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  • #1,101
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:05am Apr 4, 2008 4:05am
Quoting Umairs2004
Yepp!!!
I can go for any pair with any spread but my entry is based on 30-Minutes chart... when i see that breakout is going to trigged in 30-Minutes chart then i see 4-Hour chart that whts going on their... trend is in my favour or not... if trend is in my favour then i enter through 30-minutes chart and easily locked good pip's...
Happy Weekend John & All ......
already done for today? i believe you had a good week.. bdw, seeing your post, what if you see the trend on tf4H is slightly different on the tf30 entry point? do you still hit for that by managing the pips taken?

i believe you are only entering the trade on tf30 when it seems like a good breakout right? seeing you post before and grab the idea bdw...
  • #1,102
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:16am Apr 4, 2008 4:16am
Price broke out of flag formation on 1h. Looking for a retest.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 1heuflag.gif Size: 13 KB
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,103
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:18am Apr 4, 2008 4:18am
Quoting aediaz1
Price broke out of flag formation on 1h. Looking for a retest.
im also looking for this... how can you determine whether it was a valid retest? mind to share??
  • #1,104
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:31am Apr 4, 2008 4:31am
Quoting johnbaem
im also looking for this... how can you determine whether it was a valid retest? mind to share??

Firstly, I must state that I mostly trade flags on breakouts. So when price breaks higher/low of the flag, I enter. But missed it so thats why I'm looking for a retest. I consider it valid when price heads back down to upper line of flag (resistance) and holds (support). But in my experience, price tend not to retest on flag formation. So lets see whats next.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eu.gif Size: 12 KB
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,105
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:38am Apr 4, 2008 4:38am
Be aware that we have major US news in 2 hours. Nonfarm Employment change and unemployment rate
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,106
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:42am Apr 4, 2008 4:42am
Quoting aediaz1
Firstly, I must state that I mostly trade flags on breakouts. So when price breaks higher/low of the flag, I enter. But missed it so thats why I'm looking for a retest. I consider it valid when price heads back down to upper line of flag (resistance) and holds (support). But in my experience, price tend not to retest on flag formation. So lets see whats next.
i definitely agreed with it.. bdw, IMO, market will start moving slowly before the big news release to the suppose direction and experience tell me just to ignore this big time.. time for a weekend..
  • #1,107
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:44am Apr 4, 2008 4:44am
Quoting Umairs2004
Yepp!!!
I can go for any pair with any spread but my entry is based on 30-Minutes chart... when i see that breakout is going to trigged in 30-Minutes chart then i see 4-Hour chart that whts going on their... trend is in my favour or not... if trend is in my favour then i enter through 30-minutes chart and easily locked good pip's...
Happy Weekend John & All ......
Good weekend bud ! Enjoy
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,108
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:47am Apr 4, 2008 4:47am
Quoting johnbaem
already done for today? i believe you had a good week.. bdw, seeing your post, what if you see the trend on tf4H is slightly different on the tf30 entry point? do you still hit for that by managing the pips taken?

i believe you are only entering the trade on tf30 when it seems like a good breakout right? seeing you post before and grab the idea bdw...
Im a trendcatcher just to avoide from false breakout's... I dont judge the trend only with indicators but i do judge it by candles also... Candlestick pattrens and its movement is the most important thing in forex trading specially in 4-Hour chart to onward...Yepp!!!
I already done for today on Usd/Chf... You might have observed that when i post about usd/chf and N/u in a morning tht im looking forward and waiting for U/C Breakdown and N/U Breakup...And you see same happened as i expected because trend changing candles were in my favour + breakouts were about to trigged and all conditions were in my favour for a +ve trade......
  • #1,109
  • Apr 4, 2008 4:48am Apr 4, 2008 4:48am
Quoting aediaz1
Good weekend bud ! Enjoy
Thank's Aediaz & same to you...
Good weekend & happy Pip's...
  • #1,110
  • Apr 4, 2008 5:04am Apr 4, 2008 5:04am
Both of you, aediaz and umairs is really inspiring new people and i hope they might catch this thread and learn a valuable value in here..

Im also done for today for EU & GU for quick pips!
I dont wanna involve in big news tonight so im done..

Happy weekend to all of you!! its time for shopping!!
  • #1,111
  • Apr 4, 2008 5:12am Apr 4, 2008 5:12am
Quoting johnbaem
Both of you, aediaz and umairs is really inspiring new people and i hope they might catch this thread and learn a valuable value in here..

