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trading systems vs account size

  • #61
  • Edited 2:54pm Aug 6, 2007 2:42pm | Edited 2:54pm
Quoting ScottH
I am going to have to somewhat disagree with you. It can be done with proper money management, the right mindset, consistency, and of course the power of compounding.


Add to that a KILLER trading system and you're right on!

There are really two camps. The people who focus on trying to prove that it can't be done, and the people who focus on doing it. In the end the latter camp is the only one that has the potential to both be right and to get rich at the same time.
  • #62
  • Aug 6, 2007 3:17pm Aug 6, 2007 3:17pm
Sorry, I didn't read all the posts. There is only one thing I want to say.
You know why Pacific (synonyms - calm, quiet) Ocean was called that way? Because when Magellan crossed it, it was calm. Actually its veeeeery stormy.

The point is - you can make a million on forex even with $10 000
But it will be: very successful strategy, one or few years, heavy re-investing, high risks, high win ratio. I mean there will be people like that but those people are more like exceptions from forex. We only see those 95% that fail because we only want an average number.
We always forget that its not the averages that moves the world, its exceptions.


Want to make a million from 10k? Make it! But don't go copying other systems. If yours is not profitable - dump it and start making a new one. You won't make a dollar turn into a million by looking at it but you might get the second dollar if you keep working for it.

Good luck everyone!
  • #63
  • Aug 6, 2007 3:45pm Aug 6, 2007 3:45pm
Quoting Shinigami
Sorry, I didn't read all the posts. There is only one thing I want to say.
You know why Pacific (synonyms - calm, quiet) Ocean was called that way? Because when Magellan crossed it, it was calm. Actually its veeeeery stormy.

The point is - you can make a million on forex even with $10 000
But it will be: very successful strategy, one or few years, heavy re-investing, high risks, high win ratio. I mean there will be people like that but those people are more like exceptions from forex. We only see those 95% that fail because we only want an average number.
We always forget that its not the averages that moves the world, its exceptions.


Want to make a million from 10k? Make it! But don't go copying other systems. If yours is not profitable - dump it and start making a new one. You won't make a dollar turn into a million by looking at it but you might get the second dollar if you keep working for it.

Good luck everyone!

Can do!
  • #64
  • Aug 6, 2007 3:49pm Aug 6, 2007 3:49pm
Quoting iandekoker
My friend i hate to burst to bubble, but you will never make a living out of forex trading a mini account. In time you will agree with me.
I never said makeing a liveing out of a mini account but in time as it builds up and become a standard account it could be done. But as mention by some one else you have to take in to account of all other things like bennys medical insurance , dental and all that. As I have said I manage to do about 35 pips a day doing 2 or 3 lots on one currency . Then I pull out of it for the day. As I learn more and build up more one day I am hopeing to do so. I mean I started off with only $300.00 and now have it build up to about 4200. Sure I have taken losses as well no more than a 10pip stop loss per trade and when I do get stopped out I just replan again but on my practice account to see if it would work then I do it on my live account. But I always set myself up with a 10 pip stop loss . And I do try to follow the trend . And I only stick to one currency pair . That way I can get a better grip on whats going on. But one day I am hopeing to make a liveing on tradeing. But of course I still have a lot to learn and believe it or not I have been learning from all you guys from the factory
  • #65
  • Aug 6, 2007 4:51pm Aug 6, 2007 4:51pm
Quoting iandekoker
show me a trading system that managed to give you 100 plus pips today when gbp/usd move well over 150 pips? most trading systems would only confirm the trade once the currency has moved about 20-60 pips. While trading the shooting star candlestick formation on the 4hr char would have given you an instant 100 pips...even 130 pips if you let ur trade ride it out
Still in that short from 2.0432 here myself
Was a bit surprised however to see an early abort ahead of .618 fib.

Price action rocks.

