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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #23,301
  • Edited 3:40pm Mar 7, 2009 3:25pm | Edited 3:40pm
Quoting ghous
Talking from the James16's school of thought...

What I am looking at on the daily is a great breakout and then the pullback to the 1275 price level where we had those cluster of bar highs. Moreover the day closed above this level with giving the Friday bar a more pin bar kind of a look.

Although we're at a swing high with divergence there hasn't been much of convincing PA if you ask me. The weekly closed more like an indecision bar than a pin bar, and the daily keeps giving me the impression that we want to test 1.29 at least...

Regards,
Ghous....
That makes a lot of sense, ty ghous. Would you consider playing it if the pin had come down from the 1.30 level, and formed more of a true pin? I know there is that resistance there, perhaps if it were a better pin, you might consider playing it below the level you had listed? Or does that level just completely invalidate the trade?

I know pin bars are meant to be played on the break of the pin, and if there is resistance dead ahead, its not going to be a good trade. What I am wondering basically, is it ok to take these pins past these heavy resistance levels? On that trade I see 1.275, and 1.270 as the main level of concern... if that was say a better pin, would it be a good area to enter below the 1.270 area, even if it isn't technically the actual break of the pin? Or does the fact that there is resistance right where you'd normally play the pin, completely invalidate the profit potential of the pin all together? Sorry if this is unclear, hard to explain
  • #23,302
  • Mar 7, 2009 5:08pm Mar 7, 2009 5:08pm
Hey grinder

Thanks for the kind words, means a lot!

I think I understand your question, but if I am mis-interpreting just let me know.

If you zoom out a lot on the daily, we can't see any support areas. This tells me we are nearly in "no mans land"(see pic 1). So this immediately lets me know I have to go up a timeframe or two.

So if we jump up to the weekly now we can start to get a better idea of the zone for potential support(marked by the blue box on pic 2). This is the area for me. If you jump up even higher to the monthly you can see even more the zones effect on previous price (ie PPZ).

Now there are a few things. Just because I have this area marked off doesn't mean any old PA is going to be good enough. IMO if you found the Support on a weekly timeframe, you should wait for a weekly PA trigger. My reasoning for this is that the weekly should allow enough information where as the daily might give us false triggers until we find the appropriate area within this "zone". Be patient for the appropriate signals.

With that said also, we still have a gap to close, and these are something I will always take into consideration.

I hope I properly addressed your question let me know though,

Best,
Mike



Hi Mike,

I am reading up on Clockwork's new trading thread (based on J16's methodology) and ran into your post quoted above.

Clockwork's s/r areas come from the weekly TF and he uses them to trade off of the daily TF. In the above post you advocate trading the PA on the s/r areas of the TF they came from. So if its weekly s/r you're looking at then you should be waiting for weekly PA not daily PA on weekly s/r levels.

Is it riskier in your opinion to use daily PA setups with weekly s/r areas? In other words if you are looking for PA on the daily TF you should be using daily s/r levels and not weekly ones?

Wouldn't weekly levels be even more significant than daily levels?
It's all about cautious - and highly educated - wagering on probabilities.
  • #23,303
  • Mar 7, 2009 5:21pm Mar 7, 2009 5:21pm
Quoting Eclipse
gold weekly
pin bar off bar highs
possible target zone 1000$
yes sir. silver looking bullish too . . . anyone taking the pin on gold? silver moves too slow for me, but i like the gold pin.
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"Don't trade to trade . . . trade to win." - James16
  • #23,304
  • Mar 7, 2009 5:40pm Mar 7, 2009 5:40pm
Quoting miskec
im thinking about gold also, any pros and cons help?
I don't like the gold set up. The so-called bullish PB is low quality IMHO, and more of a neutral bar than anything else. Also, the two prior weeks, taken together, form a nice bearish PB at strong resistance. So these kind of cancel things out. I would be bearish on gold based on the two-week PB but for the fundamentals. Just my $0.02.
  • #23,305
  • Mar 7, 2009 8:53pm Mar 7, 2009 8:53pm
Quoting Santana55
Hey grinder

Thanks for the kind words, means a lot!

