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The brutal truth of day trading

  • #1,341
  • Edited 2:47am Jun 18, 2021 2:10am | Edited 2:47am
Quoting PocketForex
{image}Let us see if gold can be invested.I think maybe the key point of trading is follow your heart.If you aim to a trading stategy,then you should follow it.
IT'S COMMERCIAL ADVERTISEMENT !

Thrust heart same place where other garbage is coming from you.

"Pocket Forex trading platform, a good assistant for your forex investment.
Provide free trading strategies, market quotes,trading signals, forex indicators,charts,finance news and economy calendars.24 hours of uninterrupted investing in foreign exchange,gold,silver,crude oil,stock,future,commodity,precious metals,natural gas,copper, global equities and stock indices. 50-1000 fold leverage is optional. "


Wrong thread Dude, you couldn't find easier place scam people ?
  • #1,342
  • Jun 18, 2021 3:28am Jun 18, 2021 3:28am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} “the weight of evidence for an extraordinary claim must be proportioned to its strangeness”--LaPlace What is an extraordinary claim? A quick Google search tells us this : Hume precisely defined an extraordinary claim as one that is directly contradicted by a massive amount of existing evidence. For a claim to qualify as extraordinary there must exist overwhelming empirical data of the exact antithesis. The above is what you just did Peter, you made an extraordinary claim, and then you get your panties in a bunch when challenged on this claim....


No Jimmy boy I didn't. There's nothing extraordinary about generating an average of 5% per day you trade .... IF this is a big deal for people then they may need to "rethink" what they think and believe about trading, it's right there on the chart for all you chartists out there.

"Arrogant" for those who don't know what it really means ..... an unnatural level of confidence that is untreatable and out of alignment with reality. It means there is a disparity between a person's attitude/belief and real life. For the onliners who cannot fathom a 5% return on your time each day you trade, maybe you should consider another activity. Do the maths on it. 5% is conservative up against what others generate. Of course, if one spends far too much time swimming in a pool that has never been cleaned, then your mouth and brain are going to be a little dirty aren't they and probably won't work very well.

Either people are pretending to be as insolent and stupid as they appear, or, they really DO have some deeply serious issues.

If you're "only" a trend trader, you will struggle somewhat. If you "only" scalp, then again, you will struggle. It's fascinating just how many times one needs to be pointed to your beloved chart to look at it over and over and over and over again. And yet, some who say "I already know this stuff" really don't know diddly-squat.

Just ask what is 5% of something? A very small amount isn't it. Yes. And yet all the "You're full of crap" people cannot understand how to do something well, in a repeated way. So why is that? Oh yes, it's probably because your attitude precedes you. Therefore, how can you see what is right in front of you?

Fools need a textbook because they believe they're still in school.

I have done plenty "before" shots and trades as well as "after" ones. I have explained many things.

If the operator is trying to drive the car forwards but has it in reverse gear, well, uuuum, mmmmm, how is THAT someone else's fault? Mmmmm??

I don't do random lines and I don't make false claims. I'm not in competition with anyone. All I actually do is contribute. It's not my fault if people don't know how to think/learn and research thoroughly. Sorry. That's on you. I'm no martyr and so ....... if you genuinely are too daft to appreciate a basic idea/concept then you really should not trade real money. It's not in your best interest.

Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #1,343
  • Jun 18, 2021 3:57am Jun 18, 2021 3:57am
Quoting PeterCaleb
No Jimmy boy I didn't.
Peter boy...

Quoting PeterCaleb
Just ask what is 5% of something? A very small amount isn't it. Yes. And yet all the "You're full of crap" people cannot understand how to do something well, in a repeated way. So why is that? Oh yes, it's probably because your attitude precedes you. Therefore, how can you see what is right in front of you?
Peter "guru" boy...

Quoting PeterCaleb
So why is that?
Peter little boy... you ask "why"... probably Peter... because you definitely are a scammer? Maybe that could be the reason...

Before you answer - please L-E-A-R-N. I feel you didn't learn today as usually... seems you need more learning today. Yesterday your learning level was higher by 5%.
  • #1,344
  • Jun 18, 2021 4:16am Jun 18, 2021 4:16am
In a class of assets and instruments where the "details" of orders are not made public knowledge, I see many people hoping that "their order" will be filled.

So, after all the prep work you've done, all the research and testing, the day arrives to go live and you send your first order to market and ....... wait.

And while you sit there waiting, did it ever pop in your mind, who/what is filling your order?

For people who are learning, you will find that most people are a slave to their research and methodology. The final step is to place that order.

