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5Min Intraday System

  • #1,801
  • Jul 27, 2007 12:57am Jul 27, 2007 12:57am
Quoting eyevoltage
Your first chart was a classic example of the frustrations that can sometimes infuriate a trader, Willem. A trade that was close, but not close enough, due to the R/S line. Then the next opportunity that you correctly dismissed (albeit reluctantly) due to all sorts of mitigating circumstances. And after you've walked away from it? It does exactly what you wanted it to do in the first place! Makes you want to put your foot through the bloody screen sometimes.

Nice examples, mate.
Hi Eyev & other readers

Yes, patience and the ability to walk away if the setup is not according to your rules is the name of the game in the 5min system. Just remember, there will be lost of other trades in the near future. Don't cry over spilled milk (or something like that).

Most important - enjoy the trading and don't get frustrated. It will definitely kill you.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,802
  • Jul 27, 2007 3:41am Jul 27, 2007 3:41am
.....but hey, I'm calm, I'm calm. Like buses, there'll be another one along soon! This chart is another example of "Should I? Shouldn't I?" because although it looks like a nice promising trade, there are a couple of rules it violates. Firstly, of course, is the fact that it's the first pull-back after the cross-over, which is a no-no. Oh, but just LOOK at that perfect little touch by the candlestick upper shadow on the 21ema PLUS the trend-line! What? It's too near the Pivot Point? No problem. We'll just wait for a candle to open under it and then jump in! After all, the Pivot Point and the Trend Line are forming a descending triangle, so when there's a break-down, we're IN!! Look at the 2nd arrow!! There we go!! WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!! A virtual ski-run for a haul of over 70 pips!!! WHAT D'YOU MEAN, I CAN'T???? Well, there's the first pull-back rule, as I mentioned before. Also, look at the 21ema in the SMAAngle window. It's nowhere near crossing the Zero Line, never mind the -0.1 Line, so that rules the trade out as well. Ironically, the ADX is looking really sweet at the point of entry, but hey, rules are rules, and as our good friend Golfer is always at pains to point out, they must be observed, otherwise money could be lost, which is ALSO a strict no-no! However, I just WISH, once we'd ruled the trade out for whatever reason, the whole thing would go pear-shaped for once, if only to make us feel better about the whole thing! Waddya say?
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  • #1,803
  • Jul 27, 2007 5:59am Jul 27, 2007 5:59am
Quoting eyevoltage
.....but hey, I'm calm, I'm calm. Like buses, there'll be another one along soon! This chart is another example of "Should I? Shouldn't I?" because although it looks like a nice promising trade, there are a couple of rules it violates. Firstly, of course, is the fact that it's the first pull-back after the cross-over, which is a no-no. Oh, but just LOOK at that perfect little touch by the candlestick upper shadow on the 21ema PLUS the trend-line! What? It's too near the Pivot Point? No problem. We'll just wait for a candle to open under it and then jump in! After all, the Pivot Point and the Trend Line are forming a descending triangle, so when there's a break-down, we're IN!! Look at the 2nd arrow!! There we go!! WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!! A virtual ski-run for a haul of over 70 pips!!! WHAT D'YOU MEAN, I CAN'T???? Well, there's the first pull-back rule, as I mentioned before. Also, look at the 21ema in the SMAAngle window. It's nowhere near crossing the Zero Line, never mind the -0.1 Line, so that rules the trade out as well. Ironically, the ADX is looking really sweet at the point of entry, but hey, rules are rules, and as our good friend Golfer is always at pains to point out, they must be observed, otherwise money could be lost, which is ALSO a strict no-no! However, I just WISH, once we'd ruled the trade out for whatever reason, the whole thing would go pear-shaped for once, if only to make us feel better about the whole thing! Waddya say?
Hi Eyev

