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  • #22,921
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:23am Sep 26, 2023 6:23am
And i am against regulation, but since most prop firms are not reputable like MFF or FTMO, regulation is needed to regulate data feeds payouts ect, right know prop firms are the wild west and they do and refuse what payouts they want
  • #22,922
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:23am Sep 26, 2023 6:23am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} But can the props survive without USA. I believe it is probably 30% + of their customer base because PROPS WERE THE ESCAPE to trade like the rest of the free world. Will payment processors not work with any firms or only US customers?
I was asked to map a new model tuesday last week - extremely different and without sharing details not as interesting off the bat but is more long term built. Most likely the evaluation/challenge model is done as is once easton tech gets shut down by the CFTC, it will be the end of that model. It will likely become far more stricter and harder and less generous in its evolution but will continue to have US customers.
  • #22,923
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:24am Sep 26, 2023 6:24am
Quoting DeltaCapital
And i am against regulation, but since most prop firms are not reputable like MFF or FTMO, regulation is needed to regulate data feeds payouts ect, right know prop firms are the wild west and they do and refuse what payouts they want
How can you regulate data feeds when its an OTC market? As someone before has said, this is potentially due to the OTC products and not because they are prop firms.
  • #22,924
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:26am Sep 26, 2023 6:26am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} I was asked to map a new model tuesday last week - extremely different and without sharing details not as interesting off the bat but is more long term built. Most likely the evaluation/challenge model is done as is once easton tech gets shut down by the CFTC, it will be the end of that model. It will likely become far more stricter and harder and less generous in its evolution but will continue to have US customers.
You mean you need to trade for 6 months first, to show that you can get your funded account ? Then I am happy I already have my wanted funded accounts so far. Second that would also mean, MFF can continue its business, just with a different challenge model. Would be good news, as I am waiting for my 10k payouts there. Also I would like to trade my 600k funded accounts too at MFF. Also another reason to get funded account status right now, before it gets much harder and more longer term orientated. Also good news for all US customers as they can continue to trade with props. That would be probably good solution.
  • #22,925
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:28am Sep 26, 2023 6:28am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} How can you regulate data feeds when its an OTC market? As someone before has said, this is potentially due to the OTC products and not because they are prop firms.
I dont know but maybe prop firms getting their data for OTC from reputable sources, i dont know i am not an expert in that
  • #22,926
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:33am Sep 26, 2023 6:33am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} I was asked to map a new model tuesday last week - extremely different and without sharing details not as interesting off the bat but is more long term built. Most likely the evaluation/challenge model is done as is once easton tech gets shut down by the CFTC, it will be the end of that model. It will likely become far more stricter and harder and less generous in its evolution but will continue to have US customers.
The entire benefit, to me anyway, of THIS model, is the value you receive vs. a personal account. MFF, as example, pay 1K get 24K max loss, with 85% split, it is $20,400. If I took that 1K in a personal account and hit the targets required in 2 stage MFF, I'd have $2,356.
It is literally close to 9 times the account size. This is why I despise those direct models.
What I am getting at, is if any "NEW" model doesn't offer the same type of value/benefit vs. trading your own money......what's the point.
I wouldn't trade with props without anything above a 3-4 times a personal account. Just not worth it. I'm sure many feel the same.
  • #22,927
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:36am Sep 26, 2023 6:36am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} The entire benefit, to me anyway, of THIS model, is the value you receive vs. a personal account. MFF, as example, pay 1K get 24K max loss, with 85% split, it is $20,400. If I took that 1K in a personal account and hit the targets required in 2 stage MFF, I'd have $2,356. It is literally close to 9 times the account size. This is why I despise those direct models. What I am getting at, is if any "NEW" model doesn't offer the same type of value/benefit vs. trading your own money......what's the point. I wouldn't trade with props without anything...
True thats the reason anyone takes challenges, you get more for less, but CFTC wants to protect you from losing 500 in a challenge but lets you lose thounsands in a forex broker regulated by them
  • #22,928
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:36am Sep 26, 2023 6:36am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} The entire benefit, to me anyway, of THIS model, is the value you receive vs. a personal account. MFF, as example, pay 1K get 24K max loss, with 85% split, it is $20,400. If I took that 1K in a personal account and hit the targets required in 2 stage MFF, I'd have $2,356. It is literally close to 9 times the account size. This is why I despise those direct models. What I am getting at, is if any "NEW" model doesn't offer the same type of value/benefit vs. trading your own money......what's the point. I wouldn't trade with props without anything...
I do not think they will lower the value of that. But more minimum trading time and more minimum trades would be required to get a more realistic approach who can trade a funded account successfully or not. That would not attract gamblers who wanted to make a quick buck in no time. I do not think they will ask you to flip an account twice or three times. That would be pretty bad then. Then I would be also out of the prop firm game. Maybe I can continue with my current funded accounts as usual without any changes then. Will see.
  • #22,929
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:39am Sep 26, 2023 6:39am
Quoting DeltaCapital
{quote} True thats the reason anyone takes challenges, you get more for less, but CFTC wants to protect you from losing 500 in a challenge but lets you lose thounsands in a forex broker regulated by them
Amazing, isn't it? Only the blind/naive don't see the true reasoning. Some folks actually believe the government has their best interest. Maybe 70, 80+ years ago, certainly not in today's world.