And yes, got the PM, thanks, everything cleared up. Trading is still a mixed bag, with an okay last 2 weeks which COULD have been super-duper-stellar had I not made 3-4 bad choices. But meh.
My endgame goal is still 5-10% per week eventually. Net. Consistently.
One day
Trust price. Know yourself.
  • #66
  • Aug 7, 2007 12:52am Aug 7, 2007 12:52am
Quoting Que
You are correct, my appologies, I did mistake you for the origional poster. Just realize all my posts were to that end. From reading the first post, and the title, I did not get the impression that this thread is all about making a living, rather turning it into a living.

Also, I do post my statement, It may not be impressive as I am very new, but it has every single live trade I have made, good or bad (Mostly bad heh). I will make it in the business, and if this month is a positive month, I will start to impliment my $300 a month plan.
Hi Que,

No worries, accept my apologies back. After re-reading a few of of my posts, they weren't very "pro" minded. I should have been more open to explaining, than I was.
Have to admit, I am not a very good teacher, nor writer as some here at FF are.
You are correct, the thread is sort of multi-leveled.....I am not a "system" trader.....so I focused on the "Cap" required to trade full time.

And I most def. was not, in any way, implying your way of funding is wrong....Lots of confusion. I should not have been trading and "chatting" at the same time, I might have noticed it earlier.

I do agree with many thoughts of the Thread starter, and I am glad to see you use the word "business"....

Good Luck
Proper Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance
  • #67
  • Aug 7, 2007 1:05am Aug 7, 2007 1:05am
[quote=Shinigami;1526087]Sorry, I didn't read all the posts. There is only one thing I want to say.
You know why Pacific (synonyms - calm, quiet) Ocean was called that way? Because when Magellan crossed it, it was calm. Actually its veeeeery stormy.

The point is - you can make a million on forex even with $10 000
yes in theory you can also win the lottery with a $1 ticket (in my country) but less than 0.00001% of the world population manage to do that. There is no way someone will make a million with a $10 000 account...if it was so easy and do-able then the whole world would have done it.....cause everyone is looking for a quick buck

But it will be: very successful strategy, one or few years,
try rather a decade or so


heavy re-investing, high risks,
high risk WILL kill you time and again... if u dont believe me...try trading jpy for a while

high win ratio.
if only the forex market was that predictable

I mean there will be people like that but those people are more like exceptions from forex.
i agree...if i find one such person in my lifetime then i will be amazed

We only see those 95% that fail because we only want an average number.
We always forget that its not the averages that moves the world, its exceptions.
only in hollywood movies my friend


Want to make a million from 10k? Make it! But don't go copying other systems. If yours is not profitable - dump it and start making a new one. You won't make a dollar turn into a million by looking at it but you might get the second dollar if you keep working for it.

i agree on that...go make the pips
  • #68
  • Aug 7, 2007 1:12am Aug 7, 2007 1:12am
Quoting SeekingLight
Still in that short from 2.0432 here myself
Was a bit surprised however to see an early abort ahead of .618 fib.

Price action rocks.

And yes, got the PM, thanks, everything cleared up. Trading is still a mixed bag, with an okay last 2 weeks which COULD have been super-duper-stellar had I not made 3-4 bad choices. But meh.
My endgame goal is still 5-10% per week eventually. Net. Consistently.
One day
i hope you noticed the little hammers and bullish engulfments on most of the jpy currencies on the 4hr charts....there was also a few bearish engulfments and 3 white soldiers on some of the minor currencies....all in all an easy trading day with some very basic candlestick formations....i banked 537 pips yesterday but some i should have let run longer then i would have made closer to 700pips....damn i wish we could have more of those days....then even the $250 accounts could be turned into millions....lol
  • #69
  • Aug 7, 2007 1:16am Aug 7, 2007 1:16am
Quoting LarryLiles
I never said makeing a liveing out of a mini account but in time as it builds up and become a standard account it could be done. But as mention by some one else you have to take in to account of all other things like bennys medical insurance , dental and all that. As I have said I manage to do about 35 pips a day doing 2 or 3 lots on one currency . Then I pull out of it for the day. As I learn more and build up more one day I am hopeing to do so. I mean I started off with only $300.00 and now have it build up to about 4200. Sure I have taken losses as well no more than a 10pip stop loss per trade and when I do get stopped out I just replan again but on my practice account to see if it would work then I do it on my live account. But I always set myself up with a 10 pip stop loss . And I do try to follow the trend . And I only stick to one currency pair . That way I can get a better grip on whats going on. But one day I am hopeing to make a liveing on tradeing. But of course I still have a lot to learn and believe it or not I have been learning from all you guys from the factory

