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  • #44,821
  • Nov 30, 2024 12:26pm Nov 30, 2024 12:26pm
Quoting Novazor
{quote} Very strange indeed, maybe to avoid regulation and do manipulation
no they try to make their own platform compete with metatrader but their own platform is very bad.
  • #44,822
  • Nov 30, 2024 1:03pm Nov 30, 2024 1:03pm
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TheTradingPit
  • #44,823
  • Nov 30, 2024 1:18pm Nov 30, 2024 1:18pm
Inserted Video
  • #44,824
  • Nov 30, 2024 1:29pm Nov 30, 2024 1:29pm
Quoting Stoneyrocks
{image} TheTradingPit
A pity that they only allow one account (already have a funded there)
  • #44,825
  • Nov 30, 2024 4:12pm Nov 30, 2024 4:12pm
So, in comparing a 2 step forex challenge with a straight to funded futures prop, pretty amazing what a no brainer it is.

Pay $499 for a 100K 2 step offering 10K in DD
Pay $384 for a 150K direct funded futures offering 7500 DD
$$$/DD is close enough to even.
The forex firm and the futures firm both require profit equal to the DD, known as stage 1 in the forex prop and building the buffer in futures.
Here's where the no brainer comes in:
At this point, you can withdrawal 3K from the futures firm, the forex firm you must earn another 50% of DD (5K) to pass stage 2 and then earn a profit on the live account of $3,750 to get paid the same $3K.
Meanwhile, in the futures firm, you may continue to pull 3K every 3K you make.
By the time you pull the first 3K from the forex firm, you've pulled 9K in the futures firm.
  • #44,826
  • Nov 30, 2024 4:13pm Nov 30, 2024 4:13pm
Quoting fx_rookie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFLefR00w6c

watched the 1.5 hour video in 1 go …worth watching !

If Scott from FTT is the darkness , then Brett is the brighest star in the firmament

he even has a quant on board
  • #44,827
  • Nov 30, 2024 4:23pm Nov 30, 2024 4:23pm
Quoting montygoldy
Seems like alpha futures also balling with these kinda payouts....... {image}
Monty,
Is Tradeify the same as TickTick on the direct to funded, once you hit the 7500 threshold (150K) you can pull the 3K from within the buffer? Then just make 3K to get it back to the 157500 and withdrawal 3K again......I do now tradeify requires 9000 now on new accounts, but same concept, you pull from within the "safety net"?
  • #44,828
  • Nov 30, 2024 5:30pm Nov 30, 2024 5:30pm
Quoting pipmaster77
So, in comparing a 2 step forex challenge with a straight to funded futures prop, pretty amazing what a no brainer it is. Pay $499 for a 100K 2 step offering 10K in DD Pay $384 for a 150K direct funded futures offering 7500 DD $$$/DD is close enough to even. The forex firm and the futures firm both require profit equal to the DD, known as stage 1 in the forex prop and building the buffer in futures. Here's where the no brainer comes in: At this point, you can withdrawal 3K from the futures firm, the forex firm you must earn another 50% of DD (5K)...
There is one more.

FX prop firm... you can keep for ever if you trade consistently.

Futures, after probably 6th payout, it leads to live funded account
Intraday only.
  • #44,829
  • Edited 6:28pm Nov 30, 2024 5:57pm | Edited 6:28pm
Quoting pipmaster77
So, in comparing a 2 step forex challenge with a straight to funded futures prop, pretty amazing what a no brainer it is. Pay $499 for a 100K 2 step offering 10K in DD Pay $384 for a 150K direct funded futures offering 7500 DD $$$/DD is close enough to even. The forex firm and the futures firm both require profit equal to the DD, known as stage 1 in the forex prop and building the buffer in futures. Here's where the no brainer comes in: At this point, you can withdrawal 3K from the futures firm, the forex firm you must earn another 50% of DD (5K)...

the difference is the required consistency of 20% with the straight to funded futures firm , which you dont have with the Forex firm

If you make more than 20% of your profit target in a day , the profit target will increase with the STF futures , so you will have to cut winners if you dont want your profit target to increase

This will slow you down with the STF futures firm to reach your profit target and subsequent payout’s

Here are all the payout requirements with Tradeify ;

 

  1. Consistency Rule: Abide by the 20% Consistency Rule (See: What is the Consistency Rule?)
  2. Minimum Days Traded: You must trade on at least 10 separate days for your first withdrawal and between each subsequent payout request.

