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Where can I learn more about Price Action like those in James16 charts? 9 replies

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james16 Chart Thread

  • #11,641
  • Jul 13, 2008 2:00pm Jul 13, 2008 2:00pm
Quoting raczekfx
Should that beovb made a run to next resistance level, a lot of sheep, sorry I meant traders there (as it happened many times before) would be crying out loud. Beovb did what it did, and I don’t know of any PA traders who lost money on that trade. From PMs and IMs I know, that quite a few shorted right at 1.59 (mine entry was 1.5839) and exited around 1.56 (not me) and more aggressive PA traders (that includes me) went long at that ppz (I have attached SP’s chart from another thread) with just a 35pip stop (hint, hint). Many others exited half around 1.56 and were stopped out at BE plus some on the second half.

I’ll be sailing away from FF for a while as it becomes more and more hostile place. Time is way too valuable for me.
Happy trading to all.
R
if i might, i just wanted to add to rac's insights about the BEOB found on the eurusd responding to a question from gag. i'm on my second read of the thread and just recently reviewed where james16 advises playing BEOB's as a "continuation" of a trend (see post #10) and trading with the trend ... (as james16 says in post # 11, trading against the trend is suicide). can i be silly and state the obvious? .... the trend is long and this BEOB is inapposite to it.

from a sincerely unhostile poster ... (rac don't leave us ...)
"Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see." Proverb
  • #11,642
  • Jul 13, 2008 2:19pm Jul 13, 2008 2:19pm
is the bar circled/shaded in the way?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eurgbp.gif Size: 20 KB
"Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see." Proverb
  • #11,643
  • Jul 13, 2008 2:39pm Jul 13, 2008 2:39pm
That was a worth while post. Thanks for the time you took developing it!

PA is easy to recognize to get in. So simple it is embarrassing. Getting out with a profit, that takes some skill, and more than that, the personal chops to not become your own enemy in the market!

95% of all entrants fail. There is a reason behind that.

I think what is the most interesting and helpful thing I learned from the J16 Group is this: DO NOT LOSE MONEY. Sounds pretty obvious, but putting it in practice is pretty hard. Not intellectually, mind you...

Quoting fxprocessor
I am going to jumble a few words together. Please feel free to ignore.

IMHO what appears to separate James16 from many other traders of pin bar/price action is his ability to read the price and exit a position when it will only run for a handful of pips in his favor. After reading his posts showing previous pin bar setups I see he can still make a small profit in this kind of scenario or get out at break even when most of us would find it difficult knowing whether to hold/take profit which is way harder than most will estimate and this can lead to losses.

Hindsight will make it look much easier when we are going over historical data but it is hard to do in real time.

As most people know this is a tough business to be successful in and I would be suprised if there are many traders taking money from the markets on a consistent basis trading discretionary price action - over a reasonable amount of time > than a few months on these forums. Of course it does happen but I would not be in the least bit suprised if you could count the amount of people on one hand.

I have seen some (by my estimation intelligent people) speak of success only to lose much of their profits at a later date and this does seem to be a regular pattern. I am not talking about newbies here.

Negative.....no
Realistic.....yes

I have been trading (on a small scale) price action in some way shape or form for a few years now and am still around break even with the business venture (actually a bit in the red if including expenditure on training material and the usual expenses which are to be expected when starting a business). I can see the potential in trading as a long term business but also have my feet firmly on the ground. I have no problem in investigating this business avenue and spending untold hours studying etc because I would not be where I am in my career now if I did not have this attitude.

My view on price action is that the knowledge I gain in these early stages will stand me in good stead if I decide to commit real money to the markets after proving an edge over a period of time. Even then there is a risk involved of this not working out but this is what we do as traders we are risk managers and where there is risk there is potential profits.

Will this be as a discretionary price action trader taking pin bars at swing high lows etc? Maybe... or maybe I will utilise what I learn here as a filter in a more structured system which has been suggested to me by an old (he wouldn't like me calling him old) pit trader I have been fortunate enough to speak with)

If this post makes one person think about things a bit harder before loosing some of their hard earned cash thinking price action trading is easy (it may be simple but it sure isn't easy) it was worth it.

