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  • #8,481
  • Jun 12, 2022 4:45pm Jun 12, 2022 4:45pm
Quoting sampat
{quote} Only red flag is if you finish challenge earlier and trade 0.01 lots to fill up remaining days they wont give you funded account as per couple of reviews in trust pilot.
That is not good
  • #8,482
  • Edited 5:06pm Jun 12, 2022 4:55pm | Edited 5:06pm
Quoting Bizziebee
{quote} That is not good
Yep stay away from those who has such rules. I can't control market if I put 2% of stop and 8% of target especially on indices it can hit with in couple of hours or a day. And since minimum days are 5 WHY TRADER is forced to risk same. Also they used to have shady backup company like TCF where they will give 110% return if you pass and risk assessment review DENIED. I believe they changed back up company but they smartly introduced 4% withdrawal rule. Frankly speaking if any prop firm says they want to see reduce risk and see consistency and not put in words what consistency means like in the attached screenshot stay away. It is just a LEGAL TRAP.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #8,483
  • Jun 12, 2022 5:10pm Jun 12, 2022 5:10pm
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Is that 4% target rule per account or per trader on BGC ? When it is per funded account, on every new account you need that 4% even when merged ? Anyone knows ?
It looks like per account. If you merge it is total so 4 percent of that account. Not sure why they introduced such rule as that kind of rule is common for direct funding models. May be historically they found out most accounts go away before hitting that target
  • #8,484
  • Jun 12, 2022 8:55pm Jun 12, 2022 8:55pm
Quoting sampat
{quote} Yep stay away from those who has such rules. I can't control market if I put 2% of stop and 8% of target especially on indices it can hit with in couple of hours or a day. And since minimum days are 5 WHY TRADER is forced to risk same. Also they used to have shady backup company like TCF where they will give 110% return if you pass and risk assessment review DENIED. I believe they changed back up company but they smartly introduced 4% withdrawal rule. Frankly speaking if any prop firm says they want to see reduce risk and see consistency...
I tend to pay more attention to negative reviews on Trust Pilot, especially if they come from those who've given their opinions multiple times.
Like in socmed, reviews could be "gamed" as most everyone knows. I remember that Finotrader, which ran a scam operation, had lots of positive reviews (as well as thousands of followers but hardly any proof of engagement via comments on their IG account).

That's why this thread is important. I believe the posts here are generally more honest than those at review sites and can greatly help people looking for guidance in the wilderness that the prop firm space has become.
Amor Fati--F. Nietzsche
  • #8,485
  • Jun 12, 2022 9:23pm Jun 12, 2022 9:23pm
Quoting doji
{quote} I tend to pay more attention to negative reviews on Trust Pilot, especially if they come from those who've given their opinions multiple times. Like in socmed, reviews could be "gamed" as most everyone knows. I remember that Finotrader, which ran a scam operation, had lots of positive reviews (as well as thousands of followers but hardly any proof of engagement via comments on their IG account). That's why this thread is important. I believe the posts here are generally more honest than those at review sites and can greatly help people looking...
Absolutely. This thread is a gold mine and keeps getting better. The spreadsheets which TrAndy has posted recently with the scores of what you actually get for your money are priceless. As I've stated before, this thread SHOULD steer everyone towards the 4-5 firms that are worth it AND ALSO reliable. There are some reliable firms (think direct funding) that are complete ripoffs and there are some "worth it" firms that have horrible conditions and rules and/or don't pay. We also tend to identify almost immediately those who post here with an agenda and they tend to leave rather swiftly. This is absolutely, by far, the best resource on the web on prop firms. Kudos again to Mastermind for creating it.
  • #8,486
  • Edited 11:29pm Jun 12, 2022 11:15pm | Edited 11:29pm
Quoting doji
{quote} I tend to pay more attention to negative reviews on Trust Pilot, especially if they come from those who've given their opinions multiple times. Like in socmed, reviews could be "gamed" as most everyone knows. I remember that Finotrader, which ran a scam operation, had lots of positive reviews (as well as thousands of followers but hardly any proof of engagement via comments on their IG account). That's why this thread is important. I believe the posts here are generally more honest than those at review sites and can greatly help people looking...
Thats why I said LEGAL SCAM. They may be perfectly legal and may have paid to users, but the rules are not fair. It is always traders responsibility to read RULES but why to get into such firms when one has safe options with more fair rules. Rules should be something which you can quantify on piece of paper. Something like fidelcrest where they say you can't deviate 25% of lot size up or down on funded account. But with this firm it says you need to trade as you are trading before. The reason they don't do it because the moment they put consistency word on front page all gamblers run away.
Also reviews can be manipulated funding talent was classic example but most important thing of any firm is their intent.
BCG has 2 red flags Consistency especially in challenge phase ( i can understand on direct funding model but for demo challenges its not good)
another one is 4% withdrawal why you need traders money to hold.
  • #8,487
  • Jun 13, 2022 12:26am Jun 13, 2022 12:26am
The firms with the least amount of rules and restrictions will have a better chance for long-term survival so long as their offerings and conditions are reasonable. Trading needs to be simple. These firms imposing strict guidelines, hidden rules and/or horrible trading conditions will fade away if they do not evolve.
  • #8,488
  • Jun 13, 2022 12:38am Jun 13, 2022 12:38am
Quoting CableJ
{quote} are your entry/exits breakout related with stops laying above/below a previous bar high/low or obvious support/resistance levels? There tends to be way more slippage with those types of entries/exits since the trader's order is completing with tons of other orders @ the same price levels. I remember Josh @ MFF saying they have about 10M at every pipette on the major USD pairs.
For my entries I do not wait for candle close and I enter market. With 10 lot order I get easily 0.5 pip slippage. Entries are not at S/R or breakout levels.
For my exits I always exit with stop order and again I get almost always negative slippage of 0.2-0.5 pips.