I think I understand your question, but if I am mis-interpreting just let me know.

If you zoom out a lot on the daily, we can't see any support areas. This tells me we are nearly in "no mans land"(see pic 1). So this immediately lets me know I have to go up a timeframe or two.

[b]So if we jump up to the weekly now we can start to get a better idea of the zone for potential support(marked by the blue box on pic 2). This is the area for me. If you jump up...
Hey S,

No it isn't riskier, or wrong or anything like that. If that is what you are comfortable with then that is fine. I have no idea how clock trades really. I keep things as simple as possible, part of how I do this is keep things separated for the most part. But for example on breakout trades I am usually going a timeframe lower to look for a trigger, so that is the same as dropping down to daily using s/r.

There is no one way to do this stuff. Just right ways to go about it. Learning key concepts and putting the pieces together in a way that works for YOU. My way is just how I have put the pieces together. Clocks is his way etc. You won't find one better then the other. It is what is better for YOU.

Hope that helps

Mike
  • #23,306
  • Mar 8, 2009 7:04am Mar 8, 2009 7:04am
Quoting scott087
I also took this and targeted 97.25-97.00 area....
This is also a question I still ponder. I am doing some testing on these two exit methods:
1. Taking first TP at 1:1 and moving stop to B/E from there. (This still isn't truly 1:1, if I get stopped out at B/E on remainder).
2. Taking first TP at first PPZ, which is usually 50-100pip and moving stop to B/E.

Although I am only testing them one at a time, you could/should? test them together. So the USD/JPY trade, you used option 2 perfectly (same trade/exit I used) and option 1 would still be in position, although would be down.

You could also take first TP at PPZ but leave stop at original placement... just another idea. There are countless solutions, and I'm starting to see that only experience/testing can provide an answer for each of us.

Josh
  • #23,307
  • Mar 8, 2009 11:23am Mar 8, 2009 11:23am

Hi to all, and congratulations for this forum I wanted to know if the support and resistance are well placed:
if it is improperly placed thank you to explain why.
sorry for my English and thank you in advance

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  • #23,308
  • Mar 8, 2009 11:38am Mar 8, 2009 11:38am
Quoting fxman85

Hi to all, and congratulations for this forum I wanted to know if the support and resistance are well placed:

if it is improperly placed thank you to explain why.

sorry for my English and thank you in advance

I see this is a 30 minute chart. If you are following the J16 approach then its best to draw these on the Weekly and Daily charts and wait to see how price reacts to those levels. If you are starting out stay with the Weekly and Daily before venturing down to the lower time frames.
  • #23,309
  • Mar 8, 2009 11:49am Mar 8, 2009 11:49am
Quoting Jduester
This summary is in no way intended to replace reading the whole thread.
Hey Josh,

Being one of the people who has gone over this thread thoroughly I would also like to commend you on your disciplined approach and methodical advancement through the J16 material.

Your post has certainly kept me busy this weekend. All the best.



  • #23,310
  • Mar 8, 2009 11:50am Mar 8, 2009 11:50am
Quoting fxman85

Hi to all, and congratulations for this forum I wanted to know if the support and resistance are well placed:

if it is improperly placed thank you to explain why.

sorry for my English and thank you in advance

Welcome to the thread!
Your S&R don't look to bad.But do yourself a favor and Listen to what is advised here about the timeframes.Read the first page on minimum requirments.See if this is for you.If you think it is read the thread.Check out this great post from jduester...post #23250 http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...2331&page=1550