I also have no problem if anyone wants to reply to this post saying it is easy they take 40% a month...etc..etc. I am honestly very happy for you if that is the case but you are the exception and please be careful with your leverage.

Please anyone reading this take your time and don't think trading these bars is an easy road to success.

I will finish by saying that I think this can be done but people need to realise how hard this can potentially be.

FXP
I'm pretty much done with all this ...
  • #11,644
  • Jul 13, 2008 3:10pm Jul 13, 2008 3:10pm
in keeping w/ SL's post:

Quoting james16
every thing i have posted has been learned from someone else. learning to trade succesfully with them is the traders responsibility and trust me it is not automatic. now i am teaching others. i believe in karma and i truly believe that the powers that be will smile on me. now maybe some of you who along with me have listened to the drumbeat of go it alone you will never be a good trader until you figure out your own system will say along with me. BULLSHIT. without help from others i would have quit a long time ago. do not be afraid to learn from others even if you lose trading thier ideas. you learn more sometimes from the losses than the winners. spending money on books and tapes and websights over twenty years is how i got here. jim
"Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see." Proverb
  • #11,645
  • Edited 3:27pm Jul 13, 2008 3:15pm | Edited 3:27pm
I really don't understand why PA traders would short at 1.59? I am not the sharpest knife in the drawer but the Beovb closed at 1.5685. It was not a beovb until it closed so why would you take a short at 1.59? The July 2nd BUB candle soundly broke through resistance so why people would be thinking sell then i don't know. The only reason i can think is all the resistance at 1.59 - 1.60 so whenever if approaches that some people will sell?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From PMs and IMs I know, that quite a few shorted right at 1.59 (mine entry was 1.5839) and exited around 1.56 (not me) and more aggressive PA traders (that includes me) went long at that ppz (I have attached SP’s chart from another thread) with just a 35pip stop (hint, hint). Many others exited half around 1.56 and were stopped out at BE plus some on the second half. When I read sick responses to SPs helpful post from followers in another thread I couldn’t help and had to laugh.... Some of the posters showed up in the pf for a moment in the past, took some of the info and ran elsewhere. They have no clue what PA trading is all about.

Anyways, this is what I uploaded for gagiul in an abbreviated version. Numbers were quite large and I don’t need any publicity, hence the whiteouts. I’ll be sailing away from FF for a while as it becomes more and more hostile place. Time is way too valuable for me.
Happy trading to all.
R[/quote]
  • #11,646
  • Jul 13, 2008 3:56pm Jul 13, 2008 3:56pm
Quoting saskgui
I really don't understand why PA traders would short at 1.59?
Raczek practices an aggressive "on touch" PPZ style that I've marveled at since I started reading the thread. He's posted pictures of and explained this on this thread several times over time.

Over at J16 there's a subsection of his in which he has a thread with examples of this stuff where others also exercise this.

I believe something of this kind was meant.

In it's nature it's not a bar setup, but a PPZ kind of setup. Not intended or suited for first steps trading imho, not suited for everyone(I don't think I could ever make it my mainstay), but something people do use. And some very, very well.
Trust price. Know yourself.
  • #11,647
  • Jul 13, 2008 4:30pm Jul 13, 2008 4:30pm
Quoting raczekfx
Doc was only intended for Gagiul as a response to his post in another thread, but I have received way too many emails and PMs to just ignore it. In another thread StoragePro tried to point the obvious from the PA perspective to new traders to help them with understanding basic S/R. Should that beovb made a run to next resistance level, a lot of sheep, sorry I meant traders there (as it happened many times before) would be crying out loud. Beovb did what it did, and I don’t know of any PA traders who lost money on that trade. From PMs and IMs I know, that quite a few shorted right at 1.59 (mine entry was 1.5839) and exited around 1.56 (not me) and more aggressive PA traders (that includes me) went long at that ppz (I have attached SP’s chart from another thread) with just a 35pip stop (hint, hint). Many others exited half around 1.56 and were stopped out at BE plus some on the second half. When I read sick responses to SPs helpful post from followers in another thread I couldn’t help and had to laugh.... Some of the posters showed up in the pf for a moment in the past, took some of the info and ran elsewhere. They have no clue what PA trading is all about.

