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Sam Seiden Goes DOWN

  • #21
  • Apr 10, 2020 1:17am Apr 10, 2020 1:17am
How they promoted it as somewhat a 'holy grail ' and pressured potential customers to part with their money, often what such customers can ill afford.

KP

Quoting Chronus
{quote} Does the "fraudulent practices" include the knowledge of trading supply and demand zones? Just asking for the sake of information.
Do your homework, follow the footprints of smart money
  • #22
  • Apr 10, 2020 1:26am Apr 10, 2020 1:26am
Nobody shares his edges and business secrets in this zero sum game....... If not, then 99.99% SCAM. Period!
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
  • #23
  • Apr 10, 2020 2:32am Apr 10, 2020 2:32am
Quoting GMD
{quote} Mate.. what are you talking about?? You think a Trade Explorer or Myfxbook from regulated broker is not necessary to prove profitability in an online forum??? {quote} Sure, but if you are asking for people's money for your teaching services, at least this "knowledge" has to be backed up with some proof of profitability.... otherwise there is no "knowledge" and is just a guy talking nonesense he doesnt even understand himself, and selling it to desperate people who want to make some money to have a better life for them and their families......
Trade Explorer and Myfxbook may prove profitability but one has to do their homework. One has to get their hands dirty if they expect any harvest from their investment. One size does not fit all.

Supply and demand trading is not the holy grail. There is nothing magical about it. Like any other trading style adopted there will always be losses. MM is the real holy grail in forex

Really appreciate your time to explain your perspective on this issue. The thing is supply and demand regulate price in a free market economy. Sam Seiden has nothing to do with this. He may have committed the offense as charged but if supply and demand determine market price then he has committed no offense.
Fred
  • #24
  • Apr 10, 2020 2:36am Apr 10, 2020 2:36am
Quoting KeenPips
How they promoted it as somewhat a 'holy grail ' and pressured potential customers to part with their money, often what such customers can ill afford. KP {quote}
Thanks for the clarification. It borders on the method he used to propagate the knowledge. The concept in itself is solid. Some have adapted it to seek out equilibrium zones. An equilibrium zone, as you well know, is the price level where supply and demand intersect.
Fred
  • #25
  • Apr 10, 2020 2:39am Apr 10, 2020 2:39am
Quoting heispark
Nobody shares his edges and business secrets in this zero sum game....... If not, then 99.99% SCAM. Period!
Lol. That is one way of looking at it.
Fred
  • #26
  • Apr 10, 2020 3:04am Apr 10, 2020 3:04am
Imo the S/R concept is more reliable than the D/S concept if you allow for market manipulation and avoid the set-and-forget approach based on limit orders.

KP

Quoting Chronus
{quote} Thanks for the clarification. It borders on the method he used to propagate the knowledge. The concept in itself is solid. Some have adapted it to seek out equilibrium zones. An equilibrium zone, as you well know, is the price level where supply and demand intersect.
Do your homework, follow the footprints of smart money
  • #27
  • Apr 10, 2020 3:15am Apr 10, 2020 3:15am
people would get so mad when i said his stuff didn't work. They wanted to believe so bad!
The only system that will work is one designed by and for yourself.
  • #28
  • Apr 10, 2020 3:48am Apr 10, 2020 3:48am
Quoting BWilliam
"Supply demand" and "support resistance" concepts are grossly flawed.
Totally agreed, Supply / Demand along with support and resistance do not exist. If a trader spends enough time on a 1 minute chart, they may start to understand what moves price.
Trading thin liquidity at the boundary of the charts
  • #29
  • Apr 10, 2020 4:31am Apr 10, 2020 4:31am
Quoting KeenPips
Imo the S/R concept is more reliable than the D/S concept if you allow for market manipulation and avoid the set-and-forget approach based on limit orders. KP {quote}
Won't dispute that. I am of the opinion that traders should do whatever is needed to stack the odds in their favour. Nial Fuller is a frontline proponent of support and resistance zones in his price action courses. That is another solid concept that helps light the path of success in trading. Keenpips, always a pleasure to read your opinions.
Fred
  • #30
  • Edited 5:11am Apr 10, 2020 4:59am | Edited 5:11am
Quoting Chronus
Nial Fuller is a frontline proponent of support and resistance zones in his price action courses. That is another solid concept that helps light the path of success in trading. Keenpips, always a pleasure to read your opinions.
He is another marketer, fooled so many traders into believing his coined jargon.

So S/R magically come to life in forex market AFTER his marketing courses. What about before that? Can you explain.
Know what you trade
  • #31
  • Apr 10, 2020 6:19am Apr 10, 2020 6:19am
Quoting Chronus
{quote} Does the "fraudulent practices" include the knowledge of trading supply and demand zones? Just asking for the sake of information.
Simple answer is No.

They are being investigated for :

The Fedral Trade Commission (FTC) alleges that Online Trading A cademy (OTA) uses false or unfounded earnings claims to sell “training programs”

According to the FTC, OTA misrepresents that it has a patented “strategy” that anyone can use to generate substantial income from trading in the financial markets.

FTC alleges that OTA’s own surveys indicate that its customers are not making the type of income OTA advertises.

Evidence obtained by the FTC also indicates that instructors’ claims of amassing wealth by using OTA’s strategy are false or unsubstantiated.

