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The Rabbit Hole

  • #10,981
  • Oct 29, 2017 1:47pm Oct 29, 2017 1:47pm
Quoting Stu Effex
{quote} So are you saying "All Roads Don't Lead To Rome, They Lead To Israel" ?
I couldn't possibly comment
In detegere possumus omnes mortui sunt
  • #10,982
  • Oct 29, 2017 1:55pm Oct 29, 2017 1:55pm
Quoting Stu Effex
{quote} I think there is some reverse psychology going on there. They have had sufficient time they could have just adhered to all that Brexit actually means, instead we've had all the hard and soft bollox which has wasted months and yes they will vote on it and we know any so called deal will cost us in the shorts. It's been a scam start to finish from allowing us the vote to all the bollox since, utter tosh the lot of it. If she meant no deal is better than a bad deal she should have walked long ago and said no need to get round the table we don't...
I really do believe we have a plan and the plan is working perfectly.
We are supposed to have completed the first stage of negotiations by December - not gonna happen, as we planned.
And we don't actually need to go to parliament anyway - If I recall triggering article 50 started the process which means that after 2 yrs we are out no ifs or buts. And we don't need parliament to vote on a deal if there is no deal.

I could be wrong of course but I don't think so.

now Britain is not sure it needs a trade deal whatsoever.

https://sputniknews.com/business/201710291058643864-uk-conservatives-no-deal-brexit-eu/
In detegere possumus omnes mortui sunt
  • #10,983
  • Oct 29, 2017 2:30pm Oct 29, 2017 2:30pm
Quoting Gamod
{quote} I really do believe we have a plan and the plan is working perfectly. We are supposed to have completed the first stage of negotiations by December - not gonna happen, as we planned. And we don't actually need to go to parliament anyway - If I recall triggering article 50 started the process which means that after 2 yrs we are out no ifs or buts. And we don't need parliament to vote on a deal if there is no deal. I could be wrong of course but I don't think so. now Britain is not sure it needs a trade deal whatsoever. https://sputniknews.com/business/201710291058643864-uk-conservatives-no-deal-brexit-eu/...
Yes of course you could be wrong and so could I, we both might be wrong. I see no deal as a result. British exit = clean break, no EU laws, No joint forces EU ARMY, No Free movement of people, No customs union. If this is the end result I will be very surprised and would be happy to eat my hat. All this aside we still need to look at the ongoing potential for further damage leading up to Mar 2019 which is the earliest estimate providing no bullshit transition period. So from now until MAR 2019 what will continue to happen ? Think long ago we established that the numbers would be significant enough by as early as 2025. So once the minority become the majority what will they do anyway ? They certainly won't be Turkey's voting for christmas like we have allowed to happen. So it is all bollox and we are doomed unless we get the gloves on and have a scrap.
Once You See, You Can't Unsee But You Will Get The Odd Poke In The Eye
  • #10,984
  • Oct 29, 2017 3:05pm Oct 29, 2017 3:05pm
Quoting DrManhatten
{quote} Ho was a commie bastard. He deserves zero credit. Fighting for "independence" so he could further enslave the people. What a laugh. “Ho was a commie bastard. He deserves zero credit.” Definition of bastard is a son born without a father, therefore adding bastard in the use of a hegemonic term to “Commie” is incorrect. While we can agree that communism is something to detest as well as loath, Ho Chi Minh was a living breathing human being who had parents just like you and me, and while we can disagree with his ideologies stating he deserves...
This tells me quite a bit about you by how you go out of the way to defend someone such as Ho Chi Minh.
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #10,985
  • Edited 7:10pm Oct 29, 2017 6:51pm | Edited 7:10pm
Well what do you know. The rabbit hole runs deep.
http://www.historynet.com/ho-chi-minh-and-the-oss.htm
  • #10,986
  • Oct 29, 2017 7:43pm Oct 29, 2017 7:43pm
Quoting spzd
{quote} This tells me quite a bit about you by how you go out of the way to defend someone such as Ho Chi Minh.
I am not defending him, I am simply pointing out observations based on human perspective in a historical context that is not based an emotions. Why is this hard for you to understand or accept? You do much to invalidate anything I have said at this point without offering a cogent perspective of your own. Did you serve in Vietnam or are in some way personally affected by this terrible war? If so, then I apologize for having engaged in what I thought was having a constructive dialogue with you. If you were conflicted with my views on the topic then maybe you should have reconsidered responding to my post in the first place. Anyway peace!
  • #10,987
  • Oct 29, 2017 7:44pm Oct 29, 2017 7:44pm
Quoting AlexC
Well what do you know. The rabbit hole runs deep. http://www.historynet.com/ho-chi-minh-and-the-oss.htm

That is a good read! There is always more to the story then people care to know about.
  • #10,988
  • Edited Oct 30, 2017 12:31am Oct 29, 2017 8:16pm | Edited Oct 30, 2017 12:31am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Older historians are one of the worst posters for complexity! Okay, where to start. First, congrats on knowing the Vietnam before Vietnam. Show you read a lot. A whole lot. We could not abandon France for obvious reasons. The political blowback would have been too much once it got out. Remember parts of Europe are still rebuilding and the Soviet menace was afoot. I assume that you are aware of the Civil Affairs branch of the Army. That's the hearts and minds MOS. The way it should work is that AFTER we have done what we came to do, THEN...