Anyways, this is what I uploaded for gagiul in an abbreviated version. Numbers were quite large and I don’t need any publicity, hence the whiteouts. I’ll be sailing away from FF for a while as it becomes more and more hostile place. Time is way too valuable for me.
Happy trading to all.
R
Hi raczek,

Sorry to see you pull the plug on the Forum. I for one found your insights into the market movement very helpful. After serveral years of searching for the perfect system I've realised that PA is the best way for me to trade. I wish you would reconsider your decision to stop posting here, but if you don't I just wanted to say "Thank you" for all of your hard work and dedication to the forum.
  • #11,648
  • Jul 13, 2008 4:57pm Jul 13, 2008 4:57pm
Quoting raczekfx
Doc was only intended for Gagiul as a response to his post in another thread, but I have received way too many emails and PMs to just ignore it. In another thread StoragePro tried to point the obvious from the PA perspective to new traders to help them with understanding basic S/R. Should that beovb made a run to next resistance level, a lot of sheep, sorry I meant traders there (as it happened many times before) would be crying out loud. Beovb did what it did, and I don’t know of any PA traders who lost money on that trade. From PMs and IMs I know, that quite a few shorted right at 1.59 (mine entry was 1.5839) and exited around 1.56 (not me) and more aggressive PA traders (that includes me) went long at that ppz (I have attached SP’s chart from another thread) with just a 35pip stop (hint, hint). Many others exited half around 1.56 and were stopped out at BE plus some on the second half. When I read sick responses to SPs helpful post from followers in another thread I couldn’t help and had to laugh.... Some of the posters showed up in the pf for a moment in the past, took some of the info and ran elsewhere. They have no clue what PA trading is all about.

Anyways, this is what I uploaded for gagiul in an abbreviated version. Numbers were quite large and I don’t need any publicity, hence the whiteouts. I’ll be sailing away from FF for a while as it becomes more and more hostile place. Time is way too valuable for me.
Happy trading to all.
R
Hi Raczek,

I've enjoyed your posts for a long time here on FF, and it would be a shame to not see your posts here for a while. I would deeply appreciate it if you would reconsider posting here for the time being. I think I speak on behalf of all the other members here on this thread. You have enlightened us all with your posts.
  • #11,649
  • Jul 13, 2008 6:40pm Jul 13, 2008 6:40pm
Thx for the reply. Seems this was a play inside a ppz zone and the top of the zone was 1.59ish and an aggresive ppz trader would short off of that. Most of the pics posted here that i understood were more of a bounce up or down off ppz as price was rejected where this trade was all inside the zone.

Yes

Quoting SeekingLight
Raczek practices an aggressive "on touch" PPZ style that I've marveled at since I started reading the thread. He's posted pictures of and explained this on this thread several times over time.

Over at J16 there's a subsection of his in which he has a thread with examples of this stuff where others also exercise this.

I believe something of this kind was meant.

In it's nature it's not a bar setup, but a PPZ kind of setup. Not intended or suited for first steps trading imho, not suited for everyone(I don't think I could ever make it my mainstay), but something people do use. And some very, very well.
  • #11,650
  • Jul 13, 2008 6:48pm Jul 13, 2008 6:48pm
Quoting soltani
Hi Raczek,

I've enjoyed your posts for a long time here on FF, and it would be a shame to not see your posts here for a while. I would deeply appreciate it if you would reconsider posting here for the time being. I think I speak on behalf of all the other members here on this thread. You have enlightened us all with your posts.
Rac hasn't said he is abandoning us here. LOL

The great thing about this thread is the rotation of guys taking in turns to help out. It takes time being an active participant in a forum and every one of us here has a life outside of FF. Sometimes you find other 'callings'.

I'm sure Rac will still post here occasionally.
Bundy's status today: "Waiting..."
  • #11,651
  • Jul 13, 2008 8:22pm Jul 13, 2008 8:22pm
Quoting StoragePro
That was a worth while post. Thanks for the time you took developing it!

PA is easy to recognize to get in. So simple it is embarrassing. Getting out with a profit, that takes some skill, and more than that, the personal chops to not become your own enemy in the market!

