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Forum a substitute for a mentor?

  • #1
  • First Post: Nov 7, 2007 10:38am Nov 7, 2007 10:38am
I have read many times that all successful traders had a mentor. With all the help on this forum, is it a possible substitute for a formal mentor? Has anyone here made it into that 5% without a formal mentor?
  • #2
  • Nov 7, 2007 2:43pm Nov 7, 2007 2:43pm
it all depends on you. I learned a lot of usseul stuff on ff, things that could take me a long time to dicover myself, but I don't know if a forum can replace a good mentor
"Abandon all hope, you who enter here" La Divina Commedia, Dante Alighieri
  • #3
  • Nov 7, 2007 3:53pm Nov 7, 2007 3:53pm
Quoting nonlinear
I have read many times that all successful traders had a mentor. With all the help on this forum, is it a possible substitute for a formal mentor? Has anyone here made it into that 5% without a formal mentor?
I think you can teach yourself to trade. It's going to take a couple years, cost you an account or two, and contain a few detours.

This is the internet where people can be anyone they want. They don't have to know or believe what they say, they don't have to research the information they post and they are not accountable for misinformation. They can be 1KT traders without even trading forex or by trading penny pips twenty times a day. There is some excellent information on this forum but often times you have to know how to trade before you know the difference between a valid opinion and someone who wants to see their name on the internet.

Did you get your law degree from a forum and without any formal training?
  • #4
  • Edited 4:36pm Nov 7, 2007 4:16pm | Edited 4:36pm
That is exactly the point Phil. I would not recommend that anyone practice law w/o guidance, which is why there are significant hurdles to entering the "bar." I could see how one might try to go it alone, but it would be a long and potentially hazardous haul. One can read theory about any topic, but just like in school, book smarts often do not translate well in the real world. This is why I am pausing as I try to teach myself forex and look at all the different "classes" out there. This stuff is so unregulated that it is difficult to distill the good from the bad.
  • #5
  • Nov 7, 2007 4:51pm Nov 7, 2007 4:51pm
With the help of this forum, I've been able to teach myself how to trade and trade productively. I read a couple books and what not, but for the most part, everything I've learned I've learned here. It's not a mentor that makes a trader, it's the trader. If you are honestly going to put in the time and effort, and I mean really put it in and keep on even when you want to quit and break down; you'll become a trader. That's my belief on the subject.
I dream, therefore I become.
  • #6
  • Nov 7, 2007 4:53pm Nov 7, 2007 4:53pm
Quoting nonlinear
This stuff is so unregulated that it is difficult to distill the good from the bad.
Check out ALL of the articles in the beginners forum. Its a sticky. These are all excellent reads. If you find yourself having disbelief in anything, find out why. Make a discussion out of it. Do whatever it takes to realize the truth in everything.
I dream, therefore I become.
  • #7
  • Nov 7, 2007 5:17pm Nov 7, 2007 5:17pm
Quoting nonlinear
I have read many times that all successful traders had a mentor. With all the help on this forum, is it a possible substitute for a formal mentor? Has anyone here made it into that 5% without a formal mentor?
I'm sure some has made it into that 5% without a format mentor, but that 5% isn't propably yet making money as the profitable traders % is propably much smaller.

Well, I guess a good teacher is a good think and will always help in life, in every area basically. Learning things yourself is harder, but more rewarding later.

The problem is that where are you suppost to get someone who really knows what he teaches and is willing to share that with you? I mean, I haven't personally ever seen a mentor within at least a 3 years of profitable active trading results been published. If someone has, then please inform me also Most of them don't publish no actual long time trading results at all, wondering why :surprised

So how is anyone suppost to know which mentor to choose if the mentors itself results haven't been published or maybe the mentor haven't never been trading successfully himself? By the best fake smile, by the best looking web site, by some stupid testimonials, by the suggestsion you have been given from forums etc. ?

I don't think there's any successful traders who would be interested to become mentors for us noobs paying 99.99 XXX currency or even within a bigger pay - why should they? They might help some of their close friends, relatives etc. for free and fun. Mentors are not usually trading successfully themself or trading at all and anyone can talk that psychology bla-blah, write articles, write web blog etc..

Most of mentors just keeps telling the same copy+paste bla-bla they have written down from other books, seminars etc. and selling them services withn a famous selling slogan "we are not here to sell anything for you, just to help".
  • #8
  • Edited 5:32pm Nov 7, 2007 5:21pm | Edited 5:32pm
While there is a lot of good info on this forum, it will take a long time to weed it out. And while it's definitely possible to teach yourself to trade with books and this forum, the benefit of a mentor is that it is targeted learning and you can ask targeted questions, rapidly increasing the learning process. Also, Phil makes a good point that it definitely helps to have a solid foundation in order to know what you need to know when going through the threads here, and a mentor can give you that fairly quickly.

