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  • #2,881
  • Oct 22, 2007 8:10am Oct 22, 2007 8:10am
Quoting Syafi
Great News, I am constantly cutting my losses way before it reach my SL

Resulting in higher yield in my account last week.
my account look like a HYIP account already within a week.
Good for you Syafi, that is fantastic news! Keep it up!!

Glen
  • #2,882
  • Oct 22, 2007 8:12am Oct 22, 2007 8:12am
  •  Yuppie
  • Joined Jun 2007 | Status: ̿ ̿ ̿̿'̿̿\̵͇̿̿\=(•̪●)=/̵͇̿̿/'̿̿ ̿ | 2,727 Posts
...you zoom in as far as you can on OandA chart... and the vertical scale is still 20 pips!!!...

I've been missing the action today... First day in a while that I had other commitments... And E/J decides to have a bit of fun...

It's a pity, as days like this are probably good for experience... There will be more... Mind you, I will just watch the video of today over again later... Not quite the same... But as close as you can get...


Magnus
  • #2,883
  • Oct 22, 2007 8:46am Oct 22, 2007 8:46am
Quoting phranq
I agree, to an extent, LT... it's just that some of the recent advice given here would be ideal in a real-time forum, like a chat room. It could be an ideal way for newbies to get timely advice from the veterans. For example the opening of the NY session this morning, ie. encouraging people to wait for the spine to fully form before going in, etc. Admittedly this is only advice, and each person is responsible for their own trading.

Attached is my first eur/jpy rainbow trade (live but micro - i'm with you fxsurfer!)...

PS - i have to give credit to Yuppie... I emulated his chart, and added training wheels (WMA:240) and SMA:25 (mentioned earlier in this thread as a means to help with exits)
Looks like you are off to a great start! Nicely done, and keep up the good work!!

Glen
  • #2,884
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:05am Oct 22, 2007 10:05am
What stops do you guys use on 5 sec. chart? Look at the situation on the screenshots below. -10.6 pips in opposite direction and then it goes down again but very fast. Do you get out and in again? I mean in real trading not with hindsight.
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
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Click to Enlarge Name: 20071022-5sec-eurjpy-V02.png Size: 283 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: 20071022-5sec-eurjpy-V03.png Size: 277 KB
  • #2,885
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:19am Oct 22, 2007 10:19am
Quoting atomz
What stops do you guys use on 5 sec. chart? Look at the situation on the screenshots below. -10.6 pips in opposite direction and then it goes down again but very fast. Do you get out and in again? I mean in real trading not with hindsight.
Great question. I find it's always best to use a wider stop than you ever intend to allow to get hit, this will help you keep your relative safety, focus and sanity while trading. The key is to recognise the wave going against your entry ASAP and cut the trade off, without it even coming near the SL.

Then when you see the trade developing again you just jump in. Tip: I've had a lot more quality scalps when the price grid is in 10 pip intervals. It'll help prevent stupid/losing/low profitability trades. Just my way.

Bob
  • #2,886
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:20am Oct 22, 2007 10:20am
And here you see how beatiful it looked like 5 minutes after. I could mark many profitable entries there.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 20071022-5sec-eurjpy-V06.png Size: 247 KB
  • #2,887
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:36am Oct 22, 2007 10:36am
Quoting atomz
What stops do you guys use on 5 sec. chart? Look at the situation on the screenshots below. -10.6 pips in opposite direction and then it goes down again but very fast. Do you get out and in again? I mean in real trading not with hindsight.

When scalping I use a 30 pip stop for disasters. By this I mean, in case my platform crashes or some world event occurs during my trade. This helps prevent me from taking a huge loss in a fast moving market. That being said, I do not let my stop orders take me out of a trade. Stop hunting could be reality with retail brokers ( I just do not know). When scalping, if the trade goes against me I get out. Usually around 3 pips against me. It is very subjective. I can always enter again if the situation arises.

As LT says, SCREEN TIME !!!! It will help you decide when to get in and when to get out. Start out with a general rule, but be flexible to find the right rules for you.

