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Trading team pros and cons

  • #1
  • First Post: Feb 15, 2020 1:00pm Feb 15, 2020 1:00pm
I've had some thoughts about this, ever since I got a complete method of trading, since I realized all the profitable setups that I am missing everyday, on different assets, different time frames... etc

Have any of you guys here on FF, ever tried being a part of a trading team, or have some thoughts about it.
I believe the pros outweigh the cons. If you think about it, lets say you had a method, it worked on all time frames, on a lot of assets, (more than one person could ever monitor) Obviously Volume & volatility is required for it to work properly.

If that was the case, you would be missing out on loads of setups, for example a scalper, or a day trader may only watch a couple of pairs, or even one pair. Because on such short time frames, there are more opportunities. For this to work, everybody in the team would have to be trading the same overall method. But, one guy could be scalping, one guy could be swing trading, and one guy could also just be day trading. We all know how much money you make in trading can be calculated by

Trading expectancy * Trade frequency * Bet size, So.. To increase the amount of money you make can be done by increasing these three things, you can't really increase expectancy unless you lower Trade frequency, so lets say you have a very nice expectancy, then the only real way is to increase Trade frequency and Bet size, now Bet size can simply be done by more capital, and trade frequency can't really be done if you're working as hard as you possibly can - that's where a trading team comes into play, it would also make doing fundamental & sentimental analysis easier, because everyone could do work. And if we're trading the same profitable method = more profitable trading opportunities = More profit, also you could create some trading friends

Now there are cons of course as well.. For example you would have to teach your method to the other people, now if they already had some understanding of trading then that would definitely help. Then you also need to find the right people, with good synergy and communication, and people that are dedicated enough, and willing enough. So essentially kinda tough. But i might wanna try it out.

All of the posts i saw on this topic (the most recent one's" were from 2006 & 2012 - If any of you guys have any experience, or thoughts feel free to post them below, feel like this is a pretty interesting topic that no one discusses apparently.
  • #2
  • Feb 17, 2020 1:16pm Feb 17, 2020 1:16pm
Hi there,

Nice thread are you looking for a trading team or someone to trade with?
  • #3
  • Feb 17, 2020 2:08pm Feb 17, 2020 2:08pm
I am looking to do something of the kind in the future, either by a normal trading team as mentioned, or by starting a hedge fund, probably the latter since after I put some thought into this, I don't think it's worth it, it would take quite a bit of time to train people, and just don't think it's worth it.
Anyways cheers for the response.
  • #4
  • Feb 18, 2020 3:58am Feb 18, 2020 3:58am
Well the team sounded like a great Idea!
  • #5
  • Feb 21, 2020 9:18am Feb 21, 2020 9:18am
Quoting theunkown
Well the team sounded like a great Idea!
The problem is, it would take multiple months, because traders would have to build their own system, since there is no "one size fits all" kind of system hence I mention it as a method, but I might be looking to team up with some good fundamental traders, since my method is a technical method, and using it combined with fundamental analysis would increase profitability.
  • #6
  • Feb 21, 2020 3:17pm Feb 21, 2020 3:17pm
My wife is a trader too, she trades WTI exclusively, i trade 2 forex crosses only.. She trades with time based charts (like most traders) and i trade with renko

on the rare ocasion that an awesome signal its coming in WTi, she tells me wich price bracket too look for and if its going to be a buy or sell and i try to snipe it.. it works but its not something that happens frequently anyway

And we have years together, we know each other very well, how do we trade, etc you name it, everything that comes with time in a relationship

AND EVEN THEN..

we tend to NOT mess with each other trading activity !!

Its NOT needed, its REDUNDANT and as much as we can be in tune with each other we can have different points of view at any given time, we can make money alone easily, Why mess with that?


just food for tought =)
  • #7
  • Feb 21, 2020 3:49pm Feb 21, 2020 3:49pm
Quoting havo
My wife is a trader too, she trades WTI exclusively, i trade 2 forex crosses only.. She trades with time based charts (like most traders) and i trade with renko on the rare ocasion that an awesome signal its coming in WTi, she tells me wich price bracket too look for and if its going to be a buy or sell and i try to snipe it.. it works but its not something that happens frequently anyway And we have years together, we know each other very well, how do we trade, etc you name it, everything that comes with time in a relationship AND EVEN THEN.. we...
That sounds awesome man! I'm happy for you and your wife.