Hhhmmmm 10 pip stop loss is asking for trouble....the market moves 10 pips while i go and make coffee....IF you do have a 10 pips stop you would get stopped out more often than not.....i suggest u use a bigger stop loss....depending on ur account...i myself DO NOT use stop losses...i can survive if the market turns 6000 pips against me....and while i wait for the market to go in my favor again i still have lots of money to continue trading....but that is just cause i believe in capitilazing one's account to max so you can weather the storms better....
  • #70
  • Aug 7, 2007 1:22am Aug 7, 2007 1:22am
I can turn $1 to $100 by using no more than 1% margin in a little over 60 trading days, have done it many many times.

Just trade strong trends, else do not trade at all, sit idle and wait for the next trend move.
  • #71
  • Aug 7, 2007 2:26am Aug 7, 2007 2:26am
Quoting forexlion
I can turn $1 to $100 by using no more than 1% margin in a little over 60 trading days, have done it many many times.

Just trade strong trends, else do not trade at all, sit idle and wait for the next trend move.
like you said....in little over 60 days....

i can make more than $100 NOT trading forex in half a day...little own 60 days.....see i do forex cause i can make more money in the markets than i would elsewhere

but if ur happy with $100 in 60 days then who am i to argue
  • #72
  • Edited 2:31am Aug 7, 2007 2:29am | Edited 2:31am
Quoting forexlion
I can turn $1 to $100 by using no more than 1% margin in a little over 60 trading days, have done it many many times.

Just trade strong trends, else do not trade at all, sit idle and wait for the next trend move.
This is a joke, right???? ($1.00) 1 usd dollar????????? misquote??????

Which broker gives you an account for 1 lousy buck????
Proper Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance
  • #73
  • Aug 7, 2007 3:36am Aug 7, 2007 3:36am
Quoting FxJarhead
This is a joke, right???? ($1.00) 1 usd dollar????????? misquote??????

Which broker gives you an account for 1 lousy buck????
i was thinking the same thing but i did not wanted to say anything....lol

maybe he has a $250-$5000 account and are playing $1 lots...hoping for a strong trend so he can make 100 pips profit......once every 60 days
  • #74
  • Aug 7, 2007 5:24am Aug 7, 2007 5:24am
Quoting FxJarhead
This is a joke, right???? ($1.00) 1 usd dollar????????? misquote??????

Which broker gives you an account for 1 lousy buck????

Oanda has starting account size of $1 for starters, and I need not say anything about their credentials.
  • #75
  • Aug 7, 2007 7:40am Aug 7, 2007 7:40am
Quoting forexlion
Oanda has starting account size of $1 for starters, and I need not say anything about their credentials.
well if you opened a $1 account i can honestly tell you there is NO way you can turn your $1 into $100 in 60 days trading 1cent lots (assuming you cant trade your full $1 since you need to put some money down as margin).

cause 1 cents X 10 pips = 10 cents
1 cent X 100 pips = $1
1 cent X 1 000 pips = $10
1 cent X 10 000 pips = $100

my friend if you can make 5000-10000 pips on average (i do recall you saying that u did it a lot of times) then i would suggest you sell your home, borrow money from friends and family or even rob a bank cause ur a forex guru and the sky is the limit...you will become the richest man in the world in no time....