You have an interesting perspective on this whole thing and I agree. I got interested on this subject matter a few years ago, and until recently I began research for a project that I am considering pursuing. For me currently what interests me most is the motive behind decisions. The sequence of events that lead up to Kennedy's Administration and the sequence of events following his untimely murder were and are still very curious to me. The Vietnam war itself is a pivotal aspect in connecting some dots that might put together part of a broken narrative. Sort of like taping together pieces of paper that were found in the trash bin that has been shredded in order to discard classified information. Ironically I will be visiting Vietnam in December so it should be an interesting experience for me.

Germany, and the WWII itself is something we are still learning about to this day. I can't imagine flying back to base and having to tell your commanding officer that there are no more targets left to bomb. Crazy to think about that image. I have sympathy for the German people following the fall of Berlin. 4 million German women repeatedly being raped by Russian soldiers and the Eisenhower Internment camps that has rarely ever been covered really says a lot about war itself and humanity that it blows my mind that Humans are so capable of that kind of savagery. Vietnam is still a haunting question, only because so much human life was expended and for what?

Anyway, I guess more on this topic a little later as I contemplate more on this subject matter.
  • #10,989
  • Edited 9:43pm Oct 29, 2017 8:23pm | Edited 9:43pm
[quote=jmn5611;10438738]{quote} There are no ballistics experts who can agree that a man with a bolt action rifle could get off the shots to take him out. That's why the conspiracy exists, this was state actors at the state level taking out a head of state. They would do better just admitting this and moving on. After the Shah of Iran and Pinochet, who will be surprised? {quote}


Totally agree. Like I said reasonable people can arrive at the same conclusions. Funny I was just thinking about Pinochet and the Nixon admin. Again exploring motives on a parallel track. Operation Ajax was another example where the US totally FK up a democratic nation, probably explains why Iran hates us to this day!

More on this a little later. Need to go to on radio silence for few days, currently moving to a different country, but I will share with you more on these topics at another time.

Cheers
  • #10,990
  • Oct 29, 2017 11:24pm Oct 29, 2017 11:24pm
https://youtu.be/qrRRhoS3KFk
  • #10,991
  • Oct 30, 2017 1:38am Oct 30, 2017 1:38am
Wow! Documents declassified.
https://youtu.be/t1GX1vSyc7E
  • #10,992
  • Oct 30, 2017 3:05am Oct 30, 2017 3:05am
A little chuckle for a Monday morning: my younger one thought "aperitif" was "a pair of teeth."
  • #10,993
  • Oct 30, 2017 6:23am Oct 30, 2017 6:23am
Do you remember I asked if anyone has tested the flat earth theory with a laser - well apparently they have and the results will surprise you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwCRej0BoA4
In detegere possumus omnes mortui sunt
  • #10,994
  • Oct 30, 2017 6:43am Oct 30, 2017 6:43am
Stu will like this one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEqDbsPUgH8
In detegere possumus omnes mortui sunt
  • #10,995
  • Oct 30, 2017 7:37am Oct 30, 2017 7:37am
Quoting Gamod
Stu will like this one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEqDbsPUgH8
Will watch both tonight
Once You See, You Can't Unsee But You Will Get The Odd Poke In The Eye
  • #10,996
  • Oct 30, 2017 12:23pm Oct 30, 2017 12:23pm


https://petition.parliament.uk/archived/petitions/168424
Once You See, You Can't Unsee But You Will Get The Odd Poke In The Eye
  • #10,997
  • Oct 30, 2017 12:58pm Oct 30, 2017 12:58pm
Quoting Stu Effex
https://petition.parliament.uk/archived/petitions/168424
  • #10,998
  • Oct 30, 2017 1:41pm Oct 30, 2017 1:41pm
https://youtu.be/0uJLc-LjhJA
Once You See, You Can't Unsee But You Will Get The Odd Poke In The Eye
  • #10,999
  • Oct 30, 2017 1:59pm Oct 30, 2017 1:59pm
Quoting DrManhatten
{quote} I am not defending him, I am simply pointing out observations based on human perspective in a historical context that is not based an emotions. Why is this hard for you to understand or accept? You do much to invalidate anything I have said at this point without offering a cogent perspective of your own. Did you serve in Vietnam or are in some way personally affected by this terrible war? If so, then I apologize for having engaged in what I thought was having a constructive dialogue with you. If you were conflicted with my views on the topic...
Nope. I just don't like commies and tend to not care too much for their apologists.

You do realize that Ho (Not his real name, but stolen from another. Same as the An Quoc (?) name which he claimed so to appear to be the author of numerous "nationalist" papers from early 1900s.) was a highly regarded member of the Comintern. Yeah, the group that went around the world enabling global conflict to bring in international communism. He lame use of the line from the US documents about all men created equal ... is a common in communists constitutions (Along with freedom of assembly and freedom of the press. All mere words to play with the minds of the easily swayed.) That he was responsible for the arrests or murders of most of the true nationalists leaders. That his land "reforms" after N Vietnam was created were responsible for the deaths of up to 1.2 million (As is common it is always difficult to pin down a number even close to correct.) That every "peace" accord and cease fire he signed he violated within 6 months of signature.

These are but a few of his "accomplishments". The man was nothing more than a run of the mill murdering communist.
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #11,000
  • Oct 30, 2017 2:25pm Oct 30, 2017 2:25pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLCIJZ-ysxQ
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