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Retail Brokers and "Trading Educators"

  • #21
  • Edited 7:59am Jul 6, 2018 7:06am | Edited 7:59am
It is $3k per year. Or 1.5k for one month access. For anyone who is interested.

I'll possibly take this in the future once I make more money soon. The big thing I always don't like about these courses is that they always have you try to network and commiserate with others, and most others in a course like this are on the same path and "lost" like the other attendees, so there is like no point. It is not like working with or finding and hanging out with a larger group of actual successful traders. *Not speaking about this one in specific, just what I've experienced in general. You are also technically investing in someone else's business and not yourself which is usually a BIG no-no... but for some the value could far exceed admittedly which makes this tricky.

It always feels like they want to make you feel cool, feel good, feel like you are paying for the credential for being an "actual trader" - this quote makes me think this program might be similar:
Quote
You get a certificate and you can apply if you want to work for the bank or any financial institution as a forex/stock trader. I took the forex course because i trade forex. To further see if this is legit, i did apply to couple institutions for forex trading because i also build my portfolio and i did get few interviews.
*Which is funny because Anton actually blasts Bloomberg for making people feel like a "professional elite trader" to sell data/subscriptions in one of his videos.


I'd take his course to in the future potentially make my own course for people who did not start as a bank trader but more of those who started with something technical and want to do it on the side. and my focus would be more of the MQL/C++/C/DMA stuff really. Some tips/tricks for how to manage it all. I'd run this course to find my "blind spots". hehe.
  • #22
  • Jul 6, 2018 7:12am Jul 6, 2018 7:12am
Quoting Techanalyst
{quote} Everything was written clear. No you are wrong. He does not teach basic stuff and it cannot be found on the internet. It is not 8k for the course. You should go and see his website for yourself. Don't talk nonsense. You need at least $15,000 minimum to start trading at least forex full time. You can hold any position at any time it just depends how far you place your stop loss and what is the risk management. I do know how to write and read. You don't have to read it, i said what i know and that is that. You don't want to read...
The 15k minimum is a generalization. Anton says in several of his videos to not do this/not force your views into the markets/etc.

You could technically start with 100 or a few hundred, just stick to 10:1 to 5:1 leverage max, work part time or full time at something else, and just add money as opportunity presents itself. The most active seems anyway when post news there is a lot of volatility, and that is usually early morning before most other jobs. So you technically don't even need to be "full time" - I suppose if you say start to watch many different FX markets, keeping up with all the news flow would keep you more full time, but still. The actual "action" done in a week seems to be small for what you/we get, at least in my experiences.

But yeah, why would you need 15k to start? Once you are better, that is a sweet amount to have because you can start to make some serious $ with it, but...
  • #23
  • Jul 6, 2018 9:55am Jul 6, 2018 9:55am
Quoting skillz16
{quote} The 15k minimum is a generalization. Anton says in several of his videos to not do this/not force your views into the markets/etc. You could technically start with 100 or a few hundred, just stick to 10:1 to 5:1 leverage max, work part time or full time at something else, and just add money as opportunity presents itself. The most active seems anyway when post news there is a lot of volatility, and that is usually early morning before most other jobs. So you technically don't even need to be "full time" - I suppose if you say start to watch...
That is what I mean. If you want to start trading full time forex or any equities you should start with about $15,000 to make money. Of course everyone will have some losses but at the end of every month if you are in profit, you are good to go. Couple years back when I was starting, i lost couple thousands dollars but i have learned my lesson. I deposited $5,000 to start and have not blown my account since. I was still working full time while trading. Once I turn that $5,000 into more money i was ready to trade full time. I still trade full time and it is going very good. I took Anton course because i want it to learn to approach trading professionally. Like i said from my experience it was worth every dollar taking his course. It changes your view of the markets totally. Not only do i trade, i invest and it does pay off at the end. As for the news, you don't have to watch all the news, you can pick the most important one's and stick to those analysis.
  • #24
  • Jul 6, 2018 9:56am Jul 6, 2018 9:56am
Nothing really useful in trading is for sale.

Ever.