Too bad but look at the EURU$ - two sitters and the first one was a classic/beauty. I'll discuss the chart later today. Unfortunately I did have time to trade that session today. Hope some of you got it.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,804
  • Jul 27, 2007 6:11am Jul 27, 2007 6:11am
I wonder how our good friend Golfer would rate this one. A gentle pull-back off the S1 line, but it's a rather narrow range between the 10ema and the 21ema. One very small candle finds resistance at the 21ema (1st blue arrow), and then we have a dramatic 25 pip drop (2nd blue candle) back down through the S1 line. However, if you'd been tempted to enter at just below S1, you'd still have been left with 15 or 16 pips with the potential exit just above the M1 line. What then? Would you have quit, or would you have stayed with it for a possible risky trade that would have given you a further 14 pips? Everything was still peachy with the SMAAngle 21ema plus the ADX was looking good, so what to do? For myself, I would have grabbed the 15/16 pips and got the hell outta Dodge. In fact, that's what I did, but as I hinted at the beginning, I WAS slightly concerned about the narrow 10/21ema range, but in situations like that, the trick is to watch it like a hawk and bale out at the first sign of trouble.
I wonder if anyone out there took this trade and did they stick with it until the close of that 2nd candle?
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  • #1,805
  • Jul 27, 2007 6:24am Jul 27, 2007 6:24am
Quoting Golfer
Hi Eyev

Too bad but look at the EURU$ - two sitters and the first one was a classic/beauty. I'll discuss the chart later today. Unfortunately I did have time to trade that session today. Hope some of you got it.
Hi Willem.
Only saw your post after I'd posted the second chart, so I'd guess that it's one of the trades you mentioned above.

See you later, mate.
Cheers
  • #1,806
  • Jul 27, 2007 7:11am Jul 27, 2007 7:11am
Quoting eyevoltage
Hi Willem.
Only saw your post after I'd posted the second chart, so I'd guess that it's one of the trades you mentioned above.

See you later, mate.
Cheers
Hi Eyev

Exactly the setup/s you were talking about. I'll post the chart with my comments later.

What I am trying to do lately is to (after the entry):

1. Move SL to BE after 6pips - the usual
2. Close half my position after 10pips profit
3. Move SL closer to where I just took the 10pips profit. Don't keep it at BE otherwise will only get half the profit if the price move was only 10pips. The R:R is then no longer 1:1. But also not to close - it very difficult
4. If the price doesn't move in my direction, the SL will be triggered still with a small profit in hand with the second half of the trade (v/s BE)
5. If the price move in my direction I follow the price manually with my SL. Usually about 10-13pips away from the price. But you need to sit in front of the PC and follow the trade.

At the end of June I had a nett 45pips trade on Cable using this method. It is not going to work every time. Especially in a 5min system but try it. I think it is worth the risk (giving up a 4-5pips for 15-30pips in return)

I hope it make sense.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,807
  • Jul 27, 2007 10:48am Jul 27, 2007 10:48am
My chart for that classic smooth rounding setup:

1. Small Resistance line between candle A & B

2. 21MA coming out of the non-trade zone on Line C - any setup after Line C is a possible "go now"

3. Look at the ellipse D - the upper border. That is what I am looking for and what I am trying to tell your about a smooth rounding pullback. Classic.

4. Unfortunately there was that "Tail" through the 21MA - be careful. But there wasn't a close on the wrong side of the 21MA - still a go

5. If I do see a rounding like that - I know the price won't come back to the 21MA. You need to take it from the 10MA (take on the risk).

6. That is why candle 1 would have been my entry point. Below the one pivot point but still enough pips left to the next pivot point (just about 10pips - which in this case I would have taken it).
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 20070727 5min e$ setup.jpg Size: 76 KB
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,808
  • Jul 27, 2007 11:02am Jul 27, 2007 11:02am
And the next EUR$ setup. A difficult one - probably not one I would have taken. But then it looks like to find resistance below a pivot line. Also a nice flat pullback but it is taking a bit too long to continue its move downwards. I would like to a move after 4-5 candles And then also I don't really see a triangle being formed.

It was a nice trade setup - 2 candle entry from the 21MA.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 20070727 5min e$ setup 2.jpg Size: 77 KB
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,809
  • Jul 27, 2007 4:58pm Jul 27, 2007 4:58pm
Quoting Golfer
And the next EUR$ setup. A difficult one - probably not one I would have taken. But then it looks like to find resistance below a pivot line. Also a nice flat pullback but it is taking a bit too long to continue its move downwards. I would like to a move after 4-5 candles And then also I don't really see a triangle being formed.

