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Real or Algo

  • #1,241
  • Mar 14, 2021 9:14pm Mar 14, 2021 9:14pm
Quoting BWilliam
{quote}
Hi TimeTells, watch these 2 videos to comprehend and appreciate what it takes to get there.

2mins of my life to watch. Got it fully now, thank you, understand.
  • #1,242
  • Mar 14, 2021 9:37pm Mar 14, 2021 9:37pm
Quoting BWilliam
{quote} https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...6#post13450396 https://www.forexfactory.com/thread/...6#post13450506 I asked the question here at the start of this current discussion. {quote} If anyone read this thread carefully you can establish a few key common understanding and status. 1. No one can predict the next day's trading. It's impossible to predict the future.
Question asked.
Question answered.
Answered ignored -- reality ignored.
If there is something to discuss or debate, perhaps start with my original answer.
  • #1,243
  • Mar 14, 2021 9:56pm Mar 14, 2021 9:56pm
Elon Musk.

A legend who went against the herds. You can visibly see it from his eyes. He's tired, he wants the best for mankind, but he gets stoned by the people he looked up to as a child. His followers follow him, but he still feels alone because none of his followers can be at his level to lead. Deep inside, I believe he wished that he had someone as capable or better than himself who is able lead him to all the right answers while not sacrificing his own dreams. Also, I wonder how much TRUE sleep he gets... Truly inspirational.

Illusion are not just in the form of indis. Many newbies took indis for signs of signal, I am no exception. After a while I realized, indis are only best in giving yourself a pat in the back to signify a "good job, well done" if you have managed to placed your entries before the signal.

Illusion can also be in the form of price as well. I maybe wrong. However, if an apple price of the day opens at $1 but closes at $1000 by the end of the day, that is no longer an illusion. Absurd example

Cheers,
Zyzel
Always Learning. I am no Master
  • #1,244
  • Mar 14, 2021 10:40pm Mar 14, 2021 10:40pm
Quoting Zyzel
Elon Musk. A legend who went against the herds. You can visibly see it from his eyes. He's tired, he wants the best for mankind, but he gets stoned by the people he looked up to as a child. His followers follow him, but he still feels alone because none of his followers can be at his level to lead. Deep inside, I believe he wished that he had someone as capable or better than himself who is able lead him to all the right answers while not sacrificing his own dreams. Also, I wonder how much TRUE sleep he gets... Truly inspirational. Illusion are...
Hi S........ Sorry BWilliams ....... Sorry Zyzel

Man you are driving me mad with your name changes. Anybody would think you were a rockstar.
Trading thin liquidity at the boundary of the charts
  • #1,245
  • Edited 11:46pm Mar 14, 2021 11:34pm | Edited 11:46pm
Quoting RickM
{quote} Hi S........ Sorry BWilliams ....... Sorry Zyzel Man you are driving me mad with your name changes. Anybody would think you were a rockstar.
Hi RickM

First off, I apologize to BW if my comments may have tarnished his reputation .My comments have nothing to do with his true knowledge nor do I claim to know his full wisdom

Just check my all my post . I only have 20 posts, Not difficult to glance them through and you should be able to see where my level is - amateur at best?

I am not BW. I'm in the mid 20s. He said in previous post that he's in the 60s. I'm an Engineer, And he studied finance. We can have a skype face call to validate we are separate entities. Maybe on the weekends ? I'll really love to meet you guys though. I really do have passion in trading.

And to be honest, I have learnt a lot from you very much as well. So thank you for your inputs! (Edited: But learning also takes time, I wished I had clones to study simultaneously. One to study yours and another to pursue BW's in deeper detail)

I really do like your style of trading too. In fact, so much so that I am still reviewing, if it is possible to combine both your trading style and BW together. This maybe my inexperience talking but Do have a PM chat with me, RickM, if you have the time. I want to learn M1 trading as well, especially with entries and if possible very tight SLs.

Cheers,
Zyzel
Always Learning. I am no Master
  • #1,246
  • Mar 15, 2021 4:43am Mar 15, 2021 4:43am
Quoting RickM
{quote} Hi S........ Sorry BWilliams ....... Sorry Zyzel Man you are driving me mad with your name changes. Anybody would think you were a rockstar.
Now now Rick..leave skyway alone... we can all try to erase history..it's just those damned pesky requotes that's the fly in the ointment.

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  • #1,247
  • Mar 15, 2021 6:27am Mar 15, 2021 6:27am
Quoting pierre23
{quote} You agree with RickM's post, yet you are essentially saying the same thing, except that it's in the form of an "algo" setting an "attractive safe price". Not meaning to sound aggressive but it sounds a little hypocritical? Who created this "algo"? Does every institution have to agree on this price the "algo" sets? Is it random? It's clearing out stops/orders..... for who? 50 major bank economists agreeing to a fair price or an algorithm doing essentially the same thing - for someone else or a group of people or instos. You're talking about...
How come I missed this post ?. This is a top post.