I have a mentor that I feel is a good value for the money, I'm quite happy with my learning process, but at the same time I very readily see that he is just one trader and I'm always on the lookout for ways to supplement with the help of the great minds on this forum. For example, my mentor is a fan of scaling out of winning positions and while he's quite successful, after reading a few threads here I'm ready to modify this strategy in certain circumstances.

I think it's the best of both worlds to have a mentor for a targeted foundation and the forum for a wealth of great ideas to fine tune. The trick is getting a solid mentor that you can trust is a good value for the money.
  • #9
  • Nov 7, 2007 5:22pm Nov 7, 2007 5:22pm
Quoting mike w
With the help of this forum, I've been able to teach myself how to trade and trade productively. I read a couple books and what not, but for the most part, everything I've learned I've learned here. It's not a mentor that makes a trader, it's the trader. If you are honestly going to put in the time and effort, and I mean really put it in and keep on even when you want to quit and break down; you'll become a trader. That's my belief on the subject.
I think you're right and if you have enough time, measured in years...not months or minutes, you can learn to trade. For many though, they focus on the system first rather than the mechanics of trading and more importantly, psychology. Even after learning to trade, if you don't have a plan or a system you are still woefully unprepared to trade. There are a lot of pieces to the puzzle. You can put the puzzle together yourself and that may be very rewarding or you can save time and get help. In the final analysis I agree that it's the trader and not the mentor that makes it possible.

By the way, I like your icon and I know what it says. I just got my new despair.com catalog this week.
  • #10
  • Nov 7, 2007 5:36pm Nov 7, 2007 5:36pm
Quoting mike w
With the help of this forum, I've been able to teach myself how to trade and trade productively. I read a couple books and what not, but for the most part, everything I've learned I've learned here. It's not a mentor that makes a trader, it's the trader. If you are honestly going to put in the time and effort, and I mean really put it in and keep on even when you want to quit and break down; you'll become a trader. That's my belief on the subject.

I agree with this statement 110%, with one tiny thing to add: A mentor can speed up the process even more.

Clockwork
  • #11
  • Nov 7, 2007 5:41pm Nov 7, 2007 5:41pm
Quoting SomedayIwill
Well, I can confess a sin: I'm freaking scared of trading.

I have been paper and live trading almost every day in recent years and I have find out that I can't find no advantage with my trading. In the long term always ending up in zero, minus the spread, so overally losing slightly.

I have never blown up a single trading account, but I'm losing always 1-4% per month, I have been doing the same slight losing stabilliy in recent 18 months. I'm quite happy although with losing only so little as I trade quite often But even without the spread I wouldn't be making profit, ending up zero without spread. So trading less often wouldn't make it positive neither, just a smaller lose.
Makes me wonder if a mentor could have helped. Best wishes on your journey.
  • #12
  • Nov 7, 2007 7:08pm Nov 7, 2007 7:08pm
You have a PM from me nonlinear. Hope it helps.
The basis of a democratic state is liberty. ~ Aristotle
  • #13
  • Nov 7, 2007 7:19pm Nov 7, 2007 7:19pm
the internet as stated is such a phenomenal tool. I wonder what some of the older guys/gals around here think if only they had access back in the day (maybe it is a good thing, perhaps not). James16 used to have to graph his charts by hand(as I am sure others around here have). I can only believe that gave them great experience and the ability to get in tune with the market that double click your charting program lacks to an extent.

I do have to say if you are lucky enough to get a mentor it can certainly speed up the process and take advantage of it(I was lucky enough to have a generous/brilliant one). But in the end it is going to be up to the individual to be successful or not. Trading is extremely psychological and b/c of this, the battle is in your head more then anything(at least I believe so).

Do take advantage of all the brilliant people on this and other forums, I for one am so grateful to be able to read and speak with the many great traders/people on here.
  • #14
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:07pm Nov 7, 2007 8:07pm
oh god not more about this 5%. How can anyone class themselves of being in the "5%" or "95%" if you still go in to work each morning to kiss your boss's ass!