“It is illegal to make earnings claims in marketing investment opportunities or training, unless the seller has a reasonable basis to make such claims,” said Andrew Smith, the Director of the FTC’s Bureau of Consumer Protection. “OTA has used unfounded earnings claims to bilk Americans out of their savings.”

The FTC also alleges that OTA has required customers who request a refund to sign contracts barring them from posting negative comments about OTA or its personnel, and specifically from reporting wrongdoing to law enforcement agencies.

The defendants in the case include OTA Franchise Corp, Newport Exchange Holdings, NEH Services, Inc., Eyal Shachar (also known as Eyal Shahar), Samuel Seiden, and Darren Kimoto. They are charged with violating the FTC Act and the Consumer Review Fairness Act.

The Federal Trade Commission works to promote competition, and protect and educate consumers.

Like anything you purchase you have certain consumer rights & protection from the authorities in your countries.
In the UK it is the Financial Conduct Authority FCA.
It never gets easier, you just get better
  • #32
  • Apr 10, 2020 6:20am Apr 10, 2020 6:20am
Quoting BWilliam
{quote} He is another marketer, fooled so many traders into believing his coined jargon. So S/R magically come to life in forex market AFTER his marketing courses. What about before that? Can you explain.
There has always been SR zones before Fuller just as there has always been SD zones before Sam Seiden. I only referred to him as someone who popularised the concept. Is there any forex tutor who is not a con man? Peter Baine for example. Is a person no longer entitled to payment reward for disseminating an idea? I don't get it.
Fred
  • #33
  • Apr 10, 2020 6:38am Apr 10, 2020 6:38am
Quoting Shabs19
{quote} Simple answer is No. They are being investigated for : The Fedral Trade Commission (FTC) alleges that Online Trading A cademy (OTA) uses false or unfounded earnings claims to sell “training programs” According to the FTC, OTA misrepresents that it has a patented “strategy” that anyone can use to generate substantial income from trading in the financial markets. FTC alleges that OTA’s own surveys indicate that its customers are not making the type of income OTA advertises. Evidence obtained by the FTC also indicates that instructors’ claims...
Thank you. This clears the air. Sharp practices deserve punitive measures.
Fred
  • #34
  • Apr 10, 2020 6:41am Apr 10, 2020 6:41am
I use "supply/demand" and "support/resistance" in my trading but not blindly tho(identifying a level, placing an order and walking away). I watch how price enters the zone and what is in the "background" of that movement toward price. I am an Oil trader mostly and there are days when your preplanned levels get blown though(like yesterday) but since I didn't have resting orders there it wasn't an issue. I also use Delta and Footprint charts in conjunction with my zones, but not in the traditional way they're taught to be used.
  • #35
  • Apr 10, 2020 8:01am Apr 10, 2020 8:01am
Thanks mate.

Trade safe.

KP

Quoting Chronus
{quote} Won't dispute that. I am of the opinion that traders should do whatever is needed to stack the odds in their favour. Nial Fuller is a frontline proponent of support and resistance zones in his price action courses. That is another solid concept that helps light the path of success in trading. Keenpips, always a pleasure to read your opinions.
Do your homework, follow the footprints of smart money
  • #36
  • Apr 10, 2020 8:07am Apr 10, 2020 8:07am
Quoting Chronus
{quote} There has always been SR zones before Fuller just as there has always been SD zones before Sam Seiden. I only referred to him as someone who popularised the concept. Is there any forex tutor who is not a con man? Peter Baine for example. Is a person no longer entitled to payment reward for disseminating an idea? I don't get it.
And the James16 site that suddenly died. Started with Pin bars didn't it?
Still has followers albeit no captain.
every Saint has a past. Every Sinner has a Future
  • #37
  • Apr 10, 2020 8:23am Apr 10, 2020 8:23am
I don't think much is going to come out of this. The worst case scenario, they will have to pay a fine. OTA courses are way too expensive. All the supply/demand and other strategies, anyone can look it up online for free and learn and practice on your own. Why did a lot of people run to this school and pay $5,000 and more I will never understand. I am not even sure what exactly can they charge OTA because after all, people go to them and agree to pay a fee for the course. Not sure what to think of this.
  • #38
  • Apr 10, 2020 8:27am Apr 10, 2020 8:27am
Technical chart patterns should be used for entering trades only. You cannot trade purely off the chart without building a directional bias first based on many factors.
Support and resistance does work better than random entry though, there have been many research studies done on this. Also, supply and demand is technically a real thing, just not on your lower time frame charts. Take a look at a daily chart and you will see them. They do not always stay the same, they get broken and change over time, but they do hold sometimes. You need to understand how the market works.
  • #39
  • Apr 10, 2020 8:27am Apr 10, 2020 8:27am
People are way too lazy to learn how to read a chart they need to pay somone to teach them some total crap?

They can only blame themselves.
COT: The precious data ignored
  • #40
  • Apr 10, 2020 9:17am Apr 10, 2020 9:17am
Quoting kuroro001
People are way too lazy to learn how to read a chart they need to pay somone to teach them some total crap? They can only blame themselves.
It's hard when you are new, and don't know where to start. Getting in the hands of the right mentor can fast forward your progress years and years. But you don't know who is good in this business.
// Jim Ægirson https://discord.gg/Dkm3demYsx
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