MFF has the worst fills I've seen from trading 5 prop firm accounts.

Someone who understands brokers more than me could confirm my suspicion. I suspect that MFF is trying to fit as many traders as they can on their server and they compete for liquidity.

Let me give you example.
I will compare MFF account with my live IC Markets account. When I place two orders with around 1 minute apart then I can see from order numbers how many orders there were placed on that server on EURUSD. On MFF there are significantly more orders placed within that 1 minute on EURUSD than on IC Markets. Now ICM is large broker and MFF should not be able to compete with the amount of orders placed. But ICM runs over 20 servers.
Is it possible that MFF could solve the problem by introducing more servers and improve fills?
  • #8,489
  • Jun 13, 2022 3:26am Jun 13, 2022 3:26am
Quoting sampat
{quote} Only red flag is if you finish challenge earlier and trade 0.01 lots to fill up remaining days they wont give you funded account as per couple of reviews in trust pilot.
Thanks for the info. I hate when companies have unwritten rules like this.
If companies don't want this they can have a simple rule to avoid it. TCF are not a reliable company IMO but at least in this department they are have some kind of alert, avoiding surprises.

Quote
What if I achieve the profit target before the minimum required trading days?
This only applies to the 100k and 200k account size only. You can reduce your lot size by up to 75% of the average lot size used on all of your challenge trades until now. You can’t use 0.01 lot sizes or any amount lower than one-fourth of the average lot size used till now on your challenge. You will also be expected to trade normally on the reduced lot size to not bypass the minimum day rule.


This is why this topic is so important. With everybody effort we get alerted for a lot of things that alone we could not find out until it was too late (or that would be very time consuming).
  • #8,490
  • Jun 13, 2022 4:50am Jun 13, 2022 4:50am
I contacted BGC on their webchat about micro-lot trading if target has been reached. This was their response -

Hello, if you do this please continue to place trades the same way as you had done before. You are allowed to micro trade if needed.
  • #8,491
  • Jun 13, 2022 5:27am Jun 13, 2022 5:27am
BGC just confirmed 4% target on funded account is per account and not per trader. So on each new funded account you need to do 4% profits before any withdraw.
  • #8,492
  • Jun 13, 2022 6:54am Jun 13, 2022 6:54am
An information about The Prop Trading: if we fail the challenge on phase 1 they have a reset for a 20% discount (account 200K) 719.2 instead of 899