95% of all entrants fail. There is a reason behind that.

I think what is the most interesting and helpful thing I learned from the J16 Group is this: DO NOT LOSE MONEY. Sounds pretty obvious, but putting it in practice is pretty hard. Not intellectually, mind you...
Novice traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to maximize their profits.

Professional traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to reduce/minimize their risk and reduce losses.

(I never tire of reading those 2 sentences).

Working and practising on controlling/reducing risk is what we are really doing when we are trading. Master that approach and the profits will take care of themselves. (imo)
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
  • #11,652
  • Jul 13, 2008 8:50pm Jul 13, 2008 8:50pm
Quoting jarroo
Novice traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to maximize their profits.

Professional traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to reduce/minimize their risk and reduce losses.

(I never tire of reading those 2 sentences).

Working and practising on controlling/reducing risk is what we are really doing when we are trading. Master that approach and the profits will take care of themselves. (imo)
How does Price Action aid in controlling/reducing risk you ask? Beautifully.

Placing a stop loss above/below : PA formations, PPZ (S/R levels) and Confluences. (sorry can't post charts now)
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
  • #11,653
  • Jul 13, 2008 8:51pm Jul 13, 2008 8:51pm
Quoting jarroo
Novice traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to maximize their profits.

Professional traders continually monitor, analyze and alter their trades to reduce/minimize their risk and reduce losses.

(I never tire of reading those 2 sentences).

Working and practising on controlling/reducing risk is what we are really doing when we are trading. Master that approach and the profits will take care of themselves. (imo)

And to do this one must master themself!!!!!!
Its all in ones head.
As Henry Ford said. Weather you think you can or cant you are right...
  • #11,654
  • Jul 13, 2008 9:05pm Jul 13, 2008 9:05pm
Quoting rustyjeff
And to do this one must master themself!!!!!!
Its all in ones head.
As Henry Ford said. Weather you think you can or cant you are right...
Mastering one's self could take a life time. In trading, it just takes practice to have the ability to recognize an "A" trade from a "B" trade and having the patience to know difference.

Patience is hard. If it was easy, it wouldn't be a virtue.
Indicators show the past. Price Action "Indicates" the future.
  • #11,655
  • Jul 13, 2008 9:47pm Jul 13, 2008 9:47pm
after all that talk i think i need to read a winning statement
anyone got one of those for the past month for PA?


COme ON Out Dont BE shy!
  • #11,656
  • Jul 14, 2008 12:33am Jul 14, 2008 12:33am
Quoting jarroo
Mastering one's self could take a life time. In trading, it just takes practice to have the ability to recognize an "A" trade from a "B" trade and having the patience to know difference.

Patience is hard. If it was easy, it wouldn't be a virtue.

if it takes a life time, it takes a life time....
I personally believe that trading is easy & that it will only be profitable in the long run if one is honest with oneself & truly find what he or she is truthfully looking for.

This is my opinion. not a trading recomendation.
Jarroo is wise & experienced & i like the way he trades.
I just have my own style & am very successfull with it..
At the end of the day. J16 is the base for learning. after that you need to learn how to do it on your own.
Jeff
  • #11,657
  • Edited 1:58am Jul 14, 2008 1:14am | Edited 1:58am
Quote
after all that talk i think i need to read a winning statement
anyone got one of those for the past month for PA?
I feel like I'm writing a rant a day lately.

I hate to do it in this thread, but I'm getting fed up with this kind of behavior. IMHO it's just so much trolling.

There's one or two guys in particular who seem to love to instigate randy "statement, statement" chants, along with a group of dedicated followers, and me, personally, I'm not very fond of it catching on. It's one of the reasons, I, too, can get very fed up with FF and open forum behavior in general(it's not just raczek, and best I know, the phenomenon isn't confined, either).

Here's what I think.
I think there will be some who prefer to sit and do nothing until someone has catered to their whim and there will be some who will actually open their eyes and see what's in front of them and take hold of their opportunities.

Me personally, I'm definitely not a caterer. I have always helped people who are willing(in thousands of posts, in hundreds of PMs), but I won't cater to demands.

