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Trading with no stop loss

  • #1
  • First Post: Jul 18, 2019 6:37pm Jul 18, 2019 6:37pm
I've invented a new system: it's called JJNSLS

There is only one rule. You must trade WITHOUT a stop loss.

The goal is to trade in or out of any position, so consider it a randomized trade.

You must take one trade and manage without bias or technical witchcraft.

If you only grow bananas then what can you do? You see?

This is the art of the master trader.

Good luck.
grist for the mill
  • #2
  • Jul 18, 2019 7:31pm Jul 18, 2019 7:31pm
I can't wait to see the next post in this thread.LOL
  • #3
  • Jul 19, 2019 3:59am Jul 19, 2019 3:59am
Oh man, what a great thread! What a timing, just before the weekend. Im gonna sit back and see this happening. Get it on!
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  • #4
  • Jul 19, 2019 5:15am Jul 19, 2019 5:15am
Quoting JackJones
I've invented a new system: it's called JJNSLS There is only one rule. You must trade WITHOUT a stop loss. The goal is to trade in or out of any position, so consider it a randomized trade. You must take one trade and manage without bias or technical witchcraft. If you only grow bananas then what can you do? You see? This is the art of the master trader. Good luck.

It sounds more like art of a gambler. And the answer of your question is BANANAS. Just don't get what is that to do with trading?
  • #5
  • Edited 7:16am Jul 19, 2019 6:16am | Edited 7:16am
Anyone here not using stop losses? ME!

Seems like we have users of the stop loss here.

I only close when the totality of all humanity has culminated into one point within my being.

Therefore it is not a rule - It is human essence manifest.

There is no rhyme or reason to it, it just is.
grist for the mill
  • #6
  • Jul 20, 2019 4:11am Jul 20, 2019 4:11am
There are two trading tactics at play here and you're conflating them and I don't yet see why.

Firstly the random entry. People have tried this before - open a position on random timing and toss a coin as to whether its long or short. Then manage the position from there until it makes a profit. It has actually been found to work tolerably well in mean-reverting markets if you're good at money management and you're prepared to add to the position as gains increase and you can fund a long and massive drawdown. The downsides are that your trading capital and its margin is tied up for an undefinable period and you can't extrapolate the return on investment, meaning you can't gauge one opportunity against another so as to take the best. In any case, some mean-reverting markets just stop being mean-reverting. Its like buying a painting from a starving undiscovered young artist.

Secondly, no stop-loss. You do not have to abandon SL's in order to run random entry trades. In fact, a random entry trade calls for extremely tight money and risk management, which is kind of the opposite of having no SL. Having no SL can do no harm in many trades but eventually a position goes the wrong way for ever and that's the end of your trading career.

Combining the two tactics gives a potential upside of eventual minor profit and potential downside of eventual guaranteed total wipe-out. Seems a bit lopsided.
  • #7
  • Jul 20, 2019 10:46pm Jul 20, 2019 10:46pm
I guess it's possible provided that there's no news event for the day. Or enter the trade after the news is released.

What's the exit parameter though? PAIN? haha.
Monkey See, Monkey Do
  • #8
  • Jul 20, 2019 11:32pm Jul 20, 2019 11:32pm
What a time to be alive..
Always ontop
  • #9
  • Jul 21, 2019 2:07am Jul 21, 2019 2:07am
I used to trade like this when i was a kid
  • #10
  • Jul 21, 2019 1:05pm Jul 21, 2019 1:05pm
I trade with NO SL for fun first and to get volume rebates..

I'm making money this way.. but I use actual strategies, it's not just about rebates
  • #11
  • Edited 5:26pm Jul 21, 2019 5:11pm | Edited 5:26pm
Quoting tomorton
There are two trading tactics at play here and you're conflating them and I don't yet see why.
you assume that conflation is a bad thing, yet never say why. i could say everything is just a conflation and yet what does that mean? I never said i was the first person to invent the no stop loss trade, yet apparently i am - once you remove the warmth of the stop loss then you are open to the true forces of the market - the true trader will have to learn how to weather the storms, the up and downs, until they are finally at a point, a culmination of all inputs which will then give closure.
grist for the mill
  • #12
  • Jul 21, 2019 6:43pm Jul 21, 2019 6:43pm
No-stop-loss = margin call/blown account.
Prove me wrong JJ.
Show some of your ongoing "no-stop-loss" trades.
Freedom is not free
  • #13
  • Jul 21, 2019 10:03pm Jul 21, 2019 10:03pm
Quoting Abe16
No-stop-loss = margin call/blown account. Prove me wrong JJ. Show some of your ongoing "no-stop-loss" trades.
you need to allow for a black swan. i've survived 500 pip swings against me twice this year only to end up in the money; mean reversion is your friend.
grist for the mill
  • #14
  • Jul 22, 2019 6:05am Jul 22, 2019 6:05am
Quoting JackJones
{quote} you need to allow for a black swan. i've survived 500 pip swings against me twice this year only to end up in the money; mean reversion is your friend.
Proof is in the pudding. Let's see the charts.
Freedom is not free
  • #15
  • Jul 22, 2019 6:30am Jul 22, 2019 6:30am
Quoting Abe16
No-stop-loss = margin call/blown account. Prove me wrong JJ. Show some of your ongoing "no-stop-loss" trades.
You are right! There no way without SL in general! But we traders need to the SL tool smartly!
  • #16
  • Jul 22, 2019 6:31am Jul 22, 2019 6:31am
Quoting NeilWagner
{quote} You are right! There no way without SL in general! But we traders need to the SL tool smartly!
You can

just don't use leverage, or cut manually
COT: The precious data ignored
  • #17
  • Jul 22, 2019 9:27pm Jul 22, 2019 9:27pm
Quoting JackJones
I've invented a new system: it's called JJNSLS There is only one rule. You must trade WITHOUT a stop loss. The goal is to trade in or out of any position, so consider it a randomized trade. You must take one trade and manage without bias or technical witchcraft. If you only grow bananas then what can you do? You see? This is the art of the master trader. Good luck.
I forgot stops two times last week. the first mistake cost me 50 pips, the second mistake cost me 100. So how do you deal with that?
  • #18
  • Jul 22, 2019 11:21pm Jul 22, 2019 11:21pm
Besides the particular "system"... I don't think trading without a SL is so stupid anymore nowadays, as long as you trade long term (and take a few other precautions).
The reason is the relatively frequent occurrence of flash crashes. The risk for severe damage by a real world event is by now smaller than from
flash crashes.
  • #19
  • Jul 23, 2019 1:53am Jul 23, 2019 1:53am
Quoting nonie12
{quote} I forgot stops two times last week. the first mistake cost me 50 pips, the second mistake cost me 100. So how do you deal with that?
Ask JackJones above.
  • #20
  • Jul 23, 2019 3:49am Jul 23, 2019 3:49am
it shouldn't 'cost' you anything.

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possibilities: just like insures, sometimes you take a hit. if it sends you bust then you need to work on your business model.
grist for the mill
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