--Mark

Charge On ...
EllisEdi Moving on to my next trade ...
  • #2,888
  • Edited 10:54am Oct 22, 2007 10:42am | Edited 10:54am
It looks like short. (Bobblong, even the price grid turned to 10 pips interval)
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 20071022-5sec-eurjpy-V07.png Size: 337 KB
  • #2,889
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:45am Oct 22, 2007 10:45am
It turns against me, -3 pips or -15 pips or wait bit longer?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #2,890
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:46am Oct 22, 2007 10:46am
Here we go but it could be -30 pips.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #2,891
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:52am Oct 22, 2007 10:52am
Quoting atomz
What stops do you guys use on 5 sec. chart? Look at the situation on the screenshots below. -10.6 pips in opposite direction and then it goes down again but very fast. Do you get out and in again? I mean in real trading not with hindsight.
Quoting EllisEdi
When scalping I use a 30 pip stop for disasters. By this I mean, in case my platform crashes or some world event occurs during my trade. This helps prevent me from taking a huge loss in a fast moving market. That being said, I do not let my stop orders take me out of a trade. Stop hunting could be reality with retail brokers ( I just do not know). When scalping, if the trade goes against me I get out. Usually around 3 pips against me. It is very subjective. I can always enter again if the situation arises.
Exactly. Set your stops wide for disaster situations, with the intent that you get out long before then. I set mine at 20-25 pips, and adjust my leverage accordingly so that this stop point wipes out about 4% of my account (for most people this is very aggressive... 2-3% is more typical).

Stops are not meant as an exit signal... they're meant for the 1 in a 10,000 chance that something goes horribly wrong. Most new traders never think of exit signals, and this is where they get into trouble. I'd hazard a guess that of the 95% of traders who get wiped out within six months, half didn't use any stops at all, and the other half used stops as their only exit.
  • #2,892
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:56am Oct 22, 2007 10:56am
Quoting atomz
What stops do you guys use on 5 sec. chart? Look at the situation on the screenshots below. -10.6 pips in opposite direction and then it goes down again but very fast. Do you get out and in again? I mean in real trading not with hindsight.

I would have exited at .33 , now we can see the price went down, but it could also have spiked up for 20 -30 pips and more.
  • #2,893
  • Oct 22, 2007 10:58am Oct 22, 2007 10:58am
I use around 3 pips when scalping the EURJPY for a couple of reasons.

First 3 pips is half of my target of 6 pips profit. This means I can have 2 losses for every win and still not be losing any money (not counting commisions). This works for me because I am running at approximate 90 - 95 % profitable scalps. This does not mean that I always exit at 6 pips profit, sometimes I hold longer based on what is happening in the market. But when I hit 6 pips profit I start looking for reasons to exit.
The second reason I use three pips is because I look for high probablility scalp trades. If price moves against by three pips I did not pick the entry properly. I get out and look for the next opportunity.

I once read that in trading, the first third and last third of a price move were the hardest to get. I am content with the middle third.

This works for me. It may not work for you. If you like use it as your guide till you find something that fits you better.

Remeber it is alright to "leave pips on the table".

--Mark
EllisEdi Moving on to my next trade ...
  • #2,894
  • Oct 22, 2007 11:03am Oct 22, 2007 11:03am
  •  Yuppie
  • Joined Jun 2007 | Status: ̿ ̿ ̿̿'̿̿\̵͇̿̿\=(•̪●)=/̵͇̿̿/'̿̿ ̿ | 2,727 Posts
Quoting bluebuddha
Exactly. Set your stops wide for disaster situations, with the intent that you get out long before then. I set mine at 20-25 pips, and adjust my leverage accordingly so that this stop point wipes out about 4% of my account (for most people this is very aggressive... 2-3% is more typical).

Stops are not meant as an exit signal... they're meant for the 1 in a 10,000 chance that something goes horribly wrong. Most new traders never think of exit signals, and this is where they get into trouble. I'd hazard a guess that of the 95% of traders who get wiped out within six months, half didn't use any stops at all, and the other half used stops as their only exit.

I've read it many places before... Pro traders don't use stops... As their exit... Disaster Stops? Yes... They close their positions... The positions do not get closed for them...

I am using -18 pips as my disaster stops... Have -10 pips in my head if things go wrong... Usually out for no more than -6 pips if it goes wrong... Almost never -10 pips [so far...]...

I think there was a -14 pips the other day though... It can move pretty fast sometimes... ...


Magnus
  • #2,895
  • Oct 22, 2007 11:20am Oct 22, 2007 11:20am
Thank you guys.

Quoting EllisEdi
If price moves against by three pips I did not pick the entry properly.
Do you find entry, that moves 3 pips against, picked inproperly?

Quote
Stops are not meant as an exit signal...