This will give you a concentrated look into this thread.I must say you will not be disappointed in it's rewards!Hope that helps you...Josh
  • #23,311
  • Mar 8, 2009 2:04pm Mar 8, 2009 2:04pm
Quoting Scot Pippin'
I realize exit methods are largely unique to the individual but for me it seems that I'm better equipped to accept a missed longer ride as opposed to seeing 2% turn into a breakeven. I had two BE trades today. One because I wanted to try to let it run and another because I set my TP a little too far off. So that got me to thinking that I was too greedy on both trades. When I look over my trades for last few weeks I believe, aside from blatant rule breaking mistakes, that I'd be way up by just accepting half risk on every trade. Or by incorporating...
Hey Scot,

This is something i have been battling with in the last few weeks. From what i can see this comes down to finding out what kind of trader you are - a statement that is quite hard to fathom for a beginner. But gradually i am making sense of it.
I think that part the confusion comes from the different approaches that many of the senior members employ. For example (and i am sure they won't mind me mentioning) Mike manages to hold trades longer than most, and i have been trying to emulate that to a degree, but the important factor in this is that Mike is extremely selective with the trades he takes and turns down most of the trades that others on the thread make profit out of. Therefore by only taking the A+ trades he has a better chance of letting them run, and is not afraid of draw down after initially seeing profit.
As a comparison to this James16 and Jarroo might take many more risky(?) trades but are not expecting them to go very far and are often out at the first sign of resistence for nice profit. Jarroo has also stated that he does not like draw down, so it suits him to take profit and get to BE quickly.
To a degree as stated by James16 if you have a larger account then this method is very profitable.

But like you I have looked back at my trades over the last 3 weeks and realised that had i just taken profit earlier rather than hanging on I would be a lot further ahead. So i will be taking profits earlier and banking what i can, then on to the next setup. I found also that as i have a tendancy to not be a selective as Mike in the trades i enter, that I can not expect to hang on to them as long, and the emotional energy that this takes to manage them is at the moment beyond me. Is it really worth the anguish of seeing a little retracement/draw down to squeeze another 50-100 pips out. I don't think so at this stage. I just ended up watching every tick of the retracement and then hoping it would go back in my favour(which invaribly it does) -way too draining for me. Much better to have banked the profits and move on to the next setup. This is not to say that in future I won't change my approach, I think we all definitely evolve in this business and so you have to flexible.

There is obviously the flipside to not maximising your profits or letting the trade run, in the form of your losses being greater than profits. ie 5 small winners being eaten by 1 large loser. And although this is very important to remember, i have found that these setups taught here have a very high probability of winning, so for now I am not concerned by this. I definitely think I will be more profitable if I stop going for the home run on every trade i take - I'll be honest, I don't have Mike's patience and i will get myself into less credible setups. Don't get me wrong though I am not wanting to cut my winners short - I will still have a plan when i enter the trade - just a little less ambitious.

So as i stated in the beginning - all about finding your trading style - what fits your current ability and personality.

my thoughts anyways

Simon
  • #23,312
  • Mar 8, 2009 3:14pm Mar 8, 2009 3:14pm
Quoting simoncs
Hey Scot,

This is something i have been battling with in the last few weeks. From what i can see this comes down to finding out what kind of trader you are - a statement that is quite hard to fathom for a beginner. But gradually i am making sense of it.
I think that part the confusion comes from the different approaches that many of the senior members employ.
..........
So as i stated in the beginning - all about finding your trading style - what fits your current ability and personality.

my thoughts anyways

Simon

Hi Simon,

Very nice post.
Indeed, James16 is such a flexible method that it allows each trader to adjust it to their style.