    1. If this requirement is not met by the end of the current pay period, you may request a payout in the next period once the requirement is fulfilled.
    2. 5 or more of the Minimum Days Traded must show a profit greater than:

      1. $100 in profit for 25k accounts
      2. $150 in profit for 50k accounts
      3. $200 in profit for 100k accounts
      4. $250 in profit for 150k accounts




With the forex firm , you can pass the 2 phases with a few large trades and get a payout without all those requirements..

The gamblers who hope to pass with a few large trades are better off with the forex firm

  • #44,830
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:20pm Nov 30, 2024 6:20pm
Quoting pipmaster77
So, in comparing a 2 step forex challenge with a straight to funded futures prop, pretty amazing what a no brainer it is. Pay $499 for a 100K 2 step offering 10K in DD Pay $384 for a 150K direct funded futures offering 7500 DD $$$/DD is close enough to even. The forex firm and the futures firm both require profit equal to the DD, known as stage 1 in the forex prop and building the buffer in futures. Here's where the no brainer comes in: At this point, you can withdrawal 3K from the futures firm, the forex firm you must earn another 50% of DD (5K)...
what is the DD type?
  • #44,831
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:21pm Nov 30, 2024 6:21pm
Quoting Stoneyrocks
{quote} the difference is the required consistency of 20% with the straight to funded futures firm , which you dont have with the Forex firm If you make more than 20% of your profit target in a day , the profit target will increase with the STF futures , so you will have to cut winners instead of losers if you dont want your profit target to increase This will slow you down with the STF futures firm to reach your profit target and subsequent payout’s Here are all the payout requirements with Tradeify ; Consistency Rule: Abide by the 20% Consistency...
Forex firms are notorious of mending rules if you make money and receive large payouts. If traders make 1%-2% they are ok but larger they will make up shit rule like you can't risk more than 1% per trade etc which is worse than 20% consistency and this is from top notch firms like 5ers and FTMO forget about bucket shops.
  • #44,832
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:26pm Nov 30, 2024 6:26pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} what is the DD type?
Trailing EOD
  • #44,833
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:36pm Nov 30, 2024 6:36pm
Quoting Stoneyrocks
{quote} the difference is the required consistency of 20% with the straight to funded futures firm , which you dont have with the Forex firm If you make more than 20% of your profit target in a day , the profit target will increase with the STF futures , so you will have to cut winners if you dont want your profit target to increase This will slow you down with the STF futures firm to reach your profit target and subsequent payout’s Here are all the payout requirements with Tradeify ; Consistency Rule: Abide by the 20% Consistency Rule (See: What...
Triple the pay for the same work........plus as mentioned above the forex firms just change shit whenever they wish.
Even with trailing EOD, a non gambler trader won't even be bothered by it. It becomes static after building the buffer anyway.
There truly is no comparison
  • #44,834
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:40pm Nov 30, 2024 6:40pm
Quoting navk
{quote} There is one more. FX prop firm... you can keep for ever if you trade consistently. Futures, after probably 6th payout, it leads to live funded account
The futures firm gives you a live account and the forex firm bans you. Make no mistake, you are a liabilty to the firm until they move you to live. That is why they do it.
Forex props........collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then potentially get banned to get you off the balance sheet
Futures props......collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then get moved to an actual live account.
So triple the payout and then live vs. 1/3 the payout and then banned.
  • #44,835
  • Nov 30, 2024 6:45pm Nov 30, 2024 6:45pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} The futures firm gives you a live account and the forex firm bans you. Make no mistake, you are a liabilty to the firm until they move you to live. That is why they do it. Forex props........collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then potentially get banned to get you off the balance sheet Futures props......collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then get moved to an actual live account. So triple the payout and then live vs. 1/3 the payout and then banned.
I guess since I've done both and now fully transitioned to futures, I may be byased. However, the facts are the facts. Perhaps it is simply the futures firms learned from the forex firms mistakes and the live account is the "out" to get rid of you.
Tradeify says they are going to copy you in live, so in addition to the 100% payout, you'll get 10% on top......pretty cool concept.
The way I see it, the forex props were 100% misleading from the get go while the futures firms are far more transparent.
I didn't care about the model of the forex prop and most intelligent traders using them knew the real deal, but it just "feels" better dealing with a transparent company than one telling you things that are not even close to the reality.
  • #44,836
  • Nov 30, 2024 7:07pm Nov 30, 2024 7:07pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} I guess since I've done both and now fully transitioned to futures, I may be byased. However, the facts are the facts. Perhaps it is simply the futures firms learned from the forex firms mistakes and the live account is the "out" to get rid of you. Tradeify says they are going to copy you in live, so in addition to the 100% payout, you'll get 10% on top......pretty cool concept. The way I see it, the forex props were 100% misleading from the get go while the futures firms are far more transparent. I didn't care about the model of the forex...
It all depends on timing. There was a time when forex firms are like futures firm. Even in futures look at APEX they were so linient.
It is classic casino game more signups less rules and lenient payouts.
  • #44,837
  • Nov 30, 2024 7:12pm Nov 30, 2024 7:12pm
Quoting sampat
{quote} Forex firms are notorious of mending rules if you make money and receive large payouts. If traders make 1%-2% they are ok but larger they will make up shit rule like you can't risk more than 1% per trade etc which is worse than 20% consistency and this is from top notch firms like 5ers and FTMO forget about bucket shops.
this is what FTMO says ;

