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ZigZag - Keep It Simple Stupid

  • #81
  • May 24, 2022 2:44am May 24, 2022 2:44am
Quoting Skyrider60
The signal is very late. With a large spread, we get a loss. Which broker has zero spread?
The signal is very late. Has already been mentioned several times.
With a large spread, we get a loss. Therefore, in my opinion, it is not suitable for scalp but rather for hold and a good stop management. (Partial sales, etc.)
Which broker has zero spread? https://www.forexbrokers.com/guides/zero-spread
  • #82
  • May 24, 2022 3:00am May 24, 2022 3:00am
Quoting samsha786
{quote} I don't want this thread to become confused like the original... use the tools you are comfortable with. Stick to the basics of this system, unless you can identify an edge that will improve it. If you find such an edge, please do share.
Ok. In the next days I will trade GBPJPY and GOLD Legh 16 combine with this ATR default setting.

Attached File(s)
File Type: mq4 ATR - Stops1.01 (mtf + alerts).mq4   52 KB | 408 downloads

I'll be able to tell you how it goes.
  • #83
  • May 24, 2022 3:23am May 24, 2022 3:23am
MultiZigZag indicator downloaded from first post is showing just a straight horizontal yellow line.. it is not showing as the image posted by samsha786.. anything more to add? please suggest. If possible please post required indicator/template would be really helpful.

Thank you.
  • #84
  • May 24, 2022 3:47am May 24, 2022 3:47am
Quoting samsha786
{quote} I don't want this thread to become confused like the original... use the tools you are comfortable with. Stick to the basics of this system, unless you can identify an edge that will improve it. If you find such an edge, please do share.
What you show is also not the original. The original includes Bulls & Bears as repost by Crow in #Post10. I got the following settings from him personally:
Bulls Power Parameters Period 31, Apply to High, Fixed minimum 0...for Bears Power Period 31, Apply to Low, Fixed maximum 0.
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: photo_2022-04-14_15-03-19.jpg Size: 84 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: photo_2022-04-18_14-17-14.jpg Size: 149 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: photo_2022-04-19_16-00-40.jpg Size: 142 KB
  • #85
  • Edited 6:07am May 24, 2022 3:59am | Edited 6:07am
Day 2 (of 5) test results in live forward market
0800am to 1200 noon London time. 4hrs, using 15min zz change signal.

The trades are as listed below and are 15min signals unless otherwise indicated. I am finishing slightly earlier as I started slightly earlier but have still done a 4hr session.


1. 0745am eurusd buy @ 0672, stop = 0655, tp =1:1 @ 0689, result = +14pips gain 1:1 (ie started a little earlier than 0800am London)
2. 0815am gbpaud sell 7761, stop = 7775, to = 1;1 @ 7747, result B./e
(a 5min zz signal as 1hr t/f was very rangy.)
3. 0828am gbpaud sell 7742, stop = 7768, tp =1;1 @ 7716,, result = +26pips, 1;1
4. 0835am gbpcad sell 6092, stop = 6115, tip = 1;1 @ 6070, result = +6 taken but achieved the +22 1:1
5. 0835am gbpnzd, sell @9524, stop = 9544, tp = 1:1 @ 9504, result = +20pips, 1:1 (a 5min signal)
6. 0853am gbpnzd, sell @ 95002, stop = 9532, tp = 9472 1;1, result = B/e taken but did achieve +30pips 1:1
7. 0850am eurusd sell 0725, sop = 0738, tp = 1;1 @ 0712, (5min signal +6 taken)
8. 0916 gbpusd sell 2571, stop = 2600, tp = 1:1 @ 2542, decided to keep open thru uk data as forecasts were not good so a downside reaction likely, result = +29 1;1 achieved (but due to the downside reaction across gbp pairings following the worse than expected 0930am data I kept it open to achieve +40)
9. 0935am eurusd, (ie a 1min signal into 5/15min + zz signal the same….+15 taken.)
10. 0941am chfjpy sell 3226, stop = 3246, tp = 1:1 @ 3206, result = +20pips 1:1
11. 1010am gbpusd, buy 2492, stop = 2472, tp = open, result = +15pips
(ie a 5min signal based on the extreme o/s reads from 15min to 30min after Uk data reaction.)