Do you get a good price position?

If you're trend following and scalping, are you upscaling your "trend pullback" entries? Ever noticed that "some" trends don't do the same thing? Ever noticed that some assumed trends actually only produce a single pullback of weakness and yet others produces 3 or 4 or 5? Would it be better to scale up as the trend move continues or should we be down scaling, seeing as we don't fully know "how many pullbacks we're going to get"? ALL very good Q's.

Good price position is and never HAS been based on sit and hope. ANY decent trader in their right mind knows this.

Something I know most people simply don't talk much about at all is price position. Not "optimized entry" but a real entry that is based on what the trader needs and wants (within reasonable expectation). I'm not talking about the usual fickle "stuff" people like to talk about.

Tell me if you've ever experienced the following ......... You place your order and wait. And you wait and wait. The market comes "close .... but not quite close enough" to fill it and then zooms off without you. Oh no !! Fear of missing out !!

For the loud mouth moron brigade, to keep it simple for you, this is called missing the market. It happens because you have put your order in an "unmatched price position". But just because it was left unmatched, does this mean it was poorly positioned for the trade setup you intended to trade?????

So if this happens once, ok, maybe it's just me and maybe next time I'll simply put my order a little closer. And then it happens again. Mmmm. Since it's happened again, it's becoming less of a coincidence and more as if it's creating a pattern of sorts. And then it happens again, perhaps in another place on the chart.

The simple reality of when these things happen is because there is nothing on the other side to fill YOUR order.

It's amazing to see traders who do nothing to lessen the speculative nature of their price positioning by trying to guarantee entry and fill.

Simple fact of trading .... Buy + sell = allocation complete. The market then moves on. Does it care what your middle name is? No.

Now this is where it gets interesting on a site like this where everyone thinks they're an expert of some sort.

There is a type of trade that one can do where - either the setup comes, you trade it and you are profitable. Or it simply never arrives. But what about those trade setups where you miss but not by much? Maybe a few tenths of a point. What then? Ever noticed how the market tends to do this in several different places on a chart?

If you have then you have observed MORE than most people. And by the way people talk around here, that's really saying something.

While they're trying to be clever and play mind games with each other, you, someone who just wants to learn, will be able to realize that the entire world is not as absent minded or just plain inept as many on sites like this. Why? Put them up in the real world where consistency is paramount over anything else in the financial markets and they squeal.

Amateurs, if that is a useful word here, sit and hope.

The speculation rating you give to your trading is probably one of the most important. It's where there's no room to lie to yourself. And it's definitely absent from many people's trading as they are "too busy" following others instead of paying attention...... the true art of trading..... knowing when your nose is too close to the ass of the person you revere/follow/imitate.

Some people assume there is only one game to play. This would be a mistake.

Idiots kiss ass and follow. And hope and pray.

Good/great traders observe and pay attention.


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #1,345
  • Jun 18, 2021 4:18am Jun 18, 2021 4:18am
Quoting joyny
{quote} Peter boy... {quote} Peter "guru" boy... {quote} Peter little boy... you ask "why"... probably Peter... because you definitely are a scammer? Maybe that could be the reason... Before you answer - please L-E-A-R-N. I feel you didn't learn today as usually... seems you need more learning today. Yesterday your learning level was higher by 5%.


Please explain in full detail where the scam is?

I'd love to know more about how your deranged mind works?


Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #1,346
  • Edited 7:42am Jun 18, 2021 7:05am | Edited 7:42am
Quoting PeterCaleb
{quote} Please explain in full detail where the scam is? I'd love to know more about how your deranged mind works? Peter
Peter Caleb was thinking about newbie trader again. Newbie was an incredible coward with dirty fingernails and slimy elbows.
Peter walked over to the window and reflected on his empty surroundings. He had always hated noisy ForexFactory with its perfect, pretty posts. It was a place that encouraged his tendency to feel fuzzy.
Then he saw something in the distance, or rather someone. It was the an incredible figure of newbie trader.
Peter gulped. He glanced at his own reflection. He was an admirable, cowardly, wine drinker with slimy fingernails and fluffy elbows. His friends saw him as a gifted, glamorous gamer. Once, he had even made a cup of tea for a tough trading account.
But not even an admirable person who had once made a cup of tea for a tough trading account, was prepared for what newbie had in store today.
The drizzle rained like walking gerbils, making Peter barmy. Peter grabbed a ribbed hawk that had been strewn nearby; he massaged it with his fingers.
As Peter stepped outside and newbie came closer, he could see the bored glint in his eye.
"Look Peter," growled newbie, with a sympathetic glare that reminded Peter of incredible cats. "I hate you and I want Holly Grail. You owe me 3258 pounds."
Peter looked back, even more barmy and still fingering the ribbed hawk. "newbie, learn more," he replied.
They looked at each other with concerned feelings, like two cuddly, colorful cats chatting at a very deranged accident, which had flute music playing in the background and two caring uncles gyrating to the beat.
Peter studied newbie's dirty fingernails and slimy elbows. Eventually, he took a deep breath. "I'm afraid I declared myself bankrupt," explained Peter. "You will never get your money."
"No!" objected newbie. "You lie!"
"I do not!" retorted Peter. "Now get your dirty fingernails out of here before I hit you with this ribbed hawk."
Newbie looked fuzzy, his wallet raw like a gleaming, glorious gun.
Peter could actually hear newbie's wallet shatter into 3258 pieces. Then the incredible coward hurried away into the distance.
Not even a glass of wine would calm Peter's nerves tonight.
THE END