It was a nice trade setup - 2 candle entry from the 21MA.
Hi Willem
Good analysis, mate, and one can't argue with your logic. However, I could see there was a slight difference in my chart and yours, but I couldn't see what it was at first. Anyway, it turns out that the S1 line on your chart is 1.3705, whilst on mine it was 1.3697. An 8 pip difference!! Now I wonder why that is, seeing as (I think) we're using the same Pivot indicator. (Or are you using Fib Pivots or something?). I don't know how you see this, but I see an 8 pip difference in pivots having the potential to completely alter one's judgement. Of course, it makes no difference now..........water under the bridge and all that........but still, I can't help being a bit puzzled by the whole thing.

Cheers
  • #1,810
  • Jul 28, 2007 2:24am Jul 28, 2007 2:24am
Quoting eyevoltage
Hi Willem
Good analysis, mate, and one can't argue with your logic. However, I could see there was a slight difference in my chart and yours, but I couldn't see what it was at first. Anyway, it turns out that the S1 line on your chart is 1.3705, whilst on mine it was 1.3697. An 8 pip difference!! Now I wonder why that is, seeing as (I think) we're using the same Pivot indicator. (Or are you using Fib Pivots or something?). I don't know how you see this, but I see an 8 pip difference in pivots having the potential to completely alter one's judgement. Of course, it makes no difference now..........water under the bridge and all that........but still, I can't help being a bit puzzled by the whole thing.

Cheers
Yes, you are right but don't be concerned. I think it is just the different price feed from different brokers. I do (still) use the MultiPivotV2 indicator.

This is once again why the Skype chat can confuse people if they don't have the same broker. Previously I was listening the Phillip's daily wrap-ups and didn't have clue what he was talking about. I got so confused only to realise afterwards his broker's candles closed on a different time frame than mine giving total different signals.

With the different price feed you'll get different candles and pivot levels because of different H, L. C & O prices. Our candles on 5min will open and close on the same time frame.

Just look at your setup and mine on the EURU$ - mine is a smooth rounding while yours doesn't show it. If it was on the Skype chat, you wouldn't understand what I was talking about. Therefore I would change to a private chat on Skype and send you my chart for clarification.

So, don't worry about and trade your signals as you have it on Your Rules and as it appears on your chart.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,811
  • Jul 28, 2007 3:31am Jul 28, 2007 3:31am
Yes, I hadn't thought about different brokers price feeds. Makes sense in a funny sort of way, I suppose.

Comparing our two charts, I see what you mean, and as you say, the only thing one can do is trade it as one sees it.

Let's face it, if one was looking for confirmation from other people on here in different parts of the world, one could go CRAZY trying to sort out the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

So there you go, folks. Trade it as YOU see it, and don't worry about what the next guy is doing.

Cheers Willem
  • #1,812
  • Jul 28, 2007 4:13am Jul 28, 2007 4:13am
Quoting eyevoltage
Yes, I hadn't thought about different brokers price feeds. Makes sense in a funny sort of way, I suppose.

Comparing our two charts, I see what you mean, and as you say, the only thing one can do is trade it as one sees it.

Let's face it, if one was looking for confirmation from other people on here in different parts of the world, one could go CRAZY trying to sort out the wheat from the chaff, so to speak.

So there you go, folks. Trade it as YOU see it, and don't worry about what the next guy is doing.

Cheers Willem
Hi EYev

Thanks for the support and interaction, I do appreciate it - so much to learn about this system. The more interaction the better.

That is why I would encourage people to post their charts on the thread for other people to see and come up with opinions and rules of their own. And to share it with each other.

I (and I'm sure I can say "We") would even like to hear the problems people experience with this system (but in a nice manner - like Phillip is expecting it). That will also be very helpful.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,813
  • Jul 28, 2007 7:02am Jul 28, 2007 7:02am
Quoting Golfer
Hi EYev

Thanks for the support and interaction, I do appreciate it - so much to learn about this system. The more interaction the better.

That is why I would encourage people to post their charts on the thread for other people to see and come up with opinions and rules of their own. And to share it with each other.