Worth to note that the resets do not allow free retry if targets are missed. But they qualify for refund if we get to funded phase and get the first payout.
  • #8,493
  • Jun 13, 2022 7:00am Jun 13, 2022 7:00am
Quoting Capablanca
An information about The Prop Trading: if we fail the challenge on phase 1 they have a reset for a 20% discount (account 200K) 719.2 instead of 899 Worth to note that the resets do not allow free retry if targets are missed. But they qualify for refund if we get to funded phase and get the first payout.
Do you have any written information you can provide regarding lot size limit restriction across multiple accounts ? You said something but did not provide proof so far.
  • #8,494
  • Jun 13, 2022 7:16am Jun 13, 2022 7:16am
Quoting Capablanca
{quote} Thanks for the info. I hate when companies have unwritten rules like this. If companies don't want this they can have a simple rule to avoid it. TCF are not a reliable company IMO but at least in this department they are have some kind of alert, avoiding surprises. {quote} This is why this topic is so important. With everybody effort we get alerted for a lot of things that alone we could not find out until it was too late (or that would be very time consuming).
Personally, I would never use a firm with "consistency" rules. Risk is determined by lot size AND stop loss combined, not just lot size. In addition, if I have hit the target within the time period, I should be able to get there however I wish. After all, most of these firms are basically asking us to flip an account (target vs. DD) in 30 days. MFF is by far the best regarding this with 67% in 58 days (with extension). Some are 80%, some are 35 days, but the point is....IT IS DEMANDING ENOUGH without additional rules/restrictions on top.
However, if one feels compelled to try that type of company and you are an "all-in" type of trader. Trade normally the first 3-4 days and knock that restriction out FIRST, then place the gambling style trades to pass in the next 1-2 days.
  • #8,495
  • Jun 13, 2022 7:57am Jun 13, 2022 7:57am
Well I think I will try a small account with the BGC. From what I understand, if you reach the target in one or two days you just trade the same system or style for the other days remaining but you can trade micro-lots. In my case, I have EA to trade with. It work on higher time frame. If I use it on lower time frame it will take more trades but of course the win/loss rate is much worse. But if only micro-lots then it is not going to effect balance of my account

Anyway I will keep it open to scrutiny so we can all see my progress. Hope to get payout maybe if they are genuine company
  • #8,496
  • Jun 13, 2022 8:23am Jun 13, 2022 8:23am
In case folks haven't noticed, many prop firms are simply white-labeled offerings of Prop Account, LLC, a Caymen Islands company.

You will find in the terms that they can make any changes to the terms and conditions at any time, as well as TERMINATE the agreement at any time.

For example:
Quoting experts4x.com
Welcome to Expert4x Funded Trader Program, a white label of Prop Account, LLC (the “Company”).
or scandanavianmarkets.com, tktraders.se, ...

Quoting tktraders.se
Psvan Invest AB hereafter(TK Traders) acts as an intermediary between you and the company that oversees and owns all rights to investor money and trading capital and backend broker connections (Prop account, LLC).
So, be SURE to do your due diligence and read all of the legal materials regarding both the company that you are contracting with initially AND the legal materials of the company that is providing the "funded" account.
To free Gazans of Hamas, use whatever it takes.
  • #8,497
  • Jun 13, 2022 8:42am Jun 13, 2022 8:42am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Sorry, that might be for some prop firms the case, but of course not all or the majority of them. Your first website mentioned is selling EAs, which is only a scam in my eyes, because no one is selling a really very profitable EA, that is too much effort and is also priceless. One is by far better when he is just trading his EA and not selling it. Second your props mentioned are not worth to consider too, they have scores below 1, so you pay more than when your do your own compounding. I would suggest you should read more on this forum before...
I did not post nonsense. For as long as you have been on FF, you should be very aware of the number of naive newcomers that do very little research into whatever they are diving into. A quick look at the underlying company that provides the funded account is a quick and easy way to eliminate many candidate prop firms without reading anything about their conditions.
To free Gazans of Hamas, use whatever it takes.
  • #8,498
  • Jun 13, 2022 8:50am Jun 13, 2022 8:50am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} Sorry, that might be for some prop firms the case, but of course not all or the majority of them. Your first website mentioned is selling EAs, which is only scam in my eyes, because no one is selling very profitable EA, that is too much effort and is also priceless. One is by far better when he is just trading his EA and not selling it. Second your props mentioned are not worth to consider too, they have scores below 1, so you pay more than when your do your own compounding. I would suggest you should read more on this thread before posting...
Your first website mentioned is selling EAs
Yes, the main business is selling Trade BOTS. But they also have other business as a white-labeled prop firm as you can see on this page.
To free Gazans of Hamas, use whatever it takes.
  • #8,499
  • Jun 13, 2022 8:52am Jun 13, 2022 8:52am
Quoting DrDave
{quote} I did not post nonsense. For as long as you have been on FF, you should be very aware of the number of naive newcomers that do very little research into whatever they are diving into. A quick look at the underlying company that provides the funded account is a quick and easy way to eliminate many candidate prop firms without reading anything about their conditions.
If you did not tell us nonsense, where is your own duediligence and your work with a full list of questionable prop firms and their parent companies behind ?
  • #8,500
  • Jun 13, 2022 9:11am Jun 13, 2022 9:11am
Quoting TrAndy1
{quote} If you did not tell us nonsense, where is your own duediligence and your work with a full list of questionable prop firms and their parent companies behind ?
Exactly. Just a small bit of reading on this thread shows we are NOT recommending ANY of those firms he is speaking about.
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