  • #22,930
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:42am Sep 26, 2023 6:42am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} I do not think they will lower the value of that. But more minimum trading time and more minimum trades would be required to get a more realistic approach who can trade a funded account successfully or not. That would not attract gamblers who wanted to make a quick buck in no time. I do not think they will ask you to flip an account twice or three times. That would be pretty bad then. Then I would be also out of the prop firm game. Maybe I can continue with my current funded accounts as usual without any changes then. Will see.
I mean if they asked 30% profits on a 10% max. DD it means 20 times the challenge fee as value what you need to make this prop firm valuable. So there is no way of that. They can only extend the minimum trading time to say 3 months trading period with at least 20 trades or something like that. That is all what they can do on changes. Otherwise the whole model will lead to garbage and sooner or later everyone will realize that and no one would join any prop firm anymore (without those people who failed in basic math at school).
  • #22,931
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:48am Sep 26, 2023 6:48am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} I mean if they asked 30% profits on a 10% max. DD it means 20 times the challenge fee as value what you need to make this prop firm valuable. So there is no way of that. They can only extend the minimum trading time to say 3 months trading period with at least 20 trades or something like that. That is all what they can do on changes. Otherwise the whole model will lead to garbage and sooner or later everyone will realize that and no one would join any prop firm anymore (without those people who failed in basic math at school).
The thing is CFTC will block forex prop firms from taking US Citizens, what they can do, is offer a different model like futures or forex without being CFDs, and keep same conditions this will be super good for US citizens
  • #22,932
  • Sep 26, 2023 6:57am Sep 26, 2023 6:57am
Quoting DeltaCapital
{quote} The thing is CFTC will block forex prop firms from taking US Citizens, what they can do, is offer a different model like futures or forex without being CFDs, and keep same conditions this will be super good for US citizens
I believe this is why the 5%ers on their website have this.....

The5ers is aware of the regulatory requirements in the US, and it operates by a restrictive legal advisory to fully fulfill the US law and regulatory requirements. The full document will be provided to any official enforcement organization of the US authorities by official and authorized requests to [email protected].

That statement has been there since I first looked into them in early 2021. They only offered 28 (majors and theoir crosses) forex pairs.
They have only recently added indices and I believe it was simply to gain market share because all of the other firms offer them.
  • #22,933
  • Sep 26, 2023 7:14am Sep 26, 2023 7:14am
Quoting jezzode
{quote} Nice - and yes, that is how it used to be with me too. My only thought is that I was close to max daily DD. Who knows.... Nothing would surprise me now, we don't have a leg to stand on anyway {image}
Just signed my contract. I asked to switch to a swing account since I'm rather conservative with my trades on funded accounts.
Quote
Contract(s) awaiting our approval
Please note that it takes us on average 1-4 business days to review the information, approve and finalize the FTMO Account Agreement and send you your new FTMO Account.
  • #22,934
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:17am Sep 26, 2023 9:17am
Any news on TFF?. Am considering signing up with them again after a year out. All these US prop firms started by influencers are to be avoided. Only options left out seems are ftmo, TFF and 5ers.
  • #22,935
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:37am Sep 26, 2023 9:37am
Quoting Inception12
Any news on TFF?. Am considering signing up with them again after a year out. All these US prop firms started by influencers are to be avoided. Only options left out seems are ftmo, TFF and 5ers.
Several people (myself included) have been OK with FXIFY. Simple rules and I don't think they have much of influencers and all that. They say they are backed by FXPIG (which is also their broker platform). They are still new, though (I think from April or May) so not much history.
  • #22,936
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:39am Sep 26, 2023 9:39am
Quoting Inception12
Any news on TFF?. Am considering signing up with them again after a year out. All these US prop firms started by influencers are to be avoided. Only options left out seems are ftmo, TFF and 5ers.
https://www.cftc.gov/node/245841
  • #22,937
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:52am Sep 26, 2023 9:52am
Quoting Dirac
{quote} https://www.cftc.gov/node/245841
Yeah, all of my brokers are on the red list. They all work just fine.
  • #22,938
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:55am Sep 26, 2023 9:55am
Quoting pipmaster77
{quote} Yeah, all of my brokers are on the red list. They all work just fine.
This is what CFTC does when cant reach like MFF they just put in red list ahah
  • #22,939
  • Sep 26, 2023 9:57am Sep 26, 2023 9:57am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Several people (myself included) have been OK with FXIFY. Simple rules and I don't think they have much of influencers and all that. They say they are backed by FXPIG (which is also their broker platform). They are still new, though (I think from April or May) so not much history.
OK.. Thanks. I'll check them out. Do you still have an account with TFF. I had an account but blew it around the time they had closed their discord. They reopened it so am wondering if everything went back to normal.
  • #22,940
  • Sep 26, 2023 10:18am Sep 26, 2023 10:18am
Quoting Inception12
{quote} OK.. Thanks. I'll check them out. Do you still have an account with TFF. I had an account but blew it around the time they had closed their discord. They reopened it so am wondering if everything went back to normal.
Personally I would not trust anymore TFF. Closing Discord is like a red flag. They want to silent the whole trading community. Pretty bad decision, maybe a must for them, because they had no other choice to do so. They got too many questions why they did not payout bigger payouts. So this remains with salt when you join.
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