I (and I'm sure I can say "We") would even like to hear the problems people experience with this system (but in a nice manner - like Phillip is expecting it). That will also be very helpful.
Couldn't agree more, mate. I often look at the "Current Viewers" box at the bottom of the page, and sometimes there's quite a few members and guests reading the thread. It would be nice to see more of them getting on here and giving opinions, suggestions and yes, even criticism. Every contribution is welcome, as I'm sure you agree.

Willem, this is the 121st page of this thread, and so far, there's only you and me on it!! :surprised Where's emacro these days, for instance? I liked looking at his charts showing possible trades.

So, to anybody reading this......drop in, say hi, and let's have a chin-wag. Everybody's welcome!

Cheers
  • #1,814
  • Jul 28, 2007 11:13am Jul 28, 2007 11:13am
Hi all, I am just learning this strategy....looks good. My question is what are you using to draw s & r lines and pivots? Are you doing it manually or thru an indicator? Thank you all for your input.
  • #1,815
  • Jul 28, 2007 11:15am Jul 28, 2007 11:15am
Quoting eyevoltage
I wonder how our good friend Golfer would rate this one. A gentle pull-back off the S1 line, but it's a rather narrow range between the 10ema and the 21ema. One very small candle finds resistance at the 21ema (1st blue arrow), and then we have a dramatic 25 pip drop (2nd blue candle) back down through the S1 line. However, if you'd been tempted to enter at just below S1, you'd still have been left with 15 or 16 pips with the potential exit just above the M1 line. What then? Would you have quit, or would you have stayed with it for a possible risky trade that would have given you a further 14 pips? Everything was still peachy with the SMAAngle 21ema plus the ADX was looking good, so what to do? For myself, I would have grabbed the 15/16 pips and got the hell outta Dodge. In fact, that's what I did, but as I hinted at the beginning, I WAS slightly concerned about the narrow 10/21ema range, but in situations like that, the trick is to watch it like a hawk and bale out at the first sign of trouble.
I wonder if anyone out there took this trade and did they stick with it until the close of that 2nd candle?

hi,i took thus position when the 3690 is breaked.i went short at 3685 and i closed it at 1.3660
dont forget ,there was a daily trend line(from 3250 to 3430) and when the price goes under 3690 the trend is also broken and thats why the eur crashed after that.
good luck
  • #1,816
  • Jul 28, 2007 11:54am Jul 28, 2007 11:54am
Hi all
I am back from a few days away in tropical island paradise.... Guess where?

Opened up the charts and wow...what a move in the JPY crosses. Raring to get back to trading on Monday.
Attached Image
  • #1,817
  • Jul 28, 2007 2:56pm Jul 28, 2007 2:56pm
Quoting jcarrier
Hi all, I am just learning this strategy....looks good. My question is what are you using to draw s & r lines and pivots? Are you doing it manually or thru an indicator? Thank you all for your input.
Hi Jc

Page 119 of this thread has a few pivot indicators.
Willem Forex recipe for success = Patience, discipline & hard work.
  • #1,818
  • Jul 28, 2007 3:54pm Jul 28, 2007 3:54pm
Quoting bshadroo
hi,i took thus position when the 3690 is breaked.i went short at 3685 and i closed it at 1.3660
dont forget ,there was a daily trend line(from 3250 to 3430) and when the price goes under 3690 the trend is also broken and thats why the eur crashed after that.
good luck
Comments much appreciated. Any chance of you posting your chart? I'd be interested in comparing with mine, just as I like to compare with emacro and golfer, petrol etc.

Cheers mate.
  • #1,819
  • Jul 28, 2007 3:58pm Jul 28, 2007 3:58pm
Quoting emacro
Hi all
I am back from a few days away in tropical island paradise.... Guess where?

Opened up the charts and wow...what a move in the JPY crosses. Raring to get back to trading on Monday.
Well, it ain't Blackpool, and that's a fact!

Welcome back, mate.

Cheers
  • #1,820
  • Jul 28, 2007 4:42pm Jul 28, 2007 4:42pm
hi eyevoltage
u may somtimes should ignore the m5 rules and look at the bigger pictures
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eur.jpg Size: 74 KB
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