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  • #30,301
  • Feb 13, 2024 9:56am Feb 13, 2024 9:56am
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} I dont see how any are claiming to be exempt because grandfather yada yada... If they are promoting CFD products, the axe will swing their way as with all the others.
Yes and being a UK company, promising CFD's with real money (for a buy in) without a license from FCA... tsk tsk.
  • #30,302
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:06am Feb 13, 2024 10:06am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yep, for our safety. As we speak I am trading the audusd on my amp futures account with 273:1 leverage. Kinda dangerous, don't ya think? Why is it OK?....I'll let the answers pile in.
CFTC is getting money or commissions from futures trading
  • #30,303
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:07am Feb 13, 2024 10:07am
Quoting 1hr
{quote} Futures trading sucks! Trailing drawdown, can't hold overnight so can't swing. Limited forex options, it just sucks. There is a reason cfd props are popular not these garbage apex or topstep futures. People came along and ruined everything for USA residents just like online poker, ohh for our safety. It's all bullshit
I think trailing drawdown encourages YOLO gambling mentality.
  • #30,304
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:12am Feb 13, 2024 10:12am
Quoting sampat
{quote} CFTC is getting money or commissions from futures trading
Ding, Ding, mother fucking Ding!!!!!!!! You are the grand prize winner!!!!!!!
  • #30,305
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:13am Feb 13, 2024 10:13am
Quoting sampat
{quote} I think trailing drawdown encourages YOLO gambling mentality.
Yes, I am YOLOing an APEX as we speak.
  • #30,306
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:22am Feb 13, 2024 10:22am
  •  1hr
  • | Joined Jun 2022 | Status: Alive and Well | 132 Posts | Online Now
I applaud all firms who are not throwing away USA residents in the wake of industry turbulence.

It is not illegal to prop trade in the usa
Meta q deciding to end service on certain basis does not mean other services cannot step in or be created as they certainly are doing so knowing it is fully legal
These instances of firms being shaken down Is due to supposed fraud, if no fraud has been committed stand firm.

Let a pronouncement actually be made and hands shown from regulatory agencies as to what is allowed or not allowed.
Not Financial Advice
  • #30,307
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:32am Feb 13, 2024 10:32am
Quoting 1hr
These instances of firms being shaken down Is due to supposed fraud, if no fraud has been committed stand firm. Let a pronouncement actually be made and hands shown from regulatory agencies as to what is allowed or not allowed.
Don't fool yourself. This isn't just about instances of fraud. These prop firms have long skirted US CFD laws that eventually caught up to them.

Also don't expect the regulatory agencies to give guidance on what is allowed. They are enforcement/shakedown only.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #30,308
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:41am Feb 13, 2024 10:41am
  •  1hr
  • | Joined Jun 2022 | Status: Alive and Well | 132 Posts | Online Now
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} Don't fool yourself. This isn't about instances of fraud. These prop firms have long skirted US CFD laws that eventually caught up to them. Also don't expect the regulatory agencies to give guidance on what is allowed. They are enforcement/shakedown only.
Why has not this been emphasised by any party then? They are sticking to fraud story. If a cfd law is being broken then I would expect it to be referenced and highlighted in legal precedings. They are trying and hoping to create enough fud that people,e will move away without actually addressing the real issue.

This is why I believe those reputable firms still operating and acceting usa like 5ers know their legal footing and are not shaken
Not Financial Advice
  • #30,309
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:45am Feb 13, 2024 10:45am
Quoting PropDude1234
{quote}All the restaurants in London and they choose the Oblix, which is shit. {quote}Why would anyone trust them after what they did (assuming it's true, I've not seem them deny it yet)?
Traders Show takes place at Champagne Suite, on the first floor of Novotel London West, Hammersmith.

One of the top price is dinner at one of the Shard restaurants, I am not interested, to scared of highs. You are saying isn't good one.
  • #30,310
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:46am Feb 13, 2024 10:46am
Quoting 1hr
{quote} Why has not this been emphasised by any party then? They are sticking to fraud story. If a cfd law is being broken then I would expect it to be referenced and highlighted in legal precedings. They are trying and hoping to create enough fud that people,e will move away without actually addressing the real issue.
Its a regulatory issue. Metaquotes have made that clear to me personally and to many others. People are trying to not spook their money, there is a lag in prop firms between money coming in vs payouts.

If you spook the horses, the payouts greatly outweigh the money coming in and you instantly go bust. TFT still hasn't addressed the fact that they cannot accept US customers and they themselves are run owned and operated by a US entity and a US citizen. MFFX the same. SFT the same.