Im also done for today for EU & GU for quick pips!
I dont wanna involve in big news tonight so im done..

Happy weekend to all of you!! its time for shopping!!
Glad to hear Johnbaem. Enjoy your weekend too, don't waste all your pips eh cash on shopping
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,112
  • Apr 4, 2008 5:18am Apr 4, 2008 5:18am
no trade today... but it's friday so it's ok.. the nfp it's comming.. expecting good news for the buck there

Happy weekend to all who don't want the monster nfp.
  • #1,113
  • Edited 6:12am Apr 4, 2008 5:28am | Edited 6:12am
Spoted on usd/cad something nice. But the news are comming for the cad as well.

h4 tf
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/4...4042007pk9.gif

h1 tf

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/3...4042007cv4.gif

m5 tf

http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/6...4042007jn3.gif

enjoy.

maybe this could help
2008-01-11 07:00 Employment Change m/m -18.7 15,0 42,6
2008-02-08 07:00 Employment Change m/m 46.4 11 -18,7
2008-03-07 07:00 Employment Change m/m 43.3 7 46,4
2008-04-04 07:00 Employment Change m/m 14.6k 15,0 43,3

a break to the upside should wait anyway for the nfp.
gl
  • #1,114
  • Apr 4, 2008 5:49am Apr 4, 2008 5:49am
This has been one of the most inspiring threads i've seen, with many good traders contributing their expertise.

As i'm still learning about chart patterns and trendlines, can anyone advise me on the difference between triangles and pennants? Thanks.

Also, i spotted this triangle/pennant on the usdjpy (circled in blue). However, it did not breakout in the direction i expected (blue arrow) but rather continued in the direction of the upper trendline till it broke out of it. Was what i circled even a triangle/pennant in the first place?

Any help is much appreciated. Thanks alot.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: usdjpy.GIF Size: 25 KB
  • #1,115
  • Apr 4, 2008 5:59am Apr 4, 2008 5:59am
Pennant - Continuation

Triangle - Continuation ( but not always)

Symmetrical Triangle - Continuation
Ascending Triangle - Continuation
Descending Triangle - Continuation

that's why u see where's the break then wait for the test then enter.. most conservative.

my way of viewing usdjpy.

http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/7...4042007hf9.gif
  • #1,116
  • Apr 4, 2008 6:56am Apr 4, 2008 6:56am
Quoting thehedge
This has been one of the most inspiring threads i've seen, with many good traders contributing their expertise.

As i'm still learning about chart patterns and trendlines, can anyone advise me on the difference between triangles and pennants? Thanks.

Also, i spotted this triangle/pennant on the usdjpy (circled in blue). However, it did not breakout in the direction i expected (blue arrow) but rather continued in the direction of the upper trendline till it broke out of it. Was what i circled even a triangle/pennant in the first place?

Any help is much appreciated. Thanks alot.
Cheers thehedge.

Triangles: You have many different types of triangles depending on your angles (wedges, ascending, descending and broadening to name some). Price can range in between a triangle for a long time but with pennants you should expect a breakout rather soon depending on what TF you look at.

Pennants: Marks the middleway of a move. In order to have a pennant, you need to have a (large) move either way.

What you have drawn on usd/jpy is triangle. But I would rather draw it as descending triangle (I'll post a chart). I like pennants to be much smaller.

eye4spots calls them continuation-patterns. I think I have called pennants continuation-pattern myself but over time I see that this is not the case. Not in forex. I think it's close to 50/50 if price continue or not from my research.

And I don't find triangles to be any leading indicator to continuation of trend either. But considering trend when trading breakouts is a good rule. If a pennant forms on eur/usd which is very trending, I would be favoring buy position. But again it depends on what TF you trade. If you trade 5m on eur/usd and it's bearish you woulnd't be looking for upside breakouts compared to trading on 4h chart.

2 charts of triangle and pennant;
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 15mgj.gif Size: 16 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: gj15pennant.gif Size: 15 KB
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,117
  • Apr 4, 2008 7:07am Apr 4, 2008 7:07am
Symmetrical triangle on 4h aud/usd. We are looking for a bar to close outside this formation;
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: triangleau.jpg Size: 75 KB
Measure twice, cut once
  • #1,118
  • Apr 4, 2008 8:24am Apr 4, 2008 8:24am
Quoting eye4spot
Pennant - Continuation

Triangle - Continuation ( but not always)

Symmetrical Triangle - Continuation
Ascending Triangle - Continuation
Descending Triangle - Continuation

that's why u see where's the break then wait for the test then enter.. most conservative.

my way of viewing usdjpy.
Hi eye4spot,

Thanks for your point of view. It's interesting how different people see different patterns on the same chart. I guess you stayed out of trading that triangle due to the news release?
  • #1,119
  • Apr 4, 2008 8:38am Apr 4, 2008 8:38am
Quoting aediaz1
Cheers thehedge.

