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'Financial Terrorism!'

  • #21
  • Sep 23, 2008 10:27pm Sep 23, 2008 10:27pm
Generally speaking:
To say speculators are not to blame would be 100% false. The subprime fallout has cost around $500billion. ($1trillion in foreclosures resulted in 40-50% loss in value on short sales.)
The writing has been on the wall for a few years regarding subprime foreclosures. Subprime loans skyrocketed after 2001. The FED is supposed to oversee such activity and apply restrictions to avoid the fallout we're seeing now.
The FED will have lent nearly $2trillion by the end of this week. $500billion was lost on foreclosures in the process of writedowns and short sales. $1.5trillion was lost in the CDO market by bank and hedge fund speculators that were over leveraged. There are stories of small hedge funds writing CDO's for UBS mortgage amounting to 10's of billions at a premium of $4million per year. The hedge fund cleaned up until the CDO's were exercised and then the hedge funds collapsed.
Financial Terrorisers are on both sides of the debacle.
The FED is protecting banks at the expense of the public. If the global economy begins growing next year there will be a brief hangover, but if the global economy does not begin growing next year the hangover will last 5-10 years.
In the election we have a bad choice and bad choice. It's like 4 years ago because Kerry found Obama and postured him for this election. McCain; although more left leaning, was the most similar candidate to Bush. It's ironic. I'm conservative by definition which does not mean Republican. I like libertarian or constitutionalist concepts and I hate polarizing discussions, because divided we fail.
It really is that easy.
  • #22
  • Sep 24, 2008 12:09am Sep 24, 2008 12:09am
700 Billion $ can pay all mortgage pairs in the US their mortgages for the next 5 years...

Why not do that instead of attempt to save people who failed at their job?
  • #23
  • Sep 24, 2008 10:37am Sep 24, 2008 10:37am
I don’t think congress will allow all the stupid things Bush is trying to do with our money. But what I was to point out is the passivity in all Americans. It’s like no one knew about the financial crisis. The people who should be doing something to stop that craziness are just in silence. Even the candidates aren’t say anything radical about the situation and I sure people in the street don’t know anything about what is happing.
Life is a party!!! will you seat or will you dance?
  • #24
  • Sep 29, 2008 4:55pm Sep 29, 2008 4:55pm
VICTORY! But will it hold?...
  • #25
  • Sep 29, 2008 5:52pm Sep 29, 2008 5:52pm
Your Congress is clearly listening to the very informed sentiments that you all here have expressed. The results speak for themselves....
They have managed to loose America 1.3 trillion in the last few hours and without even getting a rescue package inplace..

Such leadership is truely inspiring.....
But then so is the deep economic insight that informs most of this thread ....
  • #26
  • Sep 29, 2008 6:32pm Sep 29, 2008 6:32pm
no they arent listening

they would have voted for it if it hadnt been for nancy's speech. that really pissed em off. the only reason it failed was because of politics.

this is the first time in a while that the american political system has actually done what the people wanted, even if it was through misguided and spiteful politics.
  • #27
  • Sep 29, 2008 7:17pm Sep 29, 2008 7:17pm
66% of house republicans voted against the bailout. 40% of house democrats voted against the bailout.

Inserted Video
It really is that easy.
  • #28
  • Sep 29, 2008 9:41pm Sep 29, 2008 9:41pm
Hey genius,

Noone has lost America 1.3 T in the last few hours. The only people losing money are the wanna be traders that don't know when to stop buying in an obvious bear market. The rest are making money like there is no tomorrow. It was an excellent day for me for example.

The banks over leveraged and are as a results getting what they deserve. The once that didn't are becoming bigger and are in position to take over other banks' assets pennies on the dollar. Wholesale prices baby!

You are one misguided twit. The only people who want to be bailed out are the huge corporations and investment organizations and of course rednecks... People called in their representatives 30:1 in opposition to the bail out.