These companies will crash the hardest given the circumstances.
  • #30,311
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:50am Feb 13, 2024 10:50am
Quoting 1hr
{quote} Why has not this been emphasised by any party then? They are sticking to fraud story. If a cfd law is being broken then I would expect it to be referenced and highlighted in legal precedings. They are trying and hoping to create enough fud that people,e will move away without actually addressing the real issue.
It had been addressed in MFF court doc's. The reason why Metatrader is bending the knee to US regulators has been discussed ad nauseum. Many of us who live here in the states have watched over the past 14+years FX brokers chased off US soil. Then watched how they chased vendors/payment providers as well.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #30,312
  • Feb 13, 2024 10:52am Feb 13, 2024 10:52am
Quoting 1hr
{quote} Why has not this been emphasised by any party then? They are sticking to fraud story. If a cfd law is being broken then I would expect it to be referenced and highlighted in legal precedings. They are trying and hoping to create enough fud that people,e will move away without actually addressing the real issue. This is why I believe those reputable firms still operating and acceting usa like 5ers know their legal footing and are not shaken
Are CFDs legal in the US? No. CFD trading is illegal for US citizens and residents. Additionally, most CFD brokers don’t accept US citizens or US residents as clients. CFDs are illegal in the US because they are an over-the-counter (OTC) trading product. OTC trading products aren’t listed on regulated exchanges like the New York Stock Exchange (NYSE), bypassing US regulatory bodies. However, US traders have alternatives such as forex, options and stocks.

Read more at: https://commodity.com/brokers/cfd/
  • #30,313
  • Edited 11:09am Feb 13, 2024 10:58am | Edited 11:09am
  •  1hr
  • | Joined Jun 2022 | Status: Alive and Well | 132 Posts | Online Now
I understand that but they are Simulated accounts, no real trading. It's a game
Not Financial Advice
  • #30,314
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:13am Feb 13, 2024 11:13am
Quoting 1hr
I understand that but they are Simulated accounts, no real trading. It's a game
that is MFF's current stance vs. the CFTC... it remains to be seen if that line of defense will be successful.
  • #30,315
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:14am Feb 13, 2024 11:14am
Quoting 1hr
I understand that but they are Simulated accounts, no real trading. It's a game
That was never really promoted early on. FX Prop promoted it as real trading conditions. Only when MFF got stung suddenly there was CYA, knee jerk response form remaining prop firms.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #30,316
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:14am Feb 13, 2024 11:14am
Quoting Cryptosurf
These prop firms have long skirted US CFD laws that eventually caught up to them.
-Maybe that has yet to be determined. I think, if these firms were paper trading by having contractors monitor a particular broker feed on demo and then having them submit their speculations to the firm via email, then would/should it be treated with the same regulatory scrutiny? And if so, why? What's the difference? Feed manipulation? Because the broker is doing that already.

No real trading is actually occurring. Contractors are providing data. If the data is good, then the firm pays the contractor based on how good that data is. The firm chooses whether or not to act on that data, at their own discretion, without the contractor's involvement.

Probably, there needs to be new legislation implemented if regulators really want to regulate this space. That being said, I am no expert, so I can only speculate here.

In any case, if we assume that all of these firms are dodging regulatory compliance without proper evidence, then we are no better than the CFTC.
  • #30,317
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:23am Feb 13, 2024 11:23am
Quoting Cryptosurf
That was never really promoted early on. FX Prop promoted it as real trading conditions. Only when MFF got stung suddenly there was CYA, knee jerk response form remaining prop firms.
-To be fair, most of the firms stated that the funded accounts were demo, and that the trades would be copied over to a live account at the firm's discretion. Only later, did these firms decide to rephrase everything, but it wasn't really necessary to do that, and only made things look worse.
  • #30,318
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:27am Feb 13, 2024 11:27am
Quoting Takisd
Can you point me to the funded lux accounts, how i can verify them please.

Lux funded accounts are held with Global Prime, an ASIC-regulated brokerage. Traders funded by Lux can correspond directly with the brokerage about their accounts, and some do.

I wouldn't trade there myself, but I think they're safe from the current CFTC/MQ situations anyway.
  • #30,319
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:29am Feb 13, 2024 11:29am
Quoting Nsak3y
{quote}-Maybe that has yet to be determined. I think, if these firms were paper trading by having contractors monitor a particular broker feed on demo and then having them submit their speculations to the firm via email, then would/should it be treated with the same regulatory scrutiny? And if so, why? What's the difference? Feed manipulation? Because the broker is doing that already. No real trading is actually occurring. Contractors are providing data. If the data is good, then the firm pays the contractor based on how good that data is. The firm...
It not a matter of “we are no better” etc… That has nothing to do with it.

CFTC clearly doesn’t like the business model as pointed out in the MFF docs. Regardless if it’s demo or not. Fees are being paid in (and out) to play a game that centers around prohibited trading instruments.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #30,320
  • Feb 13, 2024 11:31am Feb 13, 2024 11:31am
Quoting KarlKraus
{quote} Lux funded accounts are held with Global Prime, an ASIC-regulated brokerage. Traders funded by Lux can correspond directly with the brokerage about their accounts, and some do. I wouldn't trade there myself, but I think they're safe from the current CFTC/MQ situations anyway.
Why would they be safe? Global prime cannot accept US residents/customers under any circumstances. The threshold to be a professional customer in the US is 10 million. Ultimately they are bypassing the CFD's laws in the US and breaching global primes metaquotes contract at the same time.
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