It's been that way since time immemorial, it isn't going to change. So you've got to decide if you're going to do the hard yards to discover what's useful or opt for the suckers path to pay your way to a pot of gold that doesn't exist.
  • #25
  • Jul 6, 2018 9:58am Jul 6, 2018 9:58am
Quoting skillz16
It is $3k per year. Or 1.5k for one month access. For anyone who is interested. I'll possibly take this in the future once I make more money soon. The big thing I always don't like about these courses is that they always have you try to network and commiserate with others, and most others in a course like this are on the same path and "lost" like the other attendees, so there is like no point. It is not like working with or finding and hanging out with a larger group of actual successful traders. *Not speaking about this one in specific,...
When you are ready and willing go for it. IF you want to teach others and your strategy is profitable I say go for it. You can do it. All the best.
  • #26
  • Jul 6, 2018 10:22am Jul 6, 2018 10:22am
Quoting triphop
Nothing really useful in trading is for sale. Ever. It's been that way since time immemorial, it isn't going to change. So you've got to decide if you're going to do the hard yards to discover what's useful or opt for the suckers path to pay your way to a pot of gold that doesn't exist.
Agreed. I do think you can pay to help equip yourself with the right tools and mindset though. So some of his program is good, the question is just at what cost?

but yeah, I agree since I REALLY feel like becoming successful in this more than anything is personal and a deeply personal process. It is like saying to someone else, "I would like to be successful.." Yeah, well we can give you tools and training, but you will need to follow your own path.
  • #27
  • Jul 6, 2018 11:15am Jul 6, 2018 11:15am
Quoting skillz16
{quote} Agreed. I do think you can pay to help equip yourself with the right tools and mindset though. So some of his program is good, the question is just at what cost? but yeah, I agree since I REALLY feel like becoming successful in this more than anything is personal and a deeply personal process. It is like saying to someone else, "I would like to be successful.." Yeah, well we can give you tools and training, but you will need to follow your own path.
I saw him laughing with his lackeys at retail mugs at a conference years ago, and then sat through the biggest pile of BS as he hooked in the desperate to flog his courses.

Early doors most of us can fall for this kind of thing. Now I can run rings around him but that’s a decade of experience later.

It’s not my circus, not my monkeys so if you want to then go for it. I can guarantee however the basics you need you can find in a couple of books, and the info you’ll need to build on it wont be given.
  • #28
  • Jul 6, 2018 7:25pm Jul 6, 2018 7:25pm
Quoting triphop
{quote} I saw him laughing with his lackeys at retail mugs at a conference years ago, and then sat through the biggest pile of BS as he hooked in the desperate to flog his courses. Early doors most of us can fall for this kind of thing. Now I can run rings around him but that’s a decade of experience later. It’s not my circus, not my monkeys so if you want to then go for it. I can guarantee however the basics you need you can find in a couple of books, and the info you’ll need to build on it wont be given.
Wait so triphop, when you went to one of his seminars, how many people were there? I'm wondering what the pull of him and those 4 other people he usually brings along for seminars is. I'm trying to ballpark it. the pull per seminar and work that up to a per year number.

I see their institute has 100 traders, but not sure that is where the money comes from. Haha.

He spoke with two potential traders in one of his videos I posted, I would bet those guys had it going though without or before the program. Their numbers were really good if the discussion was real... But who knows right?
Could have been planted in the video?
  • #29
  • Jul 8, 2018 6:03am Jul 8, 2018 6:03am
Traders who lose money have only themselves to blame, most traders are incompetent at this job. They're not stupid, they just under-research what they need to do, they under-estimate the difficulties and they fail to plan for these. As a consequence, they mostly get wiped out in a very short space of time.
  • #30
  • Edited 7:22am Jul 8, 2018 7:12am | Edited 7:22am
Quoting tomorton
Traders who lose money have only themselves to blame, most traders are incompetent at this job. They're not stupid, they just under-research what they need to do, they under-estimate the difficulties and they fail to plan for these. As a consequence, they mostly get wiped out in a very short space of time.

I agree

But the lies in the industry and forums.

This gets noobs.

Like here,we got threads a decade old.still active,Traders claiming to make 3 percent per day.Who are fake. As the videos says we got brokers pretending (to be retail traders) to post claiming to make lots of pips.