Quoting xRedStaRx
{quote} I still don't understand all the algo talk. If you go to a chart on SP500 or US treasuries or any other market for that matter, you will see the same patterns emerge every time, these markets, like FX, are NOT controlled by algos. That's just a fact. I'm not sure why you have quoted a youtube lecture on microeconomics. Yes it's not just supply and demand, there are two additional key components in the equation that you can use to DERIVE supply and demand 1) Liquidity 2) Profitability It doesn't matter if you operate on the m1 time frame...
Another Gem
It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #1,248
  • Mar 15, 2021 10:01am Mar 15, 2021 10:01am
Quoting Shabs19
{quote} How come I missed this post ?. This is a top post. {quote} Another Gem
Looks like I missed these posts, too. Thanks for referencing them.

Unfortunately, we've just been repeating what these two traders were saying 1,100 posts ago. This thread has come full circle -- twice. What frustrates those of us NOT on team algo is the failure of team algo to debate, or discuss, anything of relevance. We present empirical facts and information, and the reply comes back -- "I hear you, but it still might be an algo". And when pressed, they complain how "unpleasant" it is to challenge them. Like I said earlier, there is a difference between talking about BS and talking BS. Either debate the topic, stand your ground, by presenting proof (which is not a chart that "might indicate it's an algo") but actual freaking proof, or button up this thread and let it drift into irrelevancy.
  • #1,249
  • Mar 15, 2021 10:50am Mar 15, 2021 10:50am
Quoting moodybot
It was suggested that a thread may gain some traction discussing supply/demand ...targets...support/resistance and all nuances there of.. Keep it clean, respect opinions. Have something to discuss? Go for it. If no interest no probs, I’ll close it down. Added 05/05/2020 For general reference only...George closed the thread...however...he will post when the need arises.. https://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=874421
Algo can be pretty real!
Always ready to help
  • #1,250
  • Mar 15, 2021 11:36am Mar 15, 2021 11:36am
Quoting GEfx
{quote} Looks like I missed these posts, too. Thanks for referencing them. Unfortunately, we've just been repeating what these two traders were saying 1,100 posts ago. This thread has come full circle -- twice.
Sadly that is how I feel, taking part in this thread is futile.

What they know is only for the priveleged members of their little group or clique. Not for the masses as it will blow their brains.

Summary of this thread in my own personal opinion:

So let's talk in riddles, challenge the non-believers, offer them vague references & meaninglesss charts to show basically nothing that, we know, can already be seen by TA. But please shh.... if anyone shows you levels or contradicts you, it was pure chance and does not disprove there is a single algo, which I am not sure about myself.
I cannot explain the phenomenon of accurately predicted levels so must be some algo, somehwere, not sure where it is, who owns it, running these illusions we trade daily. How is it brokers are all in this act together giving us all the same prices ?
Oh, TA tried it in the past, didn't work for me, too subjective, so it can't be useful to anybody else.

However, me & my team of specially gifted coders, have developed some fancy specially coded indicators, that we don't really use by the way, they are only for reference, but we have this super duper mathematical sine wave calculator that can tell us not only what the prices of tops & bottoms are, but also when they will happen in the future, and we know the market will turn on a single pip. No we don't like the word "predictions". Even though I can tell you these exact levels in advance, before even the professionals can.

Now what more proof could you possibly want ? Group Hug...................

Go back to the top & repeat from the beginning.

Treat the above with a pinch of salt, only humour. No offence intended to anyone.
As the saying goes : " Show me the Yachts".
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ya...tYx9DqmBK7JLsM

I am not surprised we missed some of these excellent posters and there are many of them scattered in this thread who have simply not been heard or answered. I honestly thought it was supposed to be a debate.

Even if there are another 1000 posts we all will be none the wiser. Pity.
It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #1,251
  • Mar 15, 2021 11:51am Mar 15, 2021 11:51am
Quoting Shabs19
{quote} Sadly that is how I feel, taking part in this thread is futile. What they know is only for the priveleged members of their little group or clique. Not for the masses as it will blow their brains. Summary of this thread in my own personal opinion: So let's talk in riddles, challenge the non-believers, offer them vague references & meaninglesss charts to show basically nothing that, we know, can already be seen by TA. But please shh.... if anyone shows you levels or contradicts you, it was pure chance and does not disprove there is a single...
Quoting GEfx
{quote} Looks like I missed these posts, too. Thanks for referencing them. Unfortunately, we've just been repeating what these two traders were saying 1,100 posts ago. This thread has come full circle -- twice. What frustrates those of us NOT on team algo is the failure of team algo to debate, or discuss, anything of relevance. We present empirical facts and information, and the reply comes back -- "I hear you, but it still might be an algo". And when pressed, they complain how "unpleasant" it is to challenge them. Like I said earlier, there is...
From your point of view, what's the difference between algo and real?
Always ready to help
  • #1,252
  • Mar 15, 2021 12:00pm Mar 15, 2021 12:00pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} {quote} From your point of view, what's the difference between algo and real?
OMG, please just read the posts we've made here. Answering your question would be the start of the third circle around this topic. There are dozen of unanswered questions, posts with all the proof of "real" and answers to specific questions on topics like levels and "mystery similarities among crosses". It's all been presented, just not refuted or discusses or rebutted.
  • #1,253
  • Edited 12:32pm Mar 15, 2021 12:14pm | Edited 12:32pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} {quote} From your point of view, what's the difference between algo and real?
There is no doubt about algos being present in the markets. They have taken over many of the dealing desk operations.

