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  • #12,641
  • Nov 24, 2022 10:29am Nov 24, 2022 10:29am
Quoting navk
{quote} There is clear difference between MFF and TFTP spreads. TFTP offers superior spreads in mt4. I trade on MFF and copy the same to Royal challenge, TFTP. 1 : 1 is trade multiplier setting I use. Results of TFTP is very good compared to MFF.

Can you show the statement of both (kill any info that may be identifying) I am curious to see where the difference comes from. My experience with ALL eightcap prop firms are that they are absolutely abhorrent trading conditions. My trades slip massively on nothing no matter the size and the feed itself stalls regularly.

With MFF, FTMO and sometimes TFF I do not have these problems at all.

And I use a trade copier.
  • #12,642
  • Nov 24, 2022 10:52am Nov 24, 2022 10:52am
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Can you show the statement of both (kill any info that may be identifying) I am curious to see where the difference comes from. My experience with ALL eightcap prop firms are that they are absolutely abhorrent trading conditions. My trades slip massively on nothing no matter the size and the feed itself stalls regularly. With MFF, FTMO and sometimes TFF I do not have these problems at all. And I use a trade copier.
Some trades attached.

1) MFF trades ( sender )
2) TFTP trades ( Receiver )
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: mff profit.png Size: 42 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: TFTP Profit.png Size: 47 KB
Intraday only.
  • #12,643
  • Nov 24, 2022 10:57am Nov 24, 2022 10:57am
Quoting Vitore
{quote} And if you open more than 3 positions at a time they terminate your funded account...
And these vague rules:

7.5.1. If we feel that a trader has reckless behaviour, particularly by breaching any guidelines set out in Clause 7.5., Finotive Funding reserves the right to take action against the trader. Accounts are reviewed manually on a regular basis, and at key events such as the progression from Phase 2 to Phase 3, the request for an account scale or a withdrawal request. If we see signs of gambling or “all-or-nothing” mentality or if we deem an account to be extremely high risk, we reserve the right to take any of the following actions:
(a) Rejection of progression from Phase 2 Challenge accounts to Phase 3 Funded Status.
(b) Reset a Challenge account to the start of Phase 1.
(c) Reset of Funded Account (either Phase 3 or Instant) back to initial funded capital.
(d) Temporary reduction of profit split to 25%.
(e) Refusal of Withdrawal.
(f) Refusal to Scale.
(g) Full Account Termination.


And if you boost one funded account the profit split will be capped.

8.10. PHASE 3 ACCOUNT SPECIFICS
8. 10.2 In order to protect our capital, traders who have failed previous funded accounts (either Challenge Phase 3 or Instant Funding) will be capped to a profit split of 25%, with no scaling options. When all losses have been covered by Finotive Funding’s 75% profit share, the Trader will be reinstated to full profit split and account scaling options.
Source: https://finotivefunding.com/terms-and-conditions
  • #12,644
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:01am Nov 24, 2022 11:01am
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: screenshot.png Size: < 1 KB
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: screenshot.png Size: < 1 KB
@navK

Its because their prices are not the same and on some of your trades there are 1 second difference. Both entities will require around 300ms to execute which is 600, dont know which copier you are using but lets say it takes another 300.

If you compare all the prices of the two companies they have different prices and you are "opening at market". Its interesting though.
  • #12,645
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:03am Nov 24, 2022 11:03am
Quoting Takisd
{image}{image} @navK Its because their prices are not the same and on some of your trades there are 1 second difference. Both entities will require around 300ms to execute which is 600, dont know which copier you are using but lets say it takes another 300. If you compare all the prices of the two companies they have different prices and you are "opening at market". Its interesting though.
FX Blue trade copier.

Free version.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: trade copier.png Size: 56 KB
Intraday only.
  • #12,646
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:06am Nov 24, 2022 11:06am
Quoting Takisd
{image}{image} @navK Its because their prices are not the same and on some of your trades there are 1 second difference. Both entities will require around 300ms to execute which is 600, dont know which copier you are using but lets say it takes another 300. If you compare all the prices of the two companies they have different prices and you are "opening at market". Its interesting though.
Possible..there could be little delay in execution which makes the difference.

But let me tell you...this is not once...

This happens every time.
Intraday only.
  • #12,647
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:49am Nov 24, 2022 11:49am
Quoting navk
{quote} Possible..there could be little delay in execution which makes the difference. But let me tell you...this is not once... This happens every time.
Funnily enough I have been executing the other way around with the same props and noticing the exact same thing.

My setup is:
TFTP ( Sender )
MFF ( Receiver)

Despite MFF having lower commissions, the balance was running behind TFTP for the exact same trades. I also use FX Blue to copy/receive.
  • #12,648
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:55am Nov 24, 2022 11:55am
Quoting navk
{quote} Possible..there could be little delay in execution which makes the difference. But let me tell you...this is not once... This happens every time.

It technically should happen every time. I will try to set up my copier on my TFT account from my MFF and check. I haven't used TFT for proper trading in quite some time because of a few strange occurences and their own behavior.

MFF -> FTMO I do not have any discrepancy to report of significance.
  • #12,649
  • Nov 24, 2022 11:56am Nov 24, 2022 11:56am
Then it looks like they have a kind of self programmed Virtual Dealer Plugin, where they have full control of the feed, so that MFF can use it to THEIR ADVANTAGE. Bad!!
  • #12,650
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:00pm Nov 24, 2022 12:00pm
Quoting TrAndy1
Then it looks like they have a kind of self programmed Virtual Dealer Plugin, where they have full control of the feed, so that MFF can use it to THEIR ADVANTAGE. Bad!!

