is at 550. Current price is at 530. Since current price is below the level (550), that level is considered a RESISTANCE.
When the price goes and touches 550, you short and take profit on the down side. According to me, i will not play when the level goes and hits 550 again. I will now wait for the next level (which could be at 600, or at 500). However, wisdomfx, might play it a second time - obviously he is more experienced with his method, maybe even a third, who knows.

Now once price breaks up out of 550 and reaches say 590. Then after hours drops back to 550. This level is now a SUPPORT (old resistance turns into new support). Basic S/R knowledge tells you, that, yes you can actually LONG from 550 and take profit whereever. So the previous RESISTANCE is now a SUPPORT.

So you dont really play any breakouts, when it comes to S/R levels. Also, my trading, when i say i play that level ONCE, i mean ONCE in that day... so if that level is tested again in a few days time, it still has some significant S/R properties, and i might re-trade it. Doesnt everyone? This is what i have learnt in my few yrs or trading. But in a daily view, i just trade a level be it a POWER level or my own fib/S/R/trendline levels just ONCE..

Dont underestimate the power of just simple fx trading ie. S/R lines, fibs, & trendlines.

That 3666 level is getting stronger and stronger. It is now the 23.6% Fib from the Low to the high of today - exact at the pip. Hehe. And 61.8% is the 3639 (power level at 3636) level. Not bad..
  • #784
  • Mar 22, 2009 11:43pm Mar 22, 2009 11:43pm
Quoting fx.ranger
Hi again,

Good discussion

I am a bit confused. I dont think these levels are meant for breakouts. Just bounces. According to Wisdomfx, not more than 2 bounces. As you know i just play 1 bounce.

Now what is a bounce? Say a level is at 550. Current price is at 530. Since current price is below the level (550), that level is considered a RESISTANCE.
When the price goes and touches 550, you short and take profit on the down side. According to me, i will not play when the level goes and hits 550 again. I will now wait for the next level (which...
Well that is exaclty what I mean. Did Wisdom ever say that a busted resistance PL becomes support when broken? In classical TA it does in theory, but is that his system? I don't think he ever said that. He does not follow any conventions, so basically anything that happens he can fit into a profitable trade afterwards.
  • #785
  • Mar 23, 2009 1:36am Mar 23, 2009 1:36am
hi all...


well I know this is no surprise....but he pops in after the others claimed wins and he just had to also claim a win...

CREDIBILITY........you have to be kdding yourself...


and he sure does not like his followers chatting over here.....I think it's just that he hates people discussing anything at all about his method as you can see there is not much substance on his thread...
  • #786
  • Mar 23, 2009 5:26am Mar 23, 2009 5:26am
hi all..


well one of them is being brave and posted a live trade..

long 1.3636, sl 25pips and Tp 20pips..

at first glance you say ok.....but then you notice it was for 4 lots..

so for a 80pip gain he is risking 100pips ( but was he ever going to use the Stop....I doubt it..)

The trade was down 36(4 lots *9)pips after entry and came close to the target but dropped.....sl was raised to 2 pips above breakeven and was stopped out.

This was not a bad trade as such....and is a good example of why wisdomfx needs to start giving live trades.....
  • #787
  • Mar 23, 2009 5:48am Mar 23, 2009 5:48am
Angler, you actually have to give him a credit for that level. If you look at price action around it, right now, you will see why. It worked out excellently.

Also, could you explain to me what you mean by the trade by WEDWED being down 36 pips? According to my platform and from his entry, there was drawdown of just 8 pips? Or are you somehow incorporating the size of lots played being calculated to the number of pips? I.E. 4 lots and 8 pip drawdown, means 32 pips? But thats ridiculous, because every trader has a different account size - so differnt drawdown?

I personally think that is misleading information - You cannot calculate such drawdown without knowing person's equity. For eg. If i was playing that same trade with a micro lot, then i would have 8 micro pip drawdown, which makes no sense.

Now, if a trader is OVERLEVERAGING is a different thing. Playing 4 lots on a $5000 account is a whole different story compared to playing 4 lots on a $250,000 account. HEHE.

I hope i make sense there. Good trade there, i have to give it.. just greedy for profit
  • #788
  • Mar 23, 2009 5:59am Mar 23, 2009 5:59am
hi all...


what are you talking about...try reading what is typed before you carry on....the 36pips was explained how it was determined...and if you read on the other thread.....he goes to great lengths to say he deals in $$ not pips..

so its important to explain the size of the drawdown.. and check the 2 brokers documents provided...they are lots not micro, mini....