You're right - Technical analysis becomes sort of subjective, because we all see different things, and use different technical strategies. Hence my first suggestion was me teaching people my method, then I realized that would take months, probably 5+ months, because they would have to build their own system...
Fundamental analysis is more objective imo, and should be combined with technical analysis, to find the most powerful trading opportunities, with the highest probability of success. It can also be used as a negative filter for certain trades, which also increases profitability.

The only thing I possibly could be looking for is to combine my Technical method, with a good fundamental trader, since that would be beneficial imo
  • #8
  • Feb 22, 2020 2:25am Feb 22, 2020 2:25am
Quoting W1llbam
I've had some thoughts about this, ever since I got a complete method of trading, since I realized all the profitable setups that I am missing everyday, on different assets, different time frames... etc Have any of you guys here on FF, ever tried being a part of a trading team, or have some thoughts about it. I believe the pros outweigh the cons. If you think about it, lets say you had a method, it worked on all time frames, on a lot of assets, (more than one person could ever monitor) Obviously Volume & volatility is required for it to work properly....
First I dont know if you are a new FF member or a rehashed one.

Second you claimed to have complete trading method for all assets and you missed out on many successful set ups and different assets. Any evidence that you are even successful on just one?

You are prepared to teach yr method but it will take abt 5.5months to master it. How did you arrive to 5.5 months when imparting yr knowledge? I thought the theme of this thread is pros and cons of a team and not abt you teaching.

Waiting to hear from you...
  • #9
  • Feb 22, 2020 3:35am Feb 22, 2020 3:35am
Quoting genghistar
{quote} First I dont know if you are a new FF member or a rehashed one. Second you claimed to have complete trading method for all assets and you missed out on many successful set ups and different assets. Any evidence that you are even successful on just one? You are prepared to teach yr method but it will take abt 5.5months to master it. How did you arrive to 5.5 months when imparting yr knowledge? I thought the theme of this thread is pros and cons of a team and not abt you teaching. Waiting to hear from you...
Agreed. Isn't this a bait post for some commercial content? Just asking.
  • #10
  • Feb 22, 2020 4:23am Feb 22, 2020 4:23am
Quoting genghistar
{quote} First I dont know if you are a new FF member or a rehashed one. Second you claimed to have complete trading method for all assets and you missed out on many successful set ups and different assets. Any evidence that you are even successful on just one? You are prepared to teach yr method but it will take abt 5.5months to master it. How did you arrive to 5.5 months when imparting yr knowledge? I thought the theme of this thread is pros and cons of a team and not abt you teaching. Waiting to hear from you...
First, I am simply a new member...

Second why the f*ck would I waste my time with this thread if I did not have a genuine profitable method, if you don't believe me, then think about the logic in theory? hence the thread is named Team trading pros and cons.

I can only teach my method, but it will take a minimum of probably 5-6 months, because I can't share my system, since there is no one-size fits all system, hence I mentioned it as a method, And I estimate it would take people 5-6 months to build their system around the method, obviously they will not master it by then... That will take years, of learning and optimising.

Never said it was on all assets, because it isn't, it works best on more liquid assets, hence I trade forex, but it can be used on many different assets..
  • #11
  • Feb 22, 2020 4:24am Feb 22, 2020 4:24am
Quoting landorra
{quote} Agreed. Isn't this a bait post for some commercial content? Just asking.
What do you mean by "bait for some commercial content"? Please explain.
  • #12
  • Feb 22, 2020 4:57am Feb 22, 2020 4:57am
Quoting W1llbam
{quote} First, I am simply a new member... Second why the f*ck would I waste my time with this thread if I did not have a genuine profitable method, if you don't believe me, then think about the logic in theory? hence the thread is named Team trading pros and cons. I can only teach my method, but it will take a minimum of probably 5-6 months, because I can't share my system, since there is no one-size fits all system, hence I mentioned it as a method, And I estimate it would take people 5-6 months to build their system around the method, obviously...
Why the f word and the emotion?
I dont see any logic in your posting here and wasting time if one has a genuine profitable trading method. I bet for sure u cannot provide any evidence on your 'GENUINE PROFITABLE METHOD'. Perhaps u can prove me wrong. Or you can describe your trading method in 5 simple genuine steps.