This is called democracy ruled by people and not democracy for corporate socialism where we pay for corporations' mistakes.

Grow up. Read a book. I recommend Noam Chomsky.

Quoting cliffedwards
Your Congress is clearly listening to the very informed sentiments that you all here have expressed. The results speak for themselves....
They have managed to loose America 1.3 trillion in the last few hours and without even getting a rescue package inplace..

Such leadership is truely inspiring.....
But then so is the deep economic insight that informs most of this thread ....
  • #29
  • Sep 29, 2008 10:06pm Sep 29, 2008 10:06pm
It's not a democracy; it's a republic.

Are rednecks really asking for money? The mortgage losses are 1/4 the CDO losses. I didn't know rednecks were playing with leverage in the markets.

I'm messing with you for the most part. I'm frustrated in all this mess as well. Hedge funds with 400million were writing CDO's for 1.5 billion etc. It's all hog wash and the FED let it all happen. The FED bought up banks through JPM and Goldman. It's no different than 1929 when the FED sucked liquidity from the markets to suffocate banks and buy them for pennies.

These guys that don't care to know what really happened are not going to learn anything from you. The articles and knowledge are everywhere. The proof is everywhere. Save your energy for making money. Deep breathing helps.

Read a book; parrot someone else's ideas.
Meditate; channel ideas from their pure source.
It really is that easy.
  • #30
  • Sep 30, 2008 10:02am Sep 30, 2008 10:02am
Quoting The Fxorce
It's not a democracy; it's a republic.

Are rednecks really asking for money? The mortgage losses are 1/4 the CDO losses. I didn't know rednecks were playing with leverage in the markets.

I'm messing with you for the most part. I'm frustrated in all this mess as well. Hedge funds with 400million were writing CDO's for 1.5 billion etc. It's all hog wash and the FED let it all happen. The FED bought up banks through JPM and Goldman. It's no different than 1929 when the FED sucked liquidity from the markets to suffocate banks and buy them for pennies.

These guys that don't care to know what really happened are not going to learn anything from you. The articles and knowledge are everywhere. The proof is everywhere. Save your energy for making money. Deep breathing helps.

Read a book; parrot someone else's ideas.
Meditate; channel ideas from their pure source.

it's not even a republic anymore. it's an oligarchy disguised as a republic. when was the last time your congressman actually listened to what you had to say? if this was a true republic, you would actually be REPRESENTED by your congressman, not ruled by him.

but yeah, other than that, i totally agree with you. this whole situation just shows how our country is just decaying. we actually used to have respectable leaders and were a respectable country in the world's eyes. now everyone just looks at us as a bunch of fat redneck warmongers because that's who is running our country. it's disgusting and infuriating. im seriously considering moving to iceland or something.
  • #31
  • Sep 30, 2008 10:11am Sep 30, 2008 10:11am
Isn't the Iceland language the hardest language to learn in the world?
Isn't their country's debt being down graded?
I would move to the Caribbean somewhere if I had to leave the US.

Regarding our Congressmen they represented us yesterday for the most part. The next vote is Thursday and most likely the bill will pass. This first vote was a "dry run" so to speak. They just wanted to see what the market would do to them. I'm guessing since they caused one of the biggest down moves in history they'll vote the bailout through because no one wants to see a worse recession than we have now. We're a country of procrastinators. We're fat and stupid which is exactly what the government wants us to be so they get their tax dollars and people roll over easily. (pun intended. ha)
The only way out of the current situation is abolishing the FED. Then the recession would be mild and the people would profit from the economic prosperity.
It really is that easy.
  • #32
  • Sep 30, 2008 11:08am Sep 30, 2008 11:08am
Aye. When the bail out passes, watch what happens to the USD in the long run.
  • #33
  • Sep 30, 2008 11:30am Sep 30, 2008 11:30am
These are the guys that want a weak USDollar. They don't care about that. They just want to make a ton of money off their newly acquired banks. If the bailout passes they'll be instantly profitable through their JPMorgan branch. If the bailout does not pass they will feel a pinch for a couple years as defaults rise again but ultimately they can buy up mortgages for pennies that are still worth the wood and labor to build so within a couple years they'll be making money.