And if you read the last comment....I said it was not a bad trade as such.....so give it a rest...
  • #789
  • Edited 7:10am Mar 23, 2009 6:23am | Edited 7:10am
Quoting Angler
hi all...


what are you talking about...try reading what is typed before you carry on....the 36pips was explained how it was determined...and if you read on the other thread.....he goes to great lengths to say he deals in $$ not pips..

so its important to explain the size of the drawdown.. and check the 2 brokers documents provided...they are lots not micro, mini....

And if you read the last comment....I said it was not a bad trade as such.....so give it a rest...
Calm down Angler,

So i am assuming you have calculated the risk/drawdown by the size he was trading (4 lots). You are correct, wisdomfx deals on his journal in $$ and not pips. So realistically, thats how you should be analysing this trade. WedWed's drawdown was -$320, which then came to +$800 (while TP was set to $1000) and then fell back where he had moved his SL to +$80.

But telling someone that he is RISKING 80 pips to gain 100 pips is WRONG. Stop loss was 20 pips and Take profit was 25 pips. Just because he is trading 4 lots, does not change anything. It all depends on your equity.

Am i right?

PS: Editing...The above underlined should actually read "RISKING 100 pips to gain 80 pips is WRONG"
  • #790
  • Mar 23, 2009 6:33am Mar 23, 2009 6:33am
Hi all...


The only person making misleading statements here is you fx.Ranger..

maybe you need to go read post # 338 on wisdomfx thread.


TP 20
SL 25

And whether it makes any difference to other traders....I stated nothing but facts..
  • #791
  • Mar 23, 2009 6:40am Mar 23, 2009 6:40am
Quoting Angler
hi all..


well one of them is being brave and posted a live trade..

long 1.3636, sl 25pips and Tp 20pips..

at first glance you say ok.....but then you notice it was for 4 lots..

so for a 80pip gain he is risking 100pips ( but was he ever going to use the Stop....I doubt it..)

The trade was down 36(4 lots *9)pips after entry and came close to the target but dropped.....sl was raised to 2 pips above breakeven and was stopped out.

This was not a bad trade as such....and is a good example of why wisdomfx needs to start giving live...
Here is the arguement. Thats what i am reading or any "newbies" would read.

There is NO 100 pip risk. Just 25 pips! EUR/USD averagely ranges between 150-200 pips a day!

4 LOTS makes NO DIFFERENCE when compared to HIS EQUITY.

How else can i simplify that?

PS: 1+1=2 ... Just because someone else has a bigger calculator, does not make 1+1=20
  • #792
  • Mar 23, 2009 6:52am Mar 23, 2009 6:52am
hi...


so did you admit in there somewhere you got it all round the wrong way....


And with the 4 lots mentioned...that should have been quite evident what I was talking about....NOW if I had of just said 100pips and with no mention of the 4 lots ...(.it was also translated to the profit target also not just the stop level)......you would have an arguement but as it stands you dont.

And the other point is...I was talking about a specific trade...and the values given were very relevant to that trade......
  • #793
  • Mar 23, 2009 7:05am Mar 23, 2009 7:05am
Angler,

I think we are both confused about each other's arguement. Yes i just re-read my post #789, where is should read RISKINING 100 pips to gain 80 pips .. my bad, just a typo!

My arguement is not that!
You are telling your journal readers that WedWed's trade was DOWN 36 PIPS initially - WRONG! It was down 8 pips.

His SL was 100 Pips - WRONG! It was 25 pips.

His TP was 80 Pips - WRONG! It was 20 pips.

Thats what i meant by MISLEADING information. What i am trying to stress is the trade itself does not matter to an individual regarding what size a person takes, but how many PIPS it makes, which eventually calculates, depending ON AN INDIVIDUAL's MM, the NET PROFIT/LOSS - in this case $80.

Ofcourse, then depending on your MONEY MANAGEMENT, you place you TRADE SIZE.

Wisdomfx, as you mentioned doesnt even talk about PIPS, just $$.

Does that make it clearer?

Sorry about the typo; i cant beleive you are not getting the CORE of the arguement.
  • #794
  • Edited 8:11am Mar 23, 2009 7:18am | Edited 8:11am
Hi all..


well I understand exactly what your talking about....