I still kiss ass and I won't count myself in any statistic until I wiped my lips and have been living off this business year in, year out. Until then all we are doing is playing doctors and nurses!
  • #15
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:09pm Nov 7, 2007 8:09pm
Quoting cryten
I still kiss ass...
Oh I bet you do big boy!
Mr. Trend
  • #16
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:29pm Nov 7, 2007 8:29pm
Quoting philmcgrew
I think you're right and if you have enough time, measured in years...not months or minutes, you can learn to trade. For many though, they focus on the system first rather than the mechanics of trading and more importantly, psychology. Even after learning to trade, if you don't have a plan or a system you are still woefully unprepared to trade. There are a lot of pieces to the puzzle. You can put the puzzle together yourself and that may be very rewarding or you can save time and get help. In the final analysis I agree that it's the trader and not the mentor that makes it possible.

By the way, I like your icon and I know what it says. I just got my new despair.com catalog this week.
I absolutely love despair.com haha The stuff kills me. On the more serious side, I agree with you that psychology plays one of the largest parts of trading. I never would have thought that when I was starting out, but it is true and I will attest to it now. I liked how you told of it being like a 'puzzle'. This is so true. Sometimes the pieces don't feel like they can fit at all and that's because your beginning in the wrong places. It's like trying to put the middle pieces first, just jumping from piece to piece. In reality you should be starting with the main framework of the puzzle and work inward, based on the foundation, until it all fits together.
I dream, therefore I become.
  • #17
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:44pm Nov 7, 2007 8:44pm
I personally have had a great mentor that for the most part was a great listener. In fact he would simply ask me what I was doing wrong.. Funny how we might know what we are messing up in and for some reason feel better after someone tells us to stop it.. I'm not joking with that either. Now his help was not cheap and 3 years of work has been a price that I feel was worth every cent. I've read on this form that a Dr takes years of training and much cash to go through school.. I guess trading is no different. I would also rank believing in your methodology in good times and bad a very important hurtle to jump over. I also think modern technology with live chats as been a huge help.. Now I still have a long way to go and the road for me has been bumpy but I'm finally gaining confidence in myself and my methodology. When my mentor told me he looks at over 2000 charts per day I did not need to ask why.. I just did it and continue each day.. Habits take time to forum and so if he told me to jump I asked how high.. Ya see he is at a level that I wish to be at and one day I will.. Just got to pass through time to get there..
Check Mate GAME OVER
  • #18
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:55pm Nov 7, 2007 8:55pm
Quoting bunton
I personally have had a great mentor that for the most part was a great listener. In fact he would simply ask me what I was doing wrong.. Funny how we might know what we are messing up in and for some reason feel better after someone tells us to stop it.. I'm not joking with that either. Now his help was not cheap and 3 years of work has been a price that I feel was worth every cent. I've read on this form that a Dr takes years of training and much cash to go through school.. I guess trading is no different. I would also rank believing in your methodology in good times and bad a very important hurtle to jump over. I also think modern technology with live chats as been a huge help.. Now I still have a long way to go and the road for me has been bumpy but I'm finally gaining confidence in myself and my methodology. When my mentor told me he looks at over 2000 charts per day I did not need to ask why.. I just did it and continue each day.. Habits take time to forum and so if he told me to jump I asked how high.. Ya see he is at a level that I wish to be at and one day I will.. Just got to pass through time to get there..
Please tell me 2000 was a typo. That's crazy. If it wasn't, this just goes to show how everyone is different in their learning process. If I were to have to look at even 200 charts a day, I would be burnt out after a few months of trading. I feel that I can make just as much profit by looking at around 20 charts a day (throughout the course of the day). There are always opportunities within even just this market throughout a week. Whether they are on the dailies, 4 hour, hourlies, or scalping (scalping is also not a style I am sufficient at). It all depends on what you are not only comfortable with, but proficient at.
I dream, therefore I become.
  • #19
  • Nov 7, 2007 8:56pm Nov 7, 2007 8:56pm
Quoting Mr Trend
Oh I bet you do big boy!
yup I asked for that :
  • #20
  • Nov 7, 2007 9:00pm Nov 7, 2007 9:00pm
Quoting mike w
Please tell me 2000 was a typo. That's crazy. If it wasn't, this just goes to show how everyone is different in their learning process. If I were to have to look at even 200 charts a day, I would be burnt out after a few months of trading. I feel that I can make just as much profit by looking at around 20 charts a day (throughout the course of the day). There are always opportunities within even just this market throughout a week. Whether they are on the dailies, 4 hour, hourlies, or scalping (scalping is also not a style I am sufficient at). It all depends on what you are not only comfortable with, but proficient at.
Nope that was not a typo.. Not forex related I guess but my software is loaded into my memory on me PC and I'd spend about 2-5 sec per chart from my scan..I takes about 1 hour to flag those that look interesting and then review deeper from my list of candidates.
Check Mate GAME OVER
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