Also if bailout fails oil will drop to $60 in a week.
USDJPY will drop 1000 pips.
Dow Jones will see 8000. (2500 point drop)
It really is that easy.
  • #34
  • Sep 30, 2008 2:11pm Sep 30, 2008 2:11pm
Quoting The Fxorce
Isn't the Iceland language the hardest language to learn in the world?
Isn't their country's debt being down graded?
I would move to the Caribbean somewhere if I had to leave the US.

Regarding our Congressmen they represented us yesterday for the most part. The next vote is Thursday and most likely the bill will pass. This first vote was a "dry run" so to speak. They just wanted to see what the market would do to them. I'm guessing since they caused one of the biggest down moves in history they'll vote the bailout through because no one wants to see a worse recession than we have now. We're a country of procrastinators. We're fat and stupid which is exactly what the government wants us to be so they get their tax dollars and people roll over easily. (pun intended. ha)
The only way out of the current situation is abolishing the FED. Then the recession would be mild and the people would profit from the economic prosperity.

You need to get your facts straightened out..... yes yesterday was the biggest point drop in a single day but when compared to % drop it was not nearly as bad as the press and wall street want you to believe.
Monday's market plunge may have been the worst point drop ever for the Dow Jones Industrial Average but in percentage terms it came nowhere close. It dropped 7% on Monday, or just one-third as much as the 22.6% decline in the 1987 crash.
Same Whore .... Different Dress
  • #35
  • Sep 30, 2008 2:30pm Sep 30, 2008 2:30pm
Well...in accordance with an U.S research (Rasmussen) that has been published on Monday:

33% of U.S citizens agree with this financial rescue....32% disagree and 35% are neutral!

What? Why 32% disagree with this financial help of US$700 bilions?

This is nothing in comparasion with current U.S financial capacity to help its own people and all world!

It´s easy to sucks the global money and benefits, but, when needed, a help is rejected? Specially when you has started the problem?

Unafortuley, I am experiencing a bad feeling against Americans...

Me that always has defended the United States of America!

I hope that this my feeling is temporary...

Bush...my recommendation for you:

Act like a dictator and aprove yourself this financial packwage, because this is highly needed and all world will understand you!

Now to Eurozone:

You are 27 coutries and also have a big financial capacity to help all market! Stop just watching the internal U.S problems and Trichet...start now a plan to get a similar financial packwage like United States, or Europe also will be one of biggest financial criminals and the United States will not be alone!
  • #36
  • Sep 30, 2008 2:40pm Sep 30, 2008 2:40pm
"As global markets plummet, the rescue plan will almost certainly be put to another vote in Congress. They may rescue Wall Street, but what about the economy? What about taxpayers, already beleaguered by unprecedented deficits, and with bills still to pay for decaying infrastructure and two wars? In such circumstances, can any bail-out plan work?"
  • #37
  • Sep 30, 2008 3:27pm Sep 30, 2008 3:27pm
Quoting SamuelOnline
What? Why 32% disagree with this financial help of US$700 bilions?
umm...... maybe because we are paying for it. it's not like we grew a money tree with 700 billion on it dude. thats my tax dollars right there. how bout when brazil goes under, and your government wants to hand out 700 billion dollars to just one man with no oversight or questions whatsoever, then you come back and ask that question.


Quoting SamuelOnline
It´s easy to sucks the global money and benefits, but, when needed, a help is rejected? Specially when you has started the problem?
actually, im pretty sure i had absolutely NOTHING to do with this whole thing. this is the fault of a bunch of rich retards who decided to give crappy loans to a bunch of poor retards. neither of which will pay this 700 bil. instead, i get to pay for these idiots and their mistakes. thats why i reject this "help" that im giving myself. retarded.