Triangles: You have many different types of triangles depending on your angles (wedges, ascending, descending and broadening to name some). Price can range in between a triangle for a long time but with pennants you should expect a breakout rather soon depending on what TF you look at.

Pennants: Marks the middleway of a move. In order to have a pennant, you need to have a (large) move either way.

What you have drawn on usd/jpy is triangle. But I would rather draw it as descending triangle (I'll post a chart). I like pennants to be much smaller.

eye4spots calls them continuation-patterns. I think I have called pennants continuation-pattern myself but over time I see that this is not the case. Not in forex. I think it's close to 50/50 if price continue or not from my research.

And I don't find triangles to be any leading indicator to continuation of trend either. But considering trend when trading breakouts is a good rule. If a pennant forms on eur/usd which is very trending, I would be favoring buy position. But again it depends on what TF you trade. If you trade 5m on eur/usd and it's bearish you woulnd't be looking for upside breakouts compared to trading on 4h chart.

2 charts of triangle and pennant;
Hi aediaz,

Thanks for your explanation and for starting this thread. It has indeed been an educational journey.

Please allow me to ask a few questions concerning your response:

1. If you do not consider triangles and pennants as continuation patterns, do you mean that you trade the breakout no matter which side it is? i.e. if a pennant forms in the middle of an uptrend but breaks downwards, you will still trade it?

2. Regarding your gbpjpy 30m chart, how would you have traded the pennant? On hindsight, seems like price didn't break out of it but traded sideways for a while.

3. Where do you place your TP and SL targets while trading triangles? I read in your posts a couple of days back that you were stopped out of potentially profitable trades because of too narrow SL. So would you place them just on the inside of the triangle or on the opposite side of it?

Thank you for your time.
  • #1,120
  • Apr 4, 2008 9:35am Apr 4, 2008 9:35am
thehedge: Hi aediaz,

Thanks for your explanation and for starting this thread. It has indeed been an educational journey. Your welcome, glad to hear

Please allow me to ask a few questions concerning your response:

1. If you do not consider triangles and pennants as continuation patterns, do you mean that you trade the breakout no matter which side it is? i.e. if a pennant forms in the middle of an uptrend but breaks downwards, you will still trade it?

It would depend on what TF I'm looking at. And how much price have moved before i.e a pennant forms. If looking at gbp/jpy 30m chart and price have moved 80 pips down and forming pennant (and 230 pips yesterday session i.e) it would be less risky to look for breakout to the downside (thanks mARK for open my eyes on true range again). Then you are playing with the trend which reduce risk.

 2. Regarding your gbpjpy 30m chart, how would you have traded the pennant? On hindsight, seems like price didn't break out of it but traded sideways for a while.

Keep in mind that Asia session (for me) is hard to trade. But for the exercise lets say this pennant occurred during Europe session. Even though price have moved close to 250 pips, I would most likely be looking for continuation of currently trend (gbp/jpy can move twice and even more on a "good" day). But I would take a short position if price broke lowest low inside pennant formation or a close outside formation.

3. Where do you place your TP and SL targets while trading triangles? I read in your posts a couple of days back that you were stopped out of potentially profitable trades because of too narrow SL. So would you place them just on the inside of the triangle or on the opposite side of it?

I have to laugh when I think back at those trades, must have been my 2 worst trade this year. Anyway, I use mostly emergency SL (1-2% of account) outside formation. I like to close deals myself. There is a lot of stop hunting and placing SL just a few pips above last bar high is dangerous. I would close my deal (before automatic SL is taken out) if I see reversal-signs i.e when bar closes inside formation again. Just think about how many times you have been stopped out and price continues in your favor. Then you know you had a bad SL. See chart for explanation.
But this would variate from trader to trader. Bigger SL means lower amount to buy for. But remember that your risk/reward shouldn't be anything less than 1:1. If you see that the most logical SL area is 100 pips away and you 're looking for 30 pips profit, you have most likely a bad setup. Unless you want extra risk and put SL @ 30 pips too.

Thank you for your time.

Chart;
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: example.jpg Size: 90 KB
Measure twice, cut once
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