Want more details? Go here and get some.
  • #1,347
  • Jun 18, 2021 7:10am Jun 18, 2021 7:10am
Quoting ntk
{quote} Could you pls help me to understand how to draw, then how to interpret the lines with the labels H4 , H1, M15 you have in your GU M5 chart? they are yours levels but what is the logic in them. Thanks.
search for ICT:

you need to learn to see the following on a blank chart without using TMAs, MA, RSI, MACD or any thing else.

liquidity
fair value gaps
sl hunting
order blocks
mitigations

the lines are manually drawn via this indicator:
https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...4#post13446674
"Exchange of hands"
  • #1,348
  • Jun 18, 2021 7:28am Jun 18, 2021 7:28am
Quoting joyny
{quote} Peter Caleb was thinking about newbie trader again....
Excellent read joyny, I found the story incredibly believable and just couldn't stop reading until I'd found out what happened at the end.

Enjoy your weekend.

(still chuckling).
  • #1,349
  • Jun 18, 2021 8:20am Jun 18, 2021 8:20am
Quoting joyny
{quote} Peter Caleb was thinking about newbie trader again.
He was sitting near the big pool. Girls were dancing around and drinking champagne. The sun was going down.
- I'm so tired. I have so much money. I have 5-6% daily 3-4 times a week. All that girls, luxury stuff. All ashes if I can't force someone to LEARN, - thought Peter, looking on his new Rolls Royce Cullinan. Who am I if I can't teach a newbie on the forex factory forum?

- Where is Peter? - Asked the topless blonde. - I want to dance! There are Infected Mushrooms already playing their set. Where is Peter?

... But Peter was in the house. He was focused. Serious. Fingers on the keys. He was posting another portion of pure TRUTH about trading...
Observer effect
  • #1,350
  • Jun 18, 2021 12:38pm Jun 18, 2021 12:38pm
DOM On Metatrader MT5

Attached Image


After a bit of tęte-ŕ-tęte I managed to get Pepperstone to set up XAUUSD dom data for MT5. They have promised it for currencies "soon". Is it any value? I really don't know.

I am a mere beginner in this field of Order Flow so it is very possible that I am entirely missing the point but I can't at this stage see how it would be of much use. It changes very fast and the orders that go through are very small. I sat and stared at it for a while and saw very few one lot or larger orders going through.

That said I just switched across to my FX Futures DOM for XAU. It moves much slower as one would expect with futures contracts but at this stage I can't make much sense out of it either.

There seems to me to be three basic tools used for trading order flow. Cumulative Delta Volume (CDV) or perhaps just Delta Volume(DV), Footprint charts which show CDV, DV and other stuff relative to price and lastly Depth of Market (DOM)

CDV/DV and Footprints I think I more or less get. I can also see how the concept of DOM is central to understanding the principles of order flow but I can't figure out how one would actually use the DOM for trading? It seems to me that both Fx spot and futures Dom's both move too fast to be directly interpreted.

Perhaps I need to go and do some more study and think about it all a bit more or perhaps I just need some sleep.
Don't Guess Test
  • #1,351
  • Jun 18, 2021 1:26pm Jun 18, 2021 1:26pm
Quoting TraderTim125
DOM On Metatrader MT5
The problem of DOM on forex is that data are not real and no one knows what are these numbers mean/indicate. For example top left 0.05 at 1772.22 price. What is it? Someone place limit order at that price? So all hundreds and thousands clients of Pepperstone place only 0.05 lot at 1772.22? Or how/what? How can we use that? What it shows? It my opinion it is total fake and unusable for any kind on analysis.