Man, i trade on their feed and if you only use their feed you know that there is no VDP on their feed. If you are comparing feeds it could be a million and one things, including more ticks/less ticks, smoothed vs not smoothed feeds, execution time - market vs instant, bridge speed and various other things, one could have better bid providers one could have better ask providers. The first thing i see between the two is that the prices are not the same, so if you buy on one at 1, you would get 1.1 on another if you sell at 1 you would get 1.1 on another, in this case there are 0.2 difference on majors.. Don't make up sensationalist things.
  • #12,651
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:04pm Nov 24, 2022 12:04pm
Let me know any reasons if you can find them out, even they are speculations. Because when two people here have it ALWAYS, then it is telling us. Only conclusions !!!
  • #12,652
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:13pm Nov 24, 2022 12:13pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} The first thing i see between the two is that the prices are not the same, so if you buy on one at 1, you would get 1.1 on another if you sell at 1 you would get 1.1 on another, in this case there are 0.2 difference on majors
This is exactly what I noticed, and the difference was so negligible I didn't investigate further. But I could see that over a very long period, those small differences would add up. I just added a small percentage to the copier's risk multiplier to even it out as close as possible.
  • #12,653
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:32pm Nov 24, 2022 12:32pm
Even they had better bid OR ask providers, that does not explain it ALWAYS when having positions on both sides, or just closing opened positions. Also I see no reasons for the execution speed or any delay here with more or less ticks, or better smoothed feed or not, that THIS IS ALWAYS THE CASE. It just does not explain that well !!!
  • #12,654
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:35pm Nov 24, 2022 12:35pm
Quoting Causation
{quote} This is exactly what I noticed, and the difference was so negligible I didn't investigate further. But I could see that over a very long period, those small differences would add up. I just added a small percentage to the copier's risk multiplier to even it out as close as possible.
That thing I would like to know if those differences are a FUNCTION of LOT SIZES or ORDER TICKET SIZES TOO ? In that case higher lot sizes would increase the dis-advantages at MFF more, having more slippage than usual by simulating a kind of (non-existing) illiquidity in FX majors or dryup during non rollover and non red news!
  • #12,655
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:37pm Nov 24, 2022 12:37pm
Quoting Isabella_D
{quote} legal representation? Complaints office? Terms and conditions in a legally secure document? Response from office to your questions? DD<Fee? dumb catch!
I'm not quite sure what your complaint is. They are pretty much the same as all the others but they do answer your question by email fairly quickly.
I think that as far as instant funded accounts are concerned, they have the best offer. Trading conditions are excellent, leverage is good and you can use EA which is a big plus factor. They have an excellent scaling plan and you can withdraw profits anytime.
And the DD is not less then the fee if you take the trouble to work it out. £128 is a whole lot less then $200 in the case of a 2.5k account
  • #12,656
  • Nov 24, 2022 12:52pm Nov 24, 2022 12:52pm
Quoting Bizziebee
{quote} I'm not quite sure what your complaint is. They are pretty much the same as all the others but they do answer your question by email fairly quickly. I think that as far as instant funded accounts are concerned, they have the best offer. Trading conditions are excellent, leverage is good and you can use EA which is a big plus factor. They have an excellent scaling plan and you can withdraw profits anytime. And the DD is not less then the fee if you take the trouble to work it out. £128 is a whole lot less then $200 in the case of a 2.5k account...
Yes. with these kind of accounts you have to take it slowly and carefully until you are scaled up to maybe 50k or more - then you have $4000 DD to play with which is not too bad and of course your payouts are going to be a lot lot bigger
  • #12,657
  • Edited 2:26pm Nov 24, 2022 2:07pm | Edited 2:26pm
Quoting Takisd
{quote} Man, i trade on their feed and if you only use their feed you know that there is no VDP on their feed. If you are comparing feeds it could be a million and one things, including more ticks/less ticks, smoothed vs not smoothed feeds, execution time - market vs instant, bridge speed and various other things, one could have better bid providers one could have better ask providers. The first thing i see between the two is that the prices are not the same, so if you buy on one at 1, you would get 1.1 on another if you sell at 1 you would get...
I trade theirs as well as my main. MFF-FTMO-TFF

Can’t say I’ve experienced any problems with MFF at all either.

Mostly indices, and TFF usually makes a bit more for some reason. MFF and FTMO usually around the same.

TFF has to monitored closely as their feed dies at random times. Never had a trade stuck, but have had frozen feed and failed to execute due to “common errors”.
Trade with confidence, trade without fear.
  • #12,658
  • Nov 24, 2022 4:47pm Nov 24, 2022 4:47pm
new firm https://firstclassforexfunds.co/
  • #12,659
  • Nov 24, 2022 5:07pm Nov 24, 2022 5:07pm
The difference in profit is evident between MFF and TFTP.

I just tried to see the difference between the two.

It is huge.

Basket 1. ( MFF )- Sender : 49 $

Basket 2 ( TFTP ) - Receiver : 67 $
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: mff profit.png Size: 49 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: TFTP Profit.png Size: 59 KB
Intraday only.
  • #12,660
  • Nov 24, 2022 5:22pm Nov 24, 2022 5:22pm
Quoting Cryptosurf
{quote} I trade theirs as well as my main. MFF-FTMO-TFF Can’t say I’ve experienced any problems with MFF at all either. Mostly indices, and TFF usually makes a bit more for some reason. MFF and FTMO usually around the same. TFF has to monitored closely as their feed dies at random times. Never had a trade stuck, but have had frozen feed and failed to execute due to “common errors”.
I get the same on TFF almost daily, never lasts more than 2 minutes. MFF, FTMO and TFTP.......no issues here
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