These forums are a huge marketing tool for the brokers.

If a new trader see this,he going to believe this

Its criminal. Its hard to blame new traders,as its a form of brain washing that the market can be beat at retail level.

A profitable 3 year record has never been proven or shown at retail level. Ever. No studies, This says it all. Just talk and fantasy.

I have a friend who works at IG here in England,he says its just like William hill
  • #31
  • Jul 8, 2018 9:55am Jul 8, 2018 9:55am
Quoting goose4
{quote} I agree But the lies in the industry and forums. This gets noobs. Like here,we got threads a decade old.still active,Traders claiming to make 3 percent per day.Who are fake. As the videos says we got brokers pretending (to be retail traders) to post claiming to make lots of pips. These forums are a huge marketing tool for the brokers. If a new trader see this,he going to believe this Its criminal. Its hard to blame new traders,as its a form of brain washing that the market can be beat at retail level. A profitable 3 year record has never...

But if you own a calculator it will be immediately obvious that 3% per day means you would be a multi-millionaire within 1 year by simply starting trading with 10k and not making any cash withdrawals. If anyone believes it is that easy, this makes them skip the research and just pile money in. In business terms, this is the mark of an incompetent investor.
  • #32
  • Jul 8, 2018 10:54am Jul 8, 2018 10:54am
Quoting skillz16
{quote} Wait so triphop, when you went to one of his seminars, how many people were there? I'm wondering what the pull of him and those 4 other people he usually brings along for seminars is. I'm trying to ballpark it. the pull per seminar and work that up to a per year number. I see their institute has 100 traders, but not sure that is where the money comes from. Haha. He spoke with two potential traders in one of his videos I posted, I would bet those guys had it going though without or before the program. Their numbers were really good...
It was one of those expos, so his crew were just one of a load of people talking throughout the day. He had the main stage, and it was huge- maybe a thousand?

To anyone thinking well it serves 'em right, do your research etc etc - well, the guy next to me, low-paid job, father of 3, knows nothing at all about FX and tells me he's thinking of investing his life savings. Before I get a chance to tell him don't even think about it, Kriel's up on stage telling the world all you need is some emotional discipline and a bollinger band. He's a former bank trader from GS - I've heard of GS says guy next to me excitedly. Kriel then live trades and switches screens so fast it's impossible to see what's going on and makes himself out to be a trading guru. How's this fella supposed to know any different?

Now Kriel's supposedly had a Damascene conversion and is warning the world of the kind of guy I saw on stage seven years ago.

Maybe he's changed his course from absolute bullshit to complete gold - I won't be looking to find out but right there, right then all I could think of was what a fucked up way to make a living.
  • #33
  • Jul 8, 2018 11:27am Jul 8, 2018 11:27am
Quoting triphop
{quote} It was one of those expos, so his crew were just one of a load of people talking throughout the day. He had the main stage, and it was huge- maybe a thousand? To anyone thinking well it serves 'em right, do your research etc etc - well, the guy next to me, low-paid job, father of 3, knows nothing at all about FX and tells me he's thinking of investing his life savings. Before I get a chance to tell him don't even think about it, Kriel's up on stage telling the world all you need is some emotional discipline and a bollinger band. He's a former...
The father of 3 that was sitting beside you should do much more research before investing. He should know that you should only invest the money that you can afford to lose in case that happens. No one should invest their life savings into trading that is obvious. You say that his course is BS.. how would you know if you never took that course? You don't know so you just assume because you are pissed off that you are still not profitable in trading forex? You are saying that Anton is full of it but you still went to see him live. That means you were looking for something that was missing in your trading strategy and you went to see if you can find a quick fix for trading. No such a thing. You were curious and you went to see Anton and his mentors live. There is a reason why he goes around and gives the lessons not only to expos, him and his mentors are going to colleges and universities. They are doing something right. If they didn't, they would not be invited to Colleges and Universities. Either way, like i said, i took the course and it works for me. Maybe it would not work for your trading strategy. The course that i took from his academy, for me i look at it as more investment into my trading and another good tool for my trading strategy.
  • #34
  • Jul 8, 2018 12:43pm Jul 8, 2018 12:43pm
Becarefull of education coming from Brokers. Indeed, it depends all if it's a A BOOK broker (means the broker send all your trades, really, to the market), a B-BOOK broker or an hybrid ones (the majority of them are Hybrid).