But most experience traders will tell you that making 2000-3000 pips a month is exceptional trading
  • #76
  • Aug 7, 2007 1:17pm Aug 7, 2007 1:17pm
Quoting forexlion
Oanda has starting account size of $1 for starters, and I need not say anything about their credentials.

Yes Forexlion,

I also use Oanda as one of my brokers.

I am also well aware that Oanda does not offer 1% margin......only 2% or greater. I am aware they offer a buck for openers, why??? I don't know...I'm sure the paperwork to open the account costs them money....though I'm sure they have that end worked out.

So your buck isn't working over there at 100-1.........most Oanada offers is 50-1...........

This is the Kind of B.S. that many readers should have jumped all over.....yet not one reply !!! Wonder why,?????? does it offer that pie-in-the-sky fuzzy feeling of getting rich with nothing.....yet the thread Starter has been "bashed" for stating many truths of the trading FX world.

I am starting to understand more and more each day why the more successful traders decide to withhold help and assisstance......Not many want to hear the TRUTH.....Many would rather listen to MARKETING HYPE !
Proper Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance
  • #77
  • Aug 7, 2007 6:20pm Aug 7, 2007 6:20pm
Hi Folks !

I've studied all the posts and to all the guys and gals who are
confused and hesitating now what to do I recite a quote of Buddha :

"ALL THAT WE ARE IS THE RESULT OF WHAT WE HAVE THOUGHT"

I also started 3 years ago with a $500 mini account and thanks to
compounding I'm doing quite well now.

You have to understand the flow of the market to make constant
money.

Thats all I want to mention here because I don't want to be kicked
out here by presenting the real deal....

You can trade without charts if you know the market right....

Happy trading

Bernhard
  • #78
  • Aug 7, 2007 8:02pm Aug 7, 2007 8:02pm
I wonder what the ex-Amaroth energy trader would say... trading system or account size hmmm hahaha

I think the trading system has proven itself
  • #79
  • Aug 8, 2007 3:47am Aug 8, 2007 3:47am
Quoting FxJarhead
Yes Forexlion,

I also use Oanda as one of my brokers.

I am also well aware that Oanda does not offer 1% margin......only 2% or greater. I am aware they offer a buck for openers, why??? I don't know...I'm sure the paperwork to open the account costs them money....though I'm sure they have that end worked out.

So your buck isn't working over there at 100-1.........most Oanada offers is 50-1...........

This is the Kind of B.S. that many readers should have jumped all over.....yet not one reply !!! Wonder why,?????? does it offer that pie-in-the-sky fuzzy feeling of getting rich with nothing.....yet the thread Starter has been "bashed" for stating many truths of the trading FX world.

I am starting to understand more and more each day why the more successful traders decide to withhold help and assisstance......Not many want to hear the TRUTH.....Many would rather listen to MARKETING HYPE !
i have to agree with you. We wanna help people make a success out of forex but yet they are stubborn and ignorant and believe that Jesus/Buddha/their own opinions/their unrealistic dreams/what-the-drunk- guy-next-to-them-in-the-bar-once-said......etc....will help them make money in forex

I always remember what my first broker told me after i found out that zar/usd is not a major currency with them but an exotic currency (that is virtually untradable cause it takes about a minute to get a quote but the currency can move 1000 pips a day)....he said: "Sir there is no easy money to be made in forex." I will never forget this statement coming from someone who has been in the business for 20 plus years.
  • #80
  • Aug 8, 2007 3:52am Aug 8, 2007 3:52am
Quoting inggscap
I wonder what the ex-Amaroth energy trader would say... trading system or account size hmmm hahaha

I think the trading system has proven itself

if you are so sure that your trading system has proven itself why dont you sell it to everyone on here???? cause most people seem to look for the holy grail......

ps....any trading system is based on indicators and as we all know most indicators are lagging....so by the time you get in the market....the big boys are already taking profits...
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