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this is what The5ers say ;

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this is what Ed Seykota ,1 of the biggest traders in history says ;

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and another famous market wizard , Larry Hite ;

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www.jackschwager.com
  • #44,838
  • Edited 8:20pm Nov 30, 2024 7:13pm | Edited 8:20pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} I dont think the 1 step challenge you are hoping is sustainable from all sides. If we get sustainability from props and good access at reasonable prices i think that finally the props will be a long term project that can be used with 10 years in mind and some trust will come back. The wild west period was very negative to the community as it was basically pump.fun but for businesses.
Yes, that's true. I'm just keeping track of information from these broker-backed prop firms according to my criteria. What they offer may differ, but the criteria are clearly outlined in there. Who knows, someone might be interested because of the Black Friday discounts of up to around 30%, regardless of the challenge rules from each prop firm.

Some have offered a target of 5 to 6 percent, some use a 7-day limit, and others have no limit. However, so far, their standard is a 10% target or more. I think achieving 10% normally takes more than a month, if successful. Average gain maybe just 3.2%, a month or half month (https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers....act_id=4965616) (https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...5#post15069355) . I like the betting model—taking actions with random outcomes accompanied by sufficient skill (it is trading). Ideally, it includes a fair price, a one-month time limit, drawdowns, and profit targets within reach.

Some prop brokers may have a long lifespan. Some have already ceased operations, such as Funded Prop BX, Vantage Elite, and The Forex Funder. Some may not fit the definition of a broker-backed prop firm, but this remains unclear.
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fooled by randomness in art
Meditation All Time Return: 8.9%
  • #44,839
  • Nov 30, 2024 7:36pm Nov 30, 2024 7:36pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Triple the pay for the same work........
the same work that will require more time because of the consistency rule and payout requirements …

less pay but faster payouts <> more pay but later payouts
  • #44,840
  • Nov 30, 2024 8:07pm Nov 30, 2024 8:07pm
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} The futures firm gives you a live account and the forex firm bans you. Make no mistake, you are a liabilty to the firm until they move you to live. That is why they do it. Forex props........collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then potentially get banned to get you off the balance sheet Futures props......collect fees from the 95% that fail, the 5% that pass get a few payouts and then get moved to an actual live account. So triple the payout and then live vs. 1/3 the payout and then banned.
No doubt, I would give more weightage to Futures firm.

A consistent FX trader, looking for 1 to 2 % biweekly with less risk can survive too in fx prop firm, a reputed good firm. FTMO.
Intraday only.
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