Quoting SamuelOnline
Bush...my recommendation for you:

Act like a dictator and aprove yourself this financial packwage, because this is highly needed and all world will understand you!
i dont know how it works in that little crap-hole you call brazil, but that's not the way things are done here. see we believe in this thing called freedom. it's really cool, you can actually do stuff that you want to. you should try it someday. see, us fat redneck americans like to think for ourselves.

and by the way, i love how you people call bush the "emperor of the world" and spout all that american empire crap, but then when things get a little tough, you want him to do the same thing you people railed against. you are the kind of people that got america into this mess. no wonder you see nothing wrong with the bailout. if you were here, you probably would have been the one applying for all those loans.

i personally think we need a market crash. the reason we are here is because we've been trying to prevent tiny down moves in the market and now all those little moves are adding up into one big move. we have interrupted the natural way of things way too many times. it's time we actually paid the consequences of stupidity.

and samuel, i cannot wait for this to hit you. i really hope brazil is next. i love how out of touch people always think they know whats best for the poeple who are going through something that they have absolutely no clue about.
  • #38
  • Sep 30, 2008 3:30pm Sep 30, 2008 3:30pm
Quoting Marcuse
"As global markets plummet, the rescue plan will almost certainly be put to another vote in Congress. They may rescue Wall Street, but what about the economy? What about taxpayers, already beleaguered by unprecedented deficits, and with bills still to pay for decaying infrastructure and two wars? In such circumstances, can any bail-out plan work?"
So, if trying nothing, do you think that it will be a good solution for this financial crisis?

1) Trying nothing...no financial rescue:

The biggest financial disaster from all history will destroy the U.S economy (with all consequences...like millions of umployed Americans and in all countries...etc...etc...etc...) and China will be the financial leader around all world...with NO trusted financial instruments and with its stupid communism will control your lifestyle and your family!

2) Approving this financial rescue:

Still will remain a bad scneario around all world, but, with much less consequences! All market will get a good fuel, will preserve milions and milions of jobs around all world and the United States of America still will lead the financial world, now with a better regulatory system to protect all financial instruments!

With this second option, we will see a market with a minor financial power, but, still will continue the same market that we know and all us have the pleasure to trade here!

Now, you can choose an option....1 or 2? Obviously...I choose this second option!
  • #39
  • Sep 30, 2008 3:34pm Sep 30, 2008 3:34pm
Quoting johnedoe
You need to get your facts straightened out..... yes yesterday was the biggest point drop in a single day but when compared to % drop it was not nearly as bad as the press and wall street want you to believe.
Monday's market plunge may have been the worst point drop ever for the Dow Jones Industrial Average but in percentage terms it came nowhere close. It dropped 7% on Monday, or just one-third as much as the 22.6% decline in the 1987 crash.
Oh damn you're so right. It wasn't anywhere remotely near "one of the biggest down moves in history".
My goodness I need to get my facts straight; this was one of the smallest down moves in history. You know even though you trolls are rude and disrespectful you can serve a purpose; cutting and pasting statistics. Thanks.

Sorry for eating up board space to thank the troll.
It really is that easy.
  • #40
  • Sep 30, 2008 3:37pm Sep 30, 2008 3:37pm
“House prices probably will fall further, so there will be more foreclosures, and no amount of talking up the market is going to change that. The bad loans, in turn, have created massive holes in banks' balance sheets, which have to be repaired. Any government bail-out that pays fair value for these assets will do nothing to repair that hole. On the contrary, it would be like providing massive blood transfusions to a patient suffering from vast internal hemorrhaging.
Even if a bail-out plan were implemented quickly – which appears increasingly unlikely – there would be some credit contraction. The US economy has been sustained by a consumption boom fueled by excessive borrowing, and that will be curtailed. States and localities are cutting back expenditures. Household balance sheets are weaker. An economic slowdown will exacerbate all our financial problems”
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