The point of this thread is to debate whether the Foerx market is run by an Algo or if the Market is Real

Algo is used to promote the theory that the charts are not real, they are an illusion and cannot be real trades occuring that affect the charts producing all the patterns, supply & demand, support & resistance etc. All of this is an Illusion. It is a Theory as it cannot be proved a single algo runs the market, only proof is that tops & bottoms in markets can be predicted in advance to the pip and in time. Using mathematical tools undisclosed to the uninitiated.

Real is used to denote that all the patterns formed on our charts are due to real transactions and the market observes Supply & Demand, Support & Resistance and all other TA techniques employed by retail traders taught by the so-called professionals.

Main point of contention is not whether Algos are operating in the forex market, it is accepted that they do, but whether it is a single algo
Something like in the Matrix movies with Keanu Reeves. Is it the Red Pill or the Blue Pill ?

Are you a Believer ?

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So I am out. -Thanks see you at 2500+ posts.

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It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #1,254
  • Mar 15, 2021 12:42pm Mar 15, 2021 12:42pm
Quoting Shabs19
{quote} There is no doubt about algos being present in the markets. They have taken over many of the dealing desk operations. The point of this thread is to debate whether the Foerx market is run by an Algo or if the Market is Real Algo is used to promote the theory that the charts are not real, they are an illusion and cannot be real trades occuring that affect the charts producing all the patterns, supply & demand, support & resistance etc. All of this is an Illusion. It is a Theory as it cannot be proved a single algo runs the market, only proof...
All those techniques you mention in the Real section can be executed by Algos. I can't see algos as something that is not part of the real thing, as the algo thing is only a matter of automation.
Always ready to help
  • #1,255
  • Mar 15, 2021 12:46pm Mar 15, 2021 12:46pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} All those techniques you mention in the Real section can be executed by Algos. I can't see algos as something that is not part of the real thing, as the algo thing is only a matter of automation.
So you say there is a SINGLE ALGO running the Forex Market ?

Or are you missing the point being made here deliberately ? Is there a language problem here or am I not clear ?

No argument there are Algos in the Market just not a SINGLE ONE
It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #1,256
  • Mar 15, 2021 1:12pm Mar 15, 2021 1:12pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} OMG, please just read the posts we've made here. Answering your question would be the start of the third circle around this topic. There are dozen of unanswered questions, posts with all the proof of "real" and answers to specific questions on topics like levels and "mystery similarities among crosses". It's all been presented, just not refuted or discusses or rebutted.
Will try. Too many.
Always ready to help
  • #1,257
  • Mar 15, 2021 1:13pm Mar 15, 2021 1:13pm
Quoting Shabs19
{quote} So you say there is a SINGLE ALGO running the Forex Market ? Or are you missing the point being made here deliberately ? Is there a language problem here or am I not clear ? No argument there are Algos in the Market just not a SINGLE ONE
I'm not saying that. What makes you think I say that?

It seems like I don't get the point being discussed then.
Always ready to help
  • #1,258
  • Edited 1:36pm Mar 15, 2021 1:21pm | Edited 1:36pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} All those techniques you mention in the Real section can be executed by Algos. I can't see algos as something that is not part of the real thing, as the algo thing is only a matter of automation.
Regarding "techniques", we've proven that they are real and, not single algo. If you choose the advocate for algo, then you embrace the notion that the algo is malevolent, in that team algo claims the algo falsely paints candles to trick unsuspecting traders into making bad trades, it allows banks to "drop trades on the other of their book", whatever the hell that means, to give banks an edge, it follows mathematical formulas that no one can describe or follow (except one member of team algo claims he's well ahead of the algo), and it makes TA and FA irrelevant. Is that your position? Really?
  • #1,259
  • Mar 15, 2021 1:22pm Mar 15, 2021 1:22pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} Will try. Too many.
It's probably best that you skip it and move on.
  • #1,260
  • Mar 15, 2021 1:24pm Mar 15, 2021 1:24pm
Quoting PaulMF
{quote} I'm not saying that. What makes you think I say that? It seems like I don't get the point being discussed then.
Beacuse you dont understand the difference between ALGOS (plural, meaning many if not hundreds or thousands ) trading the Forex

OR A SINGLE ALGO, meaning only ONE.

What exactly do you believe ? Please state that or answer a poll at the start of the thread.

Beyond this I can't help you - No one can.
It never gets easier, you just get better
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