If they are playing in B-BOOK . Means that it's only a CASINO for you, are playing against them because your live account is no more than a 'demo account' - then the sales team of the broker will learn you to play bad. For example pushing you to play the news and/or to be a scalper. (yes)

For other broker - pure A's ones - education could be a way for them to retain you. You need to know that a client cost 1'000 USD for the majority of the brokers then if they can keep you playing during more than 6 months , it's good.

If they are "hybrid" , it means that some of your trades will be sent to the Market and other no, becarefull too about their advice....
  • #35
  • Jul 8, 2018 12:48pm Jul 8, 2018 12:48pm
Quoting Techanalyst
{quote} The father of 3 that was sitting beside you should do much more research before investing. He should know that you should only invest the money that you can afford to lose in case that happens. No one should invest their life savings into trading that is obvious. You say that his course is BS.. how would you know if you never took that course? You don't know so you just assume because you are pissed off that you are still not profitable in trading forex? You are saying that Anton is full of it but you still went to see him live. That means...
Good for you mate, good for you, and may your trading soar and your investment be worthwhile.

I've been full time for several years mate so whatever floats your boat. When I saw the guy, he was a total BS artist. If I can tear holes in a pitch, I don't need to invest in the business.

Maybe he's changed. Maybe you've got enormous value out of it. Then great. What I can tell you is the way he behaved was disgraceful that day, and the guy next to me? Clueless maybe, but he can hold his head high even if his bank account might look ropey.
  • #36
  • Jul 10, 2018 9:12pm Jul 10, 2018 9:12pm
Any 'trading course' should be taken with a grain of salt. Even if the course is good. These guys sell dreams and whilst I'm sure they have disclaimers somewhere in small print, they should be up front to stop uninformed people pouring their life savings into something. But of course "listen to this course attentively and if you practice and work at it daily for 6-12 months there is a chance you will become consistently profitable" doesn't sell too well...

The survival rate of traders who trade for a professional firm is about 5-10% from my observation over 5 years, that is, full-time traders who have undergone proprietary training (at no cost as the purpose is to train them to trade for the firm).
  • #37
  • Jul 11, 2018 5:34am Jul 11, 2018 5:34am
These so callled "Trading Educators" are nothing but charlatans...

The real concept of education is learning math. and coding.
  • #38
  • Jul 11, 2018 5:35am Jul 11, 2018 5:35am
It is very difficult to make a distinction between all the training offers!

I had pursued 3 courses, one for 1 year and two others for one month.

From my own experience: beginners think that a course will give them a shortcut to be profitable. I am convinced, that only know-how, sticking to one strategy + experience + perseverance are the ingredients to be successful.

One has to be aware that it can take years to become regularly profitable.

Anton Kreil and his associates were trained in a finance institution, haved at least a mentor and has big capitals to trade.

Are their strategy still profitable for retail traders?
  • #39
  • Aug 16, 2018 2:54pm Aug 16, 2018 2:54pm
Quoting fxprimate
{quote} Hey goose4 That's how this sh*t works ... fake educators want your money, brokers want your money, banks want your money, big guys want your money, traders want your money, some fake traders want your money (like those you mention in the forum) and at the moment we have another one rising letīs call him HF, and even anton Kreil want your money ..
EA sellers, indicator sellers, failed traders who write books, system sellers, coders, signal providers, seminar sellers, trading psychologists, back testing software sellers, data sellers, tax man , scammers , idiots, fraudsters and forex bucket shops all want your money.

Have I missed any you?Please post and state the charlatans I missed out.The fake traders.
  • #40
  • Edited Aug 17, 2018 7:19am Aug 16, 2018 3:01pm | Edited Aug 17, 2018 7:19am
Quoting triphop
Nothing really useful in trading is for sale. .

My 12 inches is for sale , it contains the secret of profitable EAS, I keep the 12 inches between the ears in my backside, that is for sale.




It is in the left pocket with the usb stick with 75 EAS.
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