12. 1100am gbpaud, buy 7689, stop 7640, tp = 1:1 @ 7718
13. 1100am gbpcad buy 6001, stop = 5971, tp = 1:1 @ 6031

(NB: Neither of these last 2 x 15min signals (12. and 13.,) traded as the probability is that there may be more downside to come after the pullback given the size of gbp down move, so less chance of tp on these gbp longs/buys being met.)

Results
So 11 signals actually traded for a total of + 142pips. Of the 6 x 15min signals traded (which is what this 5 day test exercise is primarily about, all 6 achieved their 1:1 r:r target or more, but with my discretion (at entry, and/or exit, and/or trade management,) I achieved +104pips , instead of the full +132pips available @ the full 1:1 r:r targets of these 6 x 15min signals. I won't now talk about % gain (or loss) on each trade and overall as risk is individual to all of us, suffice to say I conservatively tailor it the known history of the edge and each set-up/signal within the edge's known history, particularly re win rate and resulting chances of losing runs of whatever lengths etc...

I again, but this time fully, monitored (and recorded) whether each 15min signal was with or against the longer t/f (1hr/4hr zz's) and whether they were with or against the 1hr price action conditions (trend or range) and I'll report these in total at the final tally and analysis at the end of the week and see what conclusions we can come to if any on their possible usefulness in conjunction with these zz signals. I also monitored where there was regular or hidden divergence on an oscillator at the swing point where the green 1 or red 2 symbol is printed.

Observations

Like yesterday using discretion actually netted me a bigger pip gain overall than just the 15min signals as I took a 1min and some 5min signals too, but just on the 15min signals unlike y/day it netted me less than was available by just letting the trades run to stop or tp without trade management.

I did try the new v1.15 multizigzag indy and although better, on my pc set-up it slowed it to a crawl, so went back to the zigzag_start level_alerts indy.
Trader with an Edge.
  • #86
  • May 24, 2022 4:34am May 24, 2022 4:34am
Quoting Headland
Day 2 (of 5) test results in live forward market 0800am to 1200 noon London time. 4hrs, using 15min zz change signal. The trades are as listed below and are 15min signals unless otherwise indicated. I am finishing slightly earlier as I started slightly earlier but have still done a 4hr session. 1. 0745am eurusd buy @ 0672, stop = 0655, tp =1:1 @ 0689, result = +14pips gain 1:1 (ie started a little earlier than 0800am London) 2. 0815am gbpaud sell 7761, stop = 7775, to = 1;1 @ 7747, result B./e (a 5min zz signal as 1hr t/f was very rangy.) 3. 0828am...
Great results again... well done! Which oscillator did you observe divergence on?
  • #87
  • May 24, 2022 4:37am May 24, 2022 4:37am
Quoting GoldenFibo
{quote} What you show is also not the original. The original includes Bulls & Bears as repost by Crow in #Post10. I got the following settings from him personally: Bulls Power Parameters Period 31, Apply to High, Fixed minimum 0...for Bears Power Period 31, Apply to Low, Fixed maximum 0. {image} {image} {image}
If you see the original post... not much info was shared. As such, we've had to make interpretations on how this could potentially be traded. I'm not using 3 time frames, I use only 1. On the first Post #1, the basic rules were shared. Use it, don't use, it's up to you.