But if you read my initial post on the trade.....The Trade numbers were given as they were by the Trader in wisdomFx thread..

And then they were converted using the 4 lots.....if the 4 lots does not fit in with your trading all good and well....the initial numbers given.....given in the calculation for the 36pips also... would have been enough for a single lot trade regardless of the account size.....so simply...all the info was given regardless of what size trade was occuring.


And as you said...wisdomfx does not talk pips but $$....but to work out $$ you need to know...number of lots and the number of pips.......info that was provided in my initial post so the $$ could be worked out for that trade....based on info provided by the trader...

And if the trader is going to claim a $800 win....it is only fair to say he was prepared to risk $1000 to get that profit.....you cant have one without the other....now that would be misleading....dont you think....

Data provided in my initial post...based on a standard trade.

Entry... 1.3636
Tp ... 20pips
SL .... 25pips
DD ... 9pips

your arguement does not hold water...and seems like you only wanted to come in here to stir up trouble..
  • #795
  • Mar 23, 2009 8:13am Mar 23, 2009 8:13am
Quoting Angler
Hi all..

...

And if the trader is going to claim a $800 win....it is only fair to say he was prepared to risk $1000 to get that profit.....you cant have one without the other....now that would be misleading....dont you think....

Data provided in my initial post...based on a standard trade.

Entry... 1.3636
Tp ... 20pips
SL .... 25pips
DD ... 9pips
Now thats CORRECT. I agree with that statement. Thats the right/correct way to say it. For a lot of people, that $800/$1000 means a lot of money. For a few, that means just a very small percent of their daily income. It all leads back to what your CAPITAL is. But thats not for us to decide.

I was just DISAGREEING with the 80/100 PIP terminology. Since forex markets move/measured in PIPS. There was no such (or potential future) movement during that trade.

Now we are both on the same page
  • #796
  • Mar 23, 2009 8:25am Mar 23, 2009 8:25am
Quoting Angler
Hi all..

...

your arguement does not hold water...and seems like you only wanted to come in here to stir up trouble..

Ofcourse its a VALID arguement.

For eg., How can you tell someone, a person is risking 10,000 pips and targeting 10,000 pips. When instead he is just risking 10 pips and targeting 10 pips and playing with 1,000 standard lots (Warren Buffet, lol). The market only MOVES 10 pips! LOL, am i the only one seeing this?

Stir up what trouble? I thought this journal provided facts? I am providing facts.
  • #797
  • Mar 23, 2009 8:31am Mar 23, 2009 8:31am
hi all...


I dont think so......all the facts were in the initial post....you just wanted to pick the bits out there suited your arguement..
  • #798
  • Mar 23, 2009 10:37am Mar 23, 2009 10:37am
Hey Angler, you did not mislead anyone...if you had said that the price went down 36 pips then yes...that is not what you said, you clearly said the price went down 8 pips and multiplied it by the number of lots...This guy is just arguing with you to waste time and take the focus away.
  • #799
  • Mar 23, 2009 11:46am Mar 23, 2009 11:46am
Quoting wwwin
You don't mean the guy that FF banned, went to BP, got banned there, and now is back?
I didnt know he was banned from BP aswell, and im not sure what he was banned from here for, but yea that one.

This one has got all the angles covered and seems like a pretty smart guy aswell, could be interesting.
Living the adventure in my head.
  • #800
  • Edited 1:06pm Mar 23, 2009 11:54am | Edited 1:06pm
Quoting Angler
Hi all..


well I understand exactly what your talking about....

Entry... 1.3636
Tp ... 20pips
SL .... 25pips
DD ... 9pips

............... would have been enough for a single lot trade regardless of the account size.....so simply...all the info was given regardless of what size trade was occuring....

Hi Brother Angler .. just want to tell you that DD 9pips is wrong
becase i took trade in the end time of candle once i saw that Pattren formed i make my action ... so this trade dose not has DD only spread..

but it dose not mean that all my trade will be no DD .. i am in Forex and i will got TP and SL and DD .. and in the end it is all about how trader manage his account.

i am allways looking for any help to improve my trading becase i am here to learn.

http://www.forexfactory.com/attachme...1&d=1237799179
Never sell @ lower upward channel unless breacked and vise versa .
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