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  • #25,921
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:10am Nov 10, 2023 8:10am
Quoting Takisd
If you trade 20sec, you can assume you will lose without making a spread.
-Depends on how you trade. If you know where the market is going, the lower time-frames are great for entries because you can minimize your draw-down to the extreme.
  • #25,922
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:15am Nov 10, 2023 8:15am
Quoting TrAndy1
Swing trading Forex is insane on Future props. You pay double the spread on trading minors via duplicating this over two major currency futures. Then you need to close your trade every day. So easy to pay 5 times more in fees than on any FX prop. You need to consider the higher trading cost. Only emini Index Futures is better. If anyone is trading micros the fees are already like a 0.45 to 0.50 spread on SP500 Index. That you can easily get also on FX props. Nothing trails there too. And trading the eminis is also very, very difficult on those 50k...
Agree. If you are trading forex, use FTMO or the 5%ers. These futures props are strictly for in indices (for me) or any other non forex asset (for others).
  • #25,923
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:17am Nov 10, 2023 8:17am
FXIFY is still good I think. I prefer FXIFY over Apex.
  • #25,924
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:20am Nov 10, 2023 8:20am
Quoting Artcool
{quote} Sorry for the newbie question, but if you withdraw 2000 from 2600 profit, you'd still have 600 profit so still an allowed drawdown of $500. Why would that violate the account?
It wouldn't, actually would be $500, as trailing stops at account balance + $100, so $50,100, but I'm assuming I would not survive with a $500 DD, although it would no longer be trailing at the point, as it would be fixed at $50,100. I say just take the $2,000, because everything you make on that account now would be the same as trading the $2K in personal
  • #25,925
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:21am Nov 10, 2023 8:21am
Quoting Artcool
{quote} Sorry for the newbie question, but if you withdraw 2000 from 2600 profit, you'd still have 600 profit so still an allowed drawdown of $500. Why would that violate the account?

I think you need to keep the starting DD amount plus 100 left in account, not to violate when withdrawing. Also newbie but thats how I understood it when I briefly looked.
  • #25,926
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:27am Nov 10, 2023 8:27am
Quoting josh1111
I think I have fallen in love with the 20 Second Timeframe! Forexbali what Order flow indicators are you using? I have yet to delve into Order Flow analysis or finding a source of Level 2 data but the short timeframes are awesome! There is a lot that happens in each minute and it is easier to see in more than the form of a jiggly line on a candle. Feel like you guys Red Pilled me. Monty if you try Apex Funding I suggest keep risk down to.4% a trade because of the trailing drawdown. Cheers {image}
20 Seconds?

That's the spirit. Gotta stay frosty at that speed.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,927
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:31am Nov 10, 2023 8:31am
Quoting youngD
Anyone been yrading with Tradeday?? After some researching there offer seems to me the most reasonable. You pay 125$ for 20k account with loss 2000 (EOD) profit 2000 . No activation fee. The only catch i found is when you make on funded account 5000 they open live account for you and they transfer there your profits minus what was withdrawed on the way. So for example if you withdraw 2000 on funded they will open live account with 3000 drawdown buffer.
I had a Tradeday account and closed it out after reaching the 5k payout, that was my goal with it. Wasn't interested in keeping it after that. Jumped on APEX as it posed another challenge and personal goal.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,928
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:36am Nov 10, 2023 8:36am
Quoting TrAndy1
And trading the eminis is also very, very difficult on those 50k accounts at Apex, because you only have 50 points as DD for 1 future. On micros there is already no advantage anymore. Better to consider the best FX props.
You say garbage like this because you have zero experience with futures and (obviously) very limited experience in FX as it is.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,929
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:39am Nov 10, 2023 8:39am
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} I had a Tradeday account and closed it out after reaching the 5k payout, that was my goal with it. Wasn't interested in keeping it after that. Jumped on APEX as it posed another challenge and personal goal.
Exactly. Everything rolls through AMP at this point. 20 accounts at APEX, just hitting first payout is 40K. Even if you have 100K in AMP, you just increased 40%......40K for an investment of what $2K ish?
Let's say one only has 10K with AMP....400% increase!!!!!!
I think most are looking at this all wrong.........WE ARE NOT BUILDING LONG TERM RELATIONSHIPS with props....we are simply accelerating the growth in personal accounts.
  • #25,930
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:43am Nov 10, 2023 8:43am
On another note, I know some think pivots are a crock, but NAS just bounced off the R61 on daily, which was about 10 points shy of ADR high as well.....quick 25 points.
It's almost back there again......rinse, repeat.
  • #25,931
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:46am Nov 10, 2023 8:46am
FTMO have acquired a traditional prop firm.


Inserted Video
  • #25,932
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:55am Nov 10, 2023 8:55am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Right, but you don't need to be there 2 years.....let's use apex as an example as that is the only one I've used, 90% off pay $16.70 for 50K, let's just say 10 accounts for simplicity. Hit the 3K goal, pay the $85 or $140, make the $2600 and withdrawal the max 2000 and violate it. You just netted $18,983. Put it in a perosnal account. Rinse, repeat until personal account is funded enough to hit your goals.
I doubt that they allow to repeat this a lot. At least TST didn't allow that in the forex part (they also had trailing stop). They were banning after a couple of times.