Regards,
Miguel
  • #23,313
  • Mar 8, 2009 3:17pm Mar 8, 2009 3:17pm

I am new to forex and everyone said that the best trader is the daily, but I not understand how trade with daily Move not really
A more detail ?
thank you

  • #23,314
  • Mar 8, 2009 4:00pm Mar 8, 2009 4:00pm
Quoting simoncs
Hey Scot,

This is something i have been battling with in the last few weeks. From what i can see this comes down to finding out what kind of trader you are - a statement that is quite hard to fathom for a beginner. But gradually i am making sense of it.
I think that part the confusion comes from the different approaches that many of the senior members employ. For example (and i am sure they won't mind me mentioning) Mike manages to hold trades longer than most, and i have been trying to emulate that to a degree, but the important factor in...
"Don't trade to trade . . . trade to win." - James16
  • #23,315
  • Mar 8, 2009 7:43pm Mar 8, 2009 7:43pm
Watching...
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  • #23,316
  • Mar 8, 2009 9:21pm Mar 8, 2009 9:21pm
Quoting dunningduke
Watching...
Careful buddy,

We want these at swing lows, this one's almost at a swing high.

An important rule says "higher the Tf stronger the PA" Weekly's all bears, look how we closed last week and why...

Regards,
Ghous.
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I believe . . .
  • #23,317
  • Edited 9:52pm Mar 8, 2009 9:41pm | Edited 9:52pm
Quoting Jlr
That makes a lot of sense, ty ghous. Would you consider playing it if the pin had come down from the 1.30 level, and formed more of a true pin? I know there is that resistance there, perhaps if it were a better pin, you might consider playing it below the level you had listed? Or does that level just completely invalidate the trade?

I know pin bars are meant to be played on the break of the pin, and if there is resistance dead ahead, its not going to be a good trade. What I am wondering basically, is it ok to take these pins past these heavy...
Quote
I know pin bars are meant to be played on the break of the pin, and if there is resistance dead ahead, its not going to be a good trade. What I am wondering basically, is it ok to take these pins past these heavy resistance levels? On that trade I see 1.275, and 1.270 as the main level of concern... if that was say a better pin, would it be a good area to enter below the 1.270 area, even if it isn't technically the actual break of the pin? Or does the fact that there is resistance right where you'd normally play the pin, completely invalidate the profit potential of the pin all together? Sorry if this is unclear, hard to explain


It really all depends on how you're implementing this stuff to your trading JLR, there are ppl Like Raczekfx that dont even need These James price bars to appear, there are some (Mr.Trend was an example) that will take the not so great looking PA setups too and they succeeded mostly because it was the location that they wanted perfect to enter a trade. We also have ppl like Mike who will discard the Pin if it fails to go up by 5 pips to help the bar fall into the proper definition of a pin bar.

None of these are wrong approached but for you none may be right either. Question is what is it that works for you? If you're the Mike type wait for a better opportunity, or you could do what I qouted in your post above if you feel that the location (which BTW is great IMO) makes the trade valid below 1.27

Personally I would also eneter below 1.27 if price drops from here on, (I am most probably passing on this one though cuz I've lined some already but just trying to tell you how I would have gone abt it...)

Regards,
Ghous.
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I believe . . .
  • #23,318
  • Mar 8, 2009 9:54pm Mar 8, 2009 9:54pm
Would have liked this one to close below PPZ, still one to take note of.
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  • #23,319
  • Mar 8, 2009 9:58pm Mar 8, 2009 9:58pm
Quoting ghous
It really all depends on how you're implementing this stuff to your trading JLR, there are ppl Like Raczekfx that dont even need These James price bars to appear, there are some (Mr.Trend was an example) that will take the not so great looking PA setups too and they succeeded mostly because it was the location that they wanted perfect to enter a trade. We also have ppl like Mike who will discard the Pin if it fails to go up by 5 pips to help the bar fall into the proper definition of a pin bar.

None of these are wrong approached but for you none...
Thanks man, that really helps me a lot, and I'm relieved you understood my question
  • #23,320
  • Mar 8, 2009 10:11pm Mar 8, 2009 10:11pm
Quoting NuckingFuts
Would have liked this one to close below PPZ, still one to take note of.
teh trend changer
Thank you Malcolm, Belekas, Jim, raczekfx and Ryanmcd !
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