Second problem on forex is that there are no historical data of trades. How many buys was at 1722.22? How many sells? There are no such a data at all. So we can't have delta, we can't calculate the difference to have information about disbalance. All we have is "fake" data about limit orders in the orderbook. But limit orders are "I wish" type of orders, not "it was" type. So it is better to use lunar calendar to predict the movements then to use that "orderbook" data.

On other hand we have futures data. There are correct amount of buys and sells with volume of each for every candle. That's why we are using that data instead of "strange" one from forex broker. The good thing is that somehow markets are equal. If there will be disbalance and huge volume on futures market the same time the same thing happens on forex. Don't know why and how it works, but it works.

That's why you can't understand how to use DOM for trading. Because it is impossible to use forex DOM for it.
Observer effect
  • #1,352
  • Jun 18, 2021 2:22pm Jun 18, 2021 2:22pm
Quoting ryuryu
{quote} The problem of DOM on forex is that data are not real and no one knows what are these numbers mean/indicate. For example top left 0.05 at 1772.22 price. What is it? Someone place limit order at that price? So all hundreds and thousands clients of Pepperstone place only 0.05 lot at 1772.22? Or how/what? How can we use that? What it shows? It my opinion it is total fake and unusable for any kind on analysis. Second problem on forex is that there are no historical data of trades. How many buys was at 1722.22? How many sells? There are no such...
Hi ryuryu

That was a great post on the MT5 use of the DOM.
Its just to impress users but offers no value.

If anybody has a spare hour or two this weekend, and want to see the footprint or DOM in use, I recommend you download “Quantower” and watch it on the free live data feed on Bitcoin.

Bewared, it moves so fast on the 1 minute footprint or DOM, you will need a strong drink nearby.

Cheers
Trading thin liquidity at the boundary of the charts
  • #1,353
  • Jun 18, 2021 6:18pm Jun 18, 2021 6:18pm
Ok, yeah, uuum, so nothing to say about scamming. Not surprising.

One thing is for sure in Life, at least 75% of situations we find ourselves in, there's always at least 1 or 2 persons who assume they know but really don't. Obvious example re: DOM. Before one dismisses its usefulness, consider this - The "function" of DOM if anyone cares to notice, is hardwired (usually) into the platform. This means, technically, you can use any data you want if set to use dedicated data. No I've not done it myself but I know people who have. I suppose, either through using the platform as a thoroughfare OR, as I have done, create a "mimic" of it in Excel or another platform that allows for coding and programming eg Amibroker. That's all I will say here. Seeing as "people" love consuming junk information instead of real things and cannot handle real life.

Peter
Real Trading is not gambling.
  • #1,354
  • Edited Jun 19, 2021 6:12pm Jun 18, 2021 10:16pm | Edited Jun 19, 2021 6:12pm
Quoting PeterCaleb
{quote}There's nothing extraordinary about generating an average of 5% per day you trade
Really? So this is true because you say so? Where is your evidence? I say again, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Now I am sure you will deflect as you are prone to do and get a good case of verbal diarrhea, but it remains that saying that you average 5% a day has client fishing written all over it. If you want to sell something just say so. If it is quality, people will buy it. But, you would still need to prove that you average 5% a day for even a month under normal market conditions, never mind a year.

All of this tripe about people not knowing how to think is wishful thinking on your part. You are hopeful that people will buy such a claim without any kind of evidence. This is shameful behavior Peter. Stop saying things that you cannot empirically support. Stop expecting people to simply accept such claims.

Quoting PeterCaleb
there's always at least 1 or 2 persons who assume they know but really don't.
As evidenced by who, you?

Maybe if you got a classical education, you would know what evidence is. This is not a philosophy forum where you just get to say whatever pops into your addled mind and call that evidence. In areas where finance and science is done, evidence needs to be:

Objective
Quantifiable
Repeatable

I am sure your next diatribe will be along the philosophy line, will lack objectivity, repeatability, data, and have what is in effect a word salad:

It is a tale
Told by an [redacted], full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #1,355
  • Jun 18, 2021 11:52pm Jun 18, 2021 11:52pm
Quoting PeterCaleb
Ok, yeah, uuum, so nothing to say about scamming. Not surprising. One thing is for sure in Life, at least 75% of situations we find ourselves in, there's always at least 1 or 2 persons who assume they know but really don't.
Peter boy.. You need to LEARN more to understand what i said.You just assumed you know what i wrote... but really don't.