I think the biggest sillyness in it all is, that there are actually people less willing to believe in a logic held in front of their eyes(which they could independently verify themselves for functionality or not IF they were to just put in the TIME and EFFORT.), rather than in a digital statement in a time where we can make whole movies based in virtual reality, let alone magic together a simple statement.

In trading as in life, you WILL get what you want to believe in, just like rustyjeff said.

If repeatable setup + trade = outcome(I've accumulated around 3000 chart gifs over time, I'm sure it's all fake though!!111) isn't convincing, nothing will ever be. If you can't accept reality, how can you live in it.

If I'd waited to do something decisive about my trading until someone held my hand, showed me tons and tons of statements and said in a soothing voice "There there, things will be alright", I'd still be moving from thread to thread, getting nowhere, knowing nothing.

You make a choice.

Anything else is just shifting responsibility to the others, since hey, of course they're the ones who need to do something(provide proof, e.g.), not yourself (Actually pick up the slack and get going. Nobody is saying be blind or take things for granted or move without due diligence. Oh no. Quite the opposite. But if you deny EVERYTHING, then you're automatically left with NOTHING).

And that's what I think this type of "nothing before nothing" behavior is destined for.

Going nowhere.

--

Barely some hours into the week, and this is what I wake up to. What a way to go.
Pondered 20 minutes whether I should even post it, since I'm just so tired of all this sillyness. I just can't stand this type of thing at all anymore.
It just gets older than Methusalem and it doesn't ever seem to stop.

The simple reason why it's absolutely, mindnumbingly pointless to demand a "statement", because it actually holds NO statement as to functionality at ALL.
You can give the world's greatest system to two people and one will blow it smithereens and one will make more than the creator(I wonder whether anyone said this before. Oh wait...this guy on the VERY FIRST POST.).

Quoting james16
the thing to remember is that two people can take an identical entry and one will lose and the other will win.
This is true for ANY approach and you can find countless posts of people saying "took the same thing, didn't close where you did, ended up in a loss, shame"(or the opposite) all over FF.

I've also seen plenty of people take "signals" from systems that never were valid and proclaimed how great they worked, just as soon as folks that took stuff that never was an entry in the first place and declared someting dysfunctional.

Q.E.D.

Does the guy busting it to pieces make the original work any less or was he just not made for utilizing it / lacking the experience and practice to use it properly?

Don't troll / don't be a Troll.
Trust price. Know yourself.
  • #11,658
  • Jul 14, 2008 5:27am Jul 14, 2008 5:27am
Demanding a statement from traders is like demanding a pair of panties from playboys as proof of their conquests. Both comical demands quite frankly. Just my .02(in old Dutch Guilders)
Patience + Humility + Study = Success
  • #11,659
  • Edited 6:27am Jul 14, 2008 6:17am | Edited 6:27am
first of all i didnt read the whole reply coz it freakn Big
well hehe i think my request pushed him over the edge

i dont need a proof to see if its working or not


my idea was that i get 3-4 statements and compare them to see the winning trades reapeated in them and focus study them

well i guess that was 2 late he already jumped over the edge






oo one more thing its just amazing how everyone threatens every now and then to leave FF
and then
everyone should beg him to stay this is a Public forum guys no one will force u 2 stay there are tons of info @ FF ur loss anyways



Anyone still in the Eur/Jpy Weekly PB??
  • #11,660
  • Jul 14, 2008 6:53am Jul 14, 2008 6:53am
Quoting ezz
first of all i didnt read the whole reply coz it freakn Big
well hehe i think my request pushed him over the edge

i dont need a proof to see if its working or not


my idea was that i get 3-4 statements and compare them to see the winning trades reapeated in them and focus study them

well i guess that was 2 late he already jumped over the edge








oo one more thing its just amazing how everyone threatens every now and then to leave FF
and then
everyone should beg him to stay this is a Public forum guys no one will force u 2 stay there are tons of info @ FF ur loss anyways



Anyone still in the Eur/Jpy Weekly PB??
Hey ezz..

Yes it is a public forum where some experienced trades are willing to share their knowledge and time with those of us who want to learn. If the experienced traders leave then all I am left with is people like you that add very little value to the forum.

Just my 2 cents...
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