Pls dont put me on ignore like most charlatans did when questioned.
  • #13
  • Feb 22, 2020 5:15am Feb 22, 2020 5:15am
Quoting genghistar
{quote} Why the f word and the emotion? I dont see any logic in your posting here and wasting time if one has a genuine profitable trading method. I bet for sure u cannot provide any evidence on your 'GENUINE PROFITABLE METHOD'. Perhaps u can prove me wrong. Or you can describe your trading method in 5 simple genuine steps. Pls dont put me on ignore like most charlatans did when questioned.
I'm simply just getting frustrated.
If I provide proof, you will simply call it a demo account, I can explain it in 5 simple steps.

The method I use is based on a unique market theory, that there are significant levels in price, and my entire system is based around, how I can consistently find these significant levels, then you need all the psychology, risk management and the skill of using the tools to make it work. Which take time, I don't mind if you don't believe me or if you're skeptical - you should be, because there are so many fake traders out here it's incredible.

You see no logic in my posting? Should be pretty easy to get, to discuss the pros and cons of a trading team, and then if there are people on this thread that are interested in building some kind of team, they can contact each other.

You should keep in mind the point of this thread is not to discuss whether or not I have a profitable method.. It's to discuss the pros and cons of a trading team, also if people have any experiences about the topic, or any ideas or thoughts.
  • #14
  • Feb 22, 2020 5:47am Feb 22, 2020 5:47am
Quoting W1llbam
{quote} I'm simply just getting frustrated. If I provide proof, you will simply call it a demo account, I can explain it in 5 simple steps. The method I use is based on a unique market theory, that there are significant levels in price, and my entire system is based around, how I can consistently find these significant levels, then you need all the psychology, risk management and the skill of using the tools to make it work. Which take time, I don't mind if you don't believe me or if you're skeptical - you should be, because there are so many fake...
Exactly that's why I question when you mentioned yr genuine profitable method and yr teaching proposal.
Anyway your simplified explanation of yr genuine profitable method is all too common and doesn't amount to anything but verbal diatribe.
You should describe your rr factor, sl and entry/exit rules and execution will be more substantive and credible.
If I find you credible I would not only join yr team but can provide you with free trading capital.
Reds
GS
  • #15
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:15am Feb 22, 2020 8:15am
Quoting genghistar
{quote} Exactly that's why I question when you mentioned yr genuine profitable method and yr teaching proposal. Anyway your simplified explanation of yr genuine profitable method is all too common and doesn't amount to anything but verbal diatribe. You should describe your rr factor, sl and entry/exit rules and execution will be more substantive and credible. If I find you credible I would not only join yr team but can provide you with free trading capital. Reds GS
You wanted me to keep it simple? My system has 60+ pages of every single thing about it, and the logic behind everything, and the tests done.
For me to enter a trade I look for a double confirmation, between two of all the different single confirmations in my system. And I adjust position size depending on how strong they are to maximize profits. I am not out here to give out my system, or my method at this point, since it would take too long and not worth my time.

You also must remember trading is a skill, so just because I give you my entry criteria, or trade management techniques, or exit criteria, won't make you able to trade my method profitably.

Cheers for the offering of capital, but I will kindly reject.

The purpose of this thread is not to discuss my trading method, but if you guys have any thoughts of any variation of a trading team, for example have any of you guys watching this post thought about, or been a part of some kind of a trading team, now I know discussing technical analysis inside a trading team is useless because we all have different views on the market. But feel free to share your thoughts possibly on a team of traders with different skill-sets One guy can to TA, another guy can do FA & SA, and split tasks between the people in the group?
  • #16
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:22am Feb 22, 2020 8:22am
The whole point of having a "team" or a prop with multiple traders is to diversify. No two traders should be taking the same positions most of the time because it is redundant. If you allocate capital to 10 different people the point is to limit risk. The point is that if 1 person loses all 10 will not also lose. If your going to have a team of traders taking the same trades then it is really pointless because why not just trade on your own and up the risk? That is essentially what you are doing anyway.