Anyway, whatever you can milk is good (cheap price).
  • #25,933
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:56am Nov 10, 2023 8:56am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} You say garbage, because I know you lack of a good Indices strategy. Trading the same strategy for min. 3 or 4 years but you have not made it to a few millions you are simply not good at trading. Just reality. That is why you need to hunt for a few dollars on every Future prop challenge (still). Come down, and calm. You better keep silent.
For someone who was a supposed baller in the Futures industry, you sure feel from grace to talking nonsense on an FX forum. You have zero knowledge of futures by what you say. We all know you don't trade at a hedge fund either. They would never take a clown like yourself.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,934
  • Nov 10, 2023 8:56am Nov 10, 2023 8:56am
Quoting FX-DON
FTMO have acquired a traditional prop firm. https://youtu.be/jRlVOOiIYIc?si=mxe636yOjwO_em2d
Yes, just received the email. This has to be a good sign for longevity of FTMO.
  • #25,935
  • Nov 10, 2023 9:00am Nov 10, 2023 9:00am
Quoting FX-DON
FTMO have acquired a traditional prop firm. https://youtu.be/jRlVOOiIYIc?si=mxe636yOjwO_em2d
Never heard about this prop. Usually all these props are struggling. There is no consistent trader for many years on those firms. If one good trader grows he will join an investment bank or hedge fund. No one stays at that size and salary for longer on such real prop firms. That step does not make much sense. Maybe FTMO had enough to spend some money. But no one (not a good consistent trader) wants to sit for a few gran on a desk if that person also could trade remotely on props and make 5 digit monthly income.
  • #25,936
  • Nov 10, 2023 9:03am Nov 10, 2023 9:03am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yes, just received the email. This has to be a good sign for longevity of FTMO.
It is not a good sign. They cannot make profits from the data they have. So they hired some Quant traders at this prop. I guess this is all random data mostly. So over 99.9% probably useless data. FTMO wants to create profitable strategies or execution algos from the data they have. I doubt with this prop it will change. For sure.
  • #25,937
  • Edited 10:04am Nov 10, 2023 9:07am | Edited 10:04am
I regret to inform you all that my short-lived APEX futures trading career is over

I initiated the "big" SP500 short yesterday based on some sexy 4H divergence. Woke up all excited as I saw the SP500 sold off nicely. Then I looked at my PnL only to realize that I was -$3000 on my 100K account. Apparently, I have no idea what I'm doing and thought I was trading mini contracts but was actually trading regular contracts. What a kick in the chicklets. The price spike before the big plummet wiped out my $22 investment, oh my.

Anyway, I'm assuming I can just hit the "cancel" button and get on with my life and I won't be charged any recurring payments. Is that correct?

I just don't have it in me to learn a new skill set for futures. I won't do anything that I'm not all in on and willing to put in 1000's of hours of work so bye bye futures and hello back to Forex on Meta4, phew.
Pride always comes before destruction.... -Proverbs 16:18
  • #25,938
  • Nov 10, 2023 9:08am Nov 10, 2023 9:08am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Never heard about this prop.
Again with the stupidity.

They been around for the better part of a decade.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,939
  • Nov 10, 2023 9:10am Nov 10, 2023 9:10am
Quoting Expo33
I regret to inform you all that my short-lived APEX futures trading career is over I initiated the "big" SP500 short yesterday based on some sexy 4H divergence. Woke up all excited as I saw the SP500 sold off nicely. Then I looked at my PnL only to realize that I was -$3000 on my 100K account. Apparently, I have no idea what I'm doing and thought I was trading mini contracts but was actually trading regular contracts. What a kick in the chicklets. The price spike before the big plummet wiped out my $22 investment, oh my. Anyway, I'm...
You're not alone, theres a lot of FX Prop refugees dipping into futures and getting wiped out. Its a different beast altogether.

And yes you can just cancel the subscription and call it a day.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #25,940
  • Nov 10, 2023 9:22am Nov 10, 2023 9:22am
Just to make it round for all Apex traders or wannabees. Even the 50k does not make much sense on trailing regarding trading on an own personal account at a futures broker. Because doing 3k on a 2.5k DD even on a small 50k account means more than 3.3 times value already. Then you need again to do this with more consistency on the PA account. So even with 90% discount and lifetime fee you pay something like $160. Then you need to multiply this by 10 and put this in relation to the max. DD you get on PA. So you see that for $1600 value you get $2500 trailing DD on PA. The score is about 1.5, so much worse than FTMO. These offers are just garbage at the end, if you take the math behind seriously. Really and point. It is not worth to do all the efforts with Apex, as there is no such consistency rules on personal account than on the Apex PA you trade there. Just be warned. If you do not simple math and just keep buying Apex challenges you are not worth to be consistent trader at the end. Everyone needs to do the math behind to evaluate such offers. There is clear advantage from all the FX prop firms. If you take the higher pricey offers from other Future props this is like daylight robbery. If one cannot do the math he should pay for it, in the double sense. Paying the fee and pay it as lesson, to learn it later from. Get this.
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