What we trying to do, is evolve the system to see which way works best - there might be multiple.
  • #88
  • Edited 4:54am May 24, 2022 4:41am | Edited 4:54am
Quoting samsha786
{quote} You don't need it, if you use the one attached in this thread.
Thanks for starting new post and getting back on track.
  • #89
  • May 24, 2022 4:55am May 24, 2022 4:55am
The original thread by crow is good but have been overwhelmed by price action "nonsense".
Hope can learn and get something useful from here.
  • #90
  • May 24, 2022 5:03am May 24, 2022 5:03am
Quoting Headland
Day 2 (of 5) test results in live forward market 0800am to 1200 noon London time. 4hrs, using 15min zz change signal. The trades are as listed below and are 15min signals unless otherwise indicated. I am finishing slightly earlier as I started slightly earlier but have still done a 4hr session. 1. 0745am eurusd buy @ 0672, stop = 0655, tp =1:1 @ 0689, result = +14pips gain 1:1 (ie started a little earlier than 0800am London) 2. 0815am gbpaud sell 7761, stop = 7775, to = 1;1 @ 7747, result B./e (a 5min zz signal as 1hr t/f was very rangy.) 3. 0828am...
can you clarify with some charts it would be better to show us how you take the trade and how you detect 1:1 ratio for each trade in some examples
your results is not the same on every trade so i think we need some charts with details on it
Thanks
  • #91
  • May 24, 2022 5:04am May 24, 2022 5:04am
Quoting samsha786
{quote} Great results again... well done! Which oscillator did you observe divergence on?
Thanks. Re oscillators - I use 2 custom made proprietary oscillators from my own edge... I cannot share them because they are proprietary, but any oscillator will find divergence on any settings at some point. If it were me and using freely available ones for intraday trading, I'd use something like macd on 8/12/8 and/or risi on 14 or some such combo. You can always overlay one on the other to save space.
Trader with an Edge.
  • #92
  • Edited 6:09am May 24, 2022 5:12am | Edited 6:09am
Quoting MemO_KinG
{quote} can you clarify with some charts it would be better to show us how you take the trade and how you detect 1:1 ratio for each trade in some examples your results is not the same on every trade so i think we need some charts with details on it Thanks
The 1:1 risk:reward ratio is calculated from where I need to put the stop, ie a couple of pips above the green 1 or red 2 swing point on the relevant t/f the zz signal came from...then however many pips that is the size of the tp. So say the zz sell signal comes @ 2500 and the swing point is above @ 2520, then the stop would be 2522 and the resultant tp 2478. Each situation will be different because the sing point above or below where you get the alarm/signal is mostly always a different number of pips away. Hope this explains it, haven't got time right now to screenshot a load of charts, busy with other stuff...but an example is below;

Ie: The swing point is @ point A, the Buy alarm/signal came @ point B, so the stop is under point A and whatever that is (ie B minus A in pips) is your 1:1 tp when added to where point B entry is, which will give you a tp above point B (in this long/buy example.)
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: screenshot.png Size: 18 KB
Trader with an Edge.
  • #93
  • May 24, 2022 5:13am May 24, 2022 5:13am
Quoting samsha786
{quote} If you see the original post... not much info was shared. As such, we've had to make interpretations on how this could potentially be traded. I'm not using 3 time frames, I use only 1. On the first Post #1, the basic rules were shared. Use it, don't use, it's up to you. What we trying to do, is evolve the system to see which way works best - there might be multiple.
That was also the reason why I added the Bull Bear thing.
  • #94
  • May 24, 2022 5:25am May 24, 2022 5:25am
Quoting Headland
{quote} The 1:1 is ratio is calculated from where I need to put the stop, ie a couple of pips above the green 1 or red 2 swing point on the relevant t/f the zz signal came from...then however many pips that is the size of the tp. So say the zz sell signal comes @ 2500 and the swing point is above @ 2520, then the stop would be 2522 and the resultant tp 2478. Each situation will be different because the sing point above or below where you get the alarm/signal is mostly always a different number of pips away. Hope this explains it, haven't got time...
Great work many thanks
  • #95
  • May 24, 2022 5:59am May 24, 2022 5:59am
Hi, just a novice at this but wanting to learn. The file on the first post only draws a line, nothing else. I found @samsha786 post on the other topic you guys mentioned, where we post a template, here:

https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...5#post13981425

is it the same we should be using?
  • #96
  • May 24, 2022 6:05am May 24, 2022 6:05am
Quoting Headland
{quote} The 1:1 is ratio is calculated from where I need to put the stop, ie a couple of pips above the green 1 or red 2 swing point on the relevant t/f the zz signal came from...then however many pips that is the size of the tp. So say the zz sell signal comes @ 2500 and the swing point is above @ 2520, then the stop would be 2522 and the resultant tp 2478. Each situation will be different because the sing point above or below where you get the alarm/signal is mostly always a different number of pips away. Hope this explains it, haven't got time...
Hey this is clear.
But I note that on your chart you plot 2 ZZ.
Do you confirm that you take entry based on M15? Your chart is M5.
Do you use defaut setting?
Thank you and great result
  • #97
  • May 24, 2022 6:06am May 24, 2022 6:06am
when Crow opened ZZ thread i followed it and tried to trade depending on Walid Dashboard buy strong vs weak currencies i made more than 50% in my live account in 3 days but it depends on my look at the chart also
today i tried to trade only Samsha indicator it gave me many and many alerts per hour and lost more than 25% in few hours
i don't know what's wrong are my trades wrong or what but i will back to the other thread and keep following dashboard indicator and tryin to get better safe trading with it
Thanks to all
  • #98
  • May 24, 2022 6:22am May 24, 2022 6:22am
Quoting 19monza64
{quote} Hey this is clear. But I note that on your chart you plot 2 ZZ. Do you confirm that you take entry based on M15? Your chart is M5. Do you use defaut setting? Thank you and great result
Yes I have 2 of the zz's plotted but the one that corresponds to samsha786's multizigzag indy (on his default settings) is the dark blue one, and this coincides with the zigzag_startlevel_alarm indy (available on the original thread) that is set up to match it in it's input properties. (I use this a substitute for multizigzag as it causes issues with my pc.) The test/exercise I am doing is 5 x 4hr sessions trading 0800am-1200noon London time thiws week, mon-fri to help decide whether an edge may be present for me. Yes, predominantly, and as far as the test is concerned I am trading the 15min signal, but I occasionally take a 1min or 5min signal too. The results I report show all, but the test is predominantly concerned with whether an edge may be present for me on the 15min. I would need to do a whole other test sample on 1min and 5min to see if one may be there too, so those trades I take on 1min and 5min - yes are the zz signal but are also through the experience of trading for so many years, and knowing price action. I have completed 2 x 4 hr trading sessions now and have only traded 4 x 5min signals, 1 x 1min signal, but 19 x 15min signals.
Trader with an Edge.
  • #99
  • Edited 6:45am May 24, 2022 6:32am | Edited 6:45am
Quoting MemO_KinG
when Crow opened ZZ thread i followed it and tried to trade depending on Walid Dashboard buy strong vs weak currencies i made more than 50% in my live account in 3 days but it depends on my look at the chart also today i tried to trade only Samsha indicator it gave me many and many alerts per hour and lost more than 25% in few hours i don't know what's wrong are my trades wrong or what but i will back to the other thread and keep following dashboard indicator and tryin to get better safe trading with it Thanks to all
As samsha786 and others have said here, how we all trade this zz logic (or indeed the currency strength [cs] logic over @ the original thread) will be different, and it is likely that the most experienced amongst us will do better. There are so many variables and settings and then there is the potential for human discretion at entry, re trade management, and re exit, so all our results will be different. It would be great to have a purely mechanical edge that is proven over an empirical, documented, representative sample (s) of trades, in the forward market, because that is what you need to know to see whether an edge is present, or may be present in theory. Then (if it's not mechanical, and if it is you can get an EA made of it,) you have to develop the psychology to trade it. Some will some won''t. Only then will you have an edge in the market...anything else is short-lived luck.

In trading this zz or indeed the cs logic re the other thread, live, you have been doing so not knowing whether an edge is present let alone having developed the psychology to trade it, so to lose 25% of your live money account is silly. You have been gambling - nothing more. There are no shortcuts, you have to put in the work and testing in the forward market. Samshas786's 1400 + trades test prove that there may be an edge here and my research too may be indicative at it's conclusion but not representative, so I am proceeding with caution. I encourage you and all others here to do the same and to heed these words. It is the best free advice you will ever be given re trading.
Trader with an Edge.
  • #100
  • May 24, 2022 6:46am May 24, 2022 6:46am
Quoting Headland
{quote} As samsha786 and others have said here, how we all trade this zz logic (or indeed the currency strength [cs] logic over @ the original thread) will be different, and it is likely that the most experienced amongst us will do better. There are so many variables and settings and then there is the potential for human discretion at entry, re trade management, and re exit, so all our results will be different. It would be great to have a purely mechanical edge that is proven over an empirical, documented, representative sample (s) of trades, in...
i think you need to read this thread headline again and again and again
whatever who earn or lose me or you but i have just one answer is reading the Headline for this thread many times
you make it too much hard even when you share your results you write it instead of sharing screens proves what are you doing here

as you say in this stupid answer is the opposite of "KEEP IS SIMPLE STUPID"

i got many and many stupid signals and most of it the price move the opposite instantly and omg you are the only one here earn pips from the signals with little of divergence
goodluck for you
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