OK. I understand that. What is your exit singal? Is it the very last top/bottom of the price, is it spine, is it last significant top/bottom within 30 pips?
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 20071022-5sec-eurjpy-V10.png Size: 326 KB
  • #2,896
  • Oct 22, 2007 11:35am Oct 22, 2007 11:35am
I have had trades that go against by 3 pips, I then look to price and decide if I let it ride or not, mostly I get out and look for another trade opportunity. If the trade goes against me by 3 pips and just kind of hangs out, I have let it run. It depends on past price action, general direction of market both 5 second and 30 second, how fast market is moving, did the trade move against me right away, did it turn into a loss very fast ... and many other thoughts flash through my mind.

When I first started I always got out at -3 pips. This means that when it read -3 pips I clicked the closed button. Sometimes that means i actually got out at -3, -4, or -5 pips, and sometimes it means i got out at 0 pips or even +1 pip profit.

You need to get a feel for the instrument (currency pair) you are trading. Try trading in the smallest amount possible. There is a rythym to the price movements. You will learn it if you do not jump from system to system, instrument to instrument.

This is why the best traders and investors (IMO) use discretionary systems. They may have strict Money Management and a solid underlying entry and exit plan, but the truth is only you can decide when to get in and to get out.

--Mark
EllisEdi Moving on to my next trade ...
  • #2,897
  • Oct 22, 2007 11:43am Oct 22, 2007 11:43am
Lt gives a couple of great exit signals as a starting point.

Timed exit signals - if price doesn't move signifcantly in x number of minutes.

Profit exit signal - if price move x number of pips (I use 6 pips).

Loss exit signal - if price moves x number of pips against you (I use -3 pips)

With the Timed exit signals, you will find that you exit at break even or so just before a move. This just means you probably entered early, try to perfect your entry. You can always enter again.

With the Profit exit signal - celebrate you win!!!!!

With the Loss exit signal - keep your eye open for the next opportunity. It is just around the next price swing... If you keep getting too many of these try looking for better entries.

--Mark

Sorry about that last post, sometimes I get preachy ... lol
EllisEdi Moving on to my next trade ...
  • #2,898
  • Oct 22, 2007 11:52am Oct 22, 2007 11:52am
Other exit signals to keep an eye out for...


Round numbers in price. ( I like these)

Support - Resistance levels (always be aware)

If news is approaching I get out. I scalp so that world events and news will not effect my trading unexpectedly. This is a whole other topic that I will preach on later...

In short be aware of where price is when in the trade, check momentum, price history, and the sze of the overall move. Any and all of these factors can influence when to get out.

Beginners should pick one or two exit signals and get out early. As you get experience you will learn when to stay in and when to get out.


Remeber this is called scalping for a reason get in , get out (quickly) and go enjoy life...

--Mark

soon people will start to call me the rambler as my post tend to LOL
EllisEdi Moving on to my next trade ...
  • #2,899
  • Oct 22, 2007 12:12pm Oct 22, 2007 12:12pm
Quoting atomz
And here you see how beatiful it looked like 5 minutes after. I could mark many profitable entries there.
My recommendation is Screen Time on live account... Use the time you spend on chat, screen capture, over analyzing and drawing graph etc to Quality Screen Time and you will know which one to take, which one to ignore and where to enter/exit (less distraction to other users who tend to flock to see examples, chats, live demo from so called gurus etc)... You can always mark entry and exit after the fact, Gurus will flip and flop during the live sessions - that's why I did not give many examples in the e-book; but I clearly explained the rules and more than enough tips to get 90-95% successful hit rate - if you understand and follow it...

Everyday, you have many profitable entries... that's why 5 sec Cyrox Rainbow chart...
  • #2,900
  • Oct 22, 2007 12:15pm Oct 22, 2007 12:15pm
Quoting EllisEdi
When scalping I use a 30 pip stop for disasters. By this I mean, in case my platform crashes or some world event occurs during my trade. This helps prevent me from taking a huge loss in a fast moving market. That being said, I do not let my stop orders take me out of a trade. Stop hunting could be reality with retail brokers ( I just do not know). When scalping, if the trade goes against me I get out. Usually around 3 pips against me. It is very subjective. I can always enter again if the situation arises.

As LT says, SCREEN TIME !!!! It will help you decide when to get in and when to get out. Start out with a general rule, but be flexible to find the right rules for you.

--Mark

Charge On ...
Absolutely... You got that right...
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