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The Rabbit Hole

  • #9,061
  • Sep 11, 2017 3:01am Sep 11, 2017 3:01am
Quoting jmn5611
In case the question comes up of whether are not there are two Israels, here is a follow up video, making the split very clear. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=me4FqdrmVBs
I watched both J and will have to think on this, I can never get my head around why any individual or group follow a particular path so fervently. Although what seems apparent is the Orthodox chaps are a mere thorn in the side and will not affect the business of Israel. So when we sweep all the religious squabbling internally to one side and revisit that original discussion why is it ok for the Zionists to want a Jewish only state and yet assist in the financing and maneuvering of other cultures into Western society ? There is clear hypocrisy there.
Once You See, You Can't Unsee But You Will Get The Odd Poke In The Eye
  • #9,062
  • Sep 11, 2017 3:43am Sep 11, 2017 3:43am
Quoting DrManhatten
{quote} The physical act yes, the political? It later became political, not only because of the moniker of "King of the Jews, but the most dangerous claim of all, which he claimed to be the "son of God", something both the Romans and the Jews considered Blasphemy and despised at the same time. Anyway, your interpretation is just one of many, and like the three headed monster that probably started out with one head, turned into three heads throughout the centuries of telling the same story only to make it more interesting or for that matter become...
Many of the Jews in Israel today see Jesus as an important figure and the leader of a movement, and not much more. I would agree that the Jewish leadership are culpable. Based on the stories however, the Jewish people had quite another idea, Jesus was there for the sheep of Israel at first. At least a lot of them did.

Quoting Stu Effex
{quote} I watched both J and will have to think on this, I can never get my head around why any individual or group follow a particular path so fervently. Although what seems apparent is the Orthodox chaps are a mere thorn in the side and will not affect the business of Israel. So when we sweep all the religious squabbling internally to one side and revisit that original discussion why is it ok for the Zionists to want a Jewish only state and yet assist in the financing and maneuvering of other cultures into Western society ? There is clear hypocrisy...
Indeed, but the why becomes a bit more clear in my view. Israel is a secular state, not a religious one.
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #9,063
  • Edited 4:03am Sep 11, 2017 3:46am | Edited 4:03am
Quoting Exodus
{quote} I do not believe that statement. We have no knowledge of all the previous civilisations that may have existed, how populous they were or what killed them off. The Aztecs are an example, except that 'we' know about them. If you examine Africa there are many examples of children who never make it as far as adulthood and who therefore do not reproduce. A typical couple may have 8 children, and of those 2 or 3 survive to be adults. In our western civilisation (an oxymoron) almost all children live to be adults, but that was not always the case....
Well there are plausible explanations for the Aztecs and the Mayans where drought was the logical cause. There are findings to support this claim such as the Anastazi and other indigenous tribes of America. Jared Diamonds two books "Guns. Germs, and Steel," and "Collapse" goes to great lengths backed with scientific methods of testing to prove this as being the most logical explanation. So yes you are right we do know about them.

The footprint that you mention is something I find on a personal level a very profound form of symbolism in so many ways. A point of discovery of answers to the past is inspiration to what effects it will have on understanding ourselves as a species and what can be derived from such studies. It's like putting yourself in Howard Carter's shoes when first discovering King Tukakamon's (Not sure of the correct spelling) tomb and opening it for the first time and shining a light to see what was inside. That footprint can tell so many stories is my greater point in all of this.
  • #9,064
  • Sep 11, 2017 4:02am Sep 11, 2017 4:02am
Quoting Mingary
{quote} This is a common misconception.; The opposite is true. Notwithstanding the fact that it's mathematically impossible (i.e more people alive today than the total of all who have ever lived before), the best scientific estimate shows that around 100 billion humans have died already. We are all living on top of a huge cemetery .. (:
Its called recycling: most of us are trying to avoid being recycled at the moment I personally am desperately trying to avoid it....
  • #9,065
  • Sep 11, 2017 4:04am Sep 11, 2017 4:04am
Quoting verv
Few things wind me up as much as this. This is wrong. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-41213534
here's some of the consequences of doctors/parents giving children hormones

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdO3oxDJ13s
  • #9,066
  • Edited 7:19am Sep 11, 2017 4:16am | Edited 7:19am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Many of the Jews in Israel today see Jesus as an important figure and the leader of a movement, and not much more. I would agree that the Jewish leadership are culpable. Based on the stories however, the Jewish people had quite another idea, Jesus was there for the sheep of Israel at first. At least a lot of them did. {quote} Indeed, but the why becomes a bit more clear in my view. Israel is a secular state, not a religious one.
Yes I agree. Then by most views the messiah is not Jesus, but in fact another form of another God? I was always confused about this aspect of the Jewish faith. In a broader sense when viewing christian tenets or it's liturgy this is where it seems to be conflicting, as most practicing Christians view Israel as the birth place of Jesus, or some would go so far as to say it is the cradle of civilization when in fact that distinction belongs to Bosera Iraq. Never really understood the commonality that Christians find to have with Judaism when both have differing interpretations and beliefs.
  • #9,067
  • Sep 11, 2017 4:35am Sep 11, 2017 4:35am
Quoting Exodus
{quote} I see we have quite a lot in common. However it appears to me, and I have a similar interest, that Capitalism is all about employing one's money to make more money ... and that is definitely materialistic.
I understand why you are saying that, and that depends in part on definitions. I would put it slightly differently, that Capitalism facilitates materialism, consumerism, investing but also philanthropy.

There is a paradox to not spending money and instead saving it, money in the bank buys you freedom and choices even though you might never actually spend a penny. To me that is invaluable.

There are different motivations for wanting money, some people are greedy, others like power, others like the freedom that comes with it. When I consider these I guess you are right, whilst freedom and choice is the main reason for me wanting money, I always want more so clearly I'm a bit greedy too, so I'm a bit more materialistic than I first realised
  • #9,068
  • Sep 11, 2017 4:38am Sep 11, 2017 4:38am
Quoting qp2
{quote} Its called recycling: most of us are trying to avoid being recycled at the moment I personally am desperately trying to avoid it....
Just curious .. How does it work ?
  • #9,069
  • Sep 11, 2017 7:43am Sep 11, 2017 7:43am
Quoting DrManhatten
{quote} Yes I agree. Then by most views the messiah is not Jesus, but in fact another form of another God? I was always confused about this aspect of the Jewish faith. In a broader sense when viewing christian tenets or it's liturgy this is where it seems to be conflicting, as most practicing Christians view Israel as the birth place of Jesus, or some would go so far as to say it is the cradle of civilization when in fact that distinction belongs to Bosera Iraq. Never really understood the commonality that Christians find to have with Judaism when...
Exactly. This is where Abrahamic religions fail. They don't have any commonality. This is why Jews for Jesus is an oxymoron. Same thing with Muslims for Jesus. They have Abraham as the father of these religions but that is it. Both Judaism and Islam reject Jesus as the son of God. Muslims say he was a prophet of Allah and Judaism won't even give him that. Personally I like the Eastern religions much better.

On the ancient Civs topic. Are you and Exodus up on the Megaliths around the world?
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #9,070
  • Sep 11, 2017 8:19am Sep 11, 2017 8:19am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Exactly. This is where Abrahamic religions fail. They don't have any commonality. This is why Jews for Jesus is an oxymoron. Same thing with Muslims for Jesus. They have Abraham as the father of these religions but that is it. Both Judaism and Islam reject Jesus as the son of God. Muslims say he was a prophet of Allah and Judaism won't even give him that. Personally I like the Eastern religions much better. On the ancient Civs topic. Are you and