A team is only good if you use it to diversify or trade different markets. For example team 1 has 3 traders that only trade forex pairs and try and trade different pairs. Team 2 has 3 traders that only trade commodities/metals. Team 3 has another 3 traders that only trade indexes or crypto etc. And 1 guy manages them all.

10 people, possibly using the same strategy/long term outlook. But taking different trades so the risk is spread out evenly. That's basically what a prop firm is and how it works.
  • #17
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:30am Feb 22, 2020 8:30am
Quoting viptrading
The whole point of having a "team" or a prop with multiple traders is to diversify. No two traders should be taking the same positions most of the time because it is redundant. If you allocate capital to 10 different people the point is to limit risk. The point is that if 1 person loses all 10 will not also lose. If your going to have a team of traders taking the same trades then it is really pointless because why not just trade on your own and up the risk? That is essentially what you are doing anyway. A team is only good if you use it to diversify...
I agree - I would never start a team just to take the same trades, also I am not intending for people to use the same strategy, (theoretically speaking) I would possibly teach them the method I use, and then they would build their own system, and a strategy is then part of that system.
It is something I might do in the future, but by then I will probably start a hedge fund, that is my goal anyways, but then I would also need some traders doing fundamental analysis, since arguably that is more objective, and every technical trader can use that to their advantage.
  • #18
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:38am Feb 22, 2020 8:38am
Teams are a bad idea... Everybody see's the market a little different. (even the experts disagree) Trading has to be individual. You must rely on your own trades from your own brain to judge how well your doing. If you rely on outside forces to make a trade, they you have no idea where you stand as a trader.

1. You must always plan your own trades and be 100% accountable.
2, rate the success and failures.
3. then work on solutions to any problems
4. Go back to step 1.
keep doing 1-4 until your successful

Otherwise you might as well just put your money in a hedge fund.
You won't learn a darn thing about your trading ability from from other peoples signals.
There is no one setup that works 100 of the time. Otherwise you could just program a computer to do it
You can't use municipal people to be your human computer algo.
The only system that will work is one designed by and for yourself.
  • #19
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:48am Feb 22, 2020 8:48am
Quoting W1llbam
{quote} I agree - I would never start a team just to take the same trades, also I am not intending for people to use the same strategy, (theoretically speaking) I would possibly teach them the method I use, and then they would build their own system, and a strategy is then part of that system. It is something I might do in the future, but by then I will probably start a hedge fund, that is my goal anyways, but then I would also need some traders doing fundamental analysis, since arguably that is more objective, and every technical trader can use...
If your method is proven to be profitable you do not need a team. Make your first million on your own, start with managing family and friends money if you really believe in yourself.

Then if you really want to grow and have your own fund, look to hire traders and teach them or look for partners who trade different strategies to diversify your results and lower your exposure.
  • #20
  • Feb 22, 2020 8:53am Feb 22, 2020 8:53am
Quoting bloodpoodle
Teams are a bad idea... Everybody see's the market a little different. (even the experts disagree) Trading has to be individual. You must rely on your own trades from your own brain to judge how well your doing. If you rely on outside forces to make a trade, they you have no idea where you stand as a trader. 1. You must always plan your own trades and be 100% accountable. 2, rate the success and failures. 3. then work on solutions to any problems 4. Go back to step 1. keep doing 1-4 until your successful Otherwise you might as well just put your...
Hey pal - Good post, but I've already addressed all of your points in this thread, no one in the imaginary team that we're discussing would rely on each other so to speak, we would all be profitable traders, if you applied the method I use, and build your own system & strategy around it, you would be able to find profitable trades, on different time frames and assets, but there are only so many trades one person can take. I see why it is a bad idea at this point, and you would need to make it more professional to be worth it as Viptrading mentioned.
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