Peter boy.. What a clown you are... Do your dirty scammer work. You definetly will get believers/clients. This is why 80% lose money.

There are for example trendy scamm called "TronCase" what allready have thousands of clients and growing. 1.7% per day promised profits. Ponzi schema. And still so many believe.. But Peter will beat that... 5% a day.. what a great offer!!
  • #1,356
  • Jun 19, 2021 1:48am Jun 19, 2021 1:48am
Quoting bilal1947
{quote} search for ICT: you need to learn to see the following on a blank chart without using TMAs, MA, RSI, MACD or any thing else. liquidity fair value gaps sl hunting order blocks mitigations the lines are manually drawn via this indicator: https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...4#post13446674
I have just posted my idea of making a dashboard to see price moves in perspective of stop hunt.
Lack of Excel or any programming language does not hinder me from designing information collectors for manual or algo traders.
https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...0#post13591190
https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...3#post13591193
Practice makes a person perfect
  • #1,357
  • Edited 2:37am Jun 19, 2021 2:09am | Edited 2:37am
Quoting simnz
{quote} I have just posted my idea of making a dashboard to see price moves in perspective of stop hunt. Lack of Excel or any programming language does not hinder me from designing information collectors for manual or algo traders. https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...0#post13591190 https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...3#post13591193
a dashboard seems interesting, some times price goes back (how far that depends how price manipulates itself) to fill some fair value gap which itself do the liquidity hunt, and price can leave some fv gap for later time, so a dashboard can only tell price is above yesterday price this many pips but only eyes can see price action. may be you can crack some thing in you efforts.

i only look for a pair or two max three and target is 0 drawdown entries, attached one screenshot with small story i wish peter to guide us like that.

liquidity is generated by market itself, in variety of ways, price usually moves from three spots and off-course rejects them as well depending on which side price is moving it will respect these on one side and not on the other i.e., liquidity, fair value gaps, and order blocks

below two M1 chart examples

filled first fvp of day before yesterday landed to an order block, then did below on friday and taken the generated liquidity too
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: gold.png Size: 90 KB


from fv gap (sold on a buy candle in a sell trend where a FVG is left as price has yet go lower to do its daily range.)
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 5f25f49438de6d231224a700409b4717.png Size: 318 KB
"Exchange of hands"
  • #1,358
  • Jun 19, 2021 2:33am Jun 19, 2021 2:33am
Quoting simnz
{quote} I have just posted my idea of making a dashboard to see price moves in perspective of stop hunt. Lack of Excel or any programming language does not hinder me from designing information collectors for manual or algo traders. https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...0#post13591190 https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...3#post13591193
What do you mean price moves in perspective of stop hunt, you can't determine that from daily change or ATR
  • #1,359
  • Jun 19, 2021 7:10am Jun 19, 2021 7:10am
Quoting ryuryu
{quote} He was sitting near the big pool. Girls were dancing around and drinking champagne. The sun was going down. - I'm so tired. I have so much money. I have 5-6% daily 3-4 times a week. All that girls, luxury stuff. All ashes if I can't force someone to LEARN, - thought Peter, looking on his new Rolls Royce Cullinan. Who am I if I can't teach a newbie on the forex factory forum? - Where is Peter? - Asked the topless blonde. - I want to dance! There are Infected Mushrooms already playing their set. Where is Peter? ... But Peter was in the house....
Was the track of Infected Mushroom, Becoming Insane.

No me acuerdo lo que paso
Ni me di cuenta ni que me pico Todo da vueltas como un carrusel Locura recurre todita mi piel

Wake me up before I change again
Remind me the story that I won´t get insane
Tell me why it´s always the same
Explain me the reason why I´m so much in pain
Before I change again...
Remind me the story that
I won't get insane Before I change again...
Remind me the story that I won't get insane
  • #1,360
  • Jun 19, 2021 8:27am Jun 19, 2021 8:27am
Quoting PeterCaleb
In a class of assets and instruments where the "details" of orders are not made public knowledge, I see many people hoping that "their order" will be filled. So, after all the prep work you've done, all the research and testing, the day arrives to go live and you send your first order to market and ....... wait
Did I miss a discussion on order fill? Is this something that many people experience? Or is this just a bullshit, made up topic? I'm going with bullshit, made up topic that gives someone an excuse to ramble on with more uncoordinated thinking, just for the sake of trying to appear superior in his made up, bullshit, fantasy world where he makes 5% a day on his $100 trading account, and where only he knows how and where to set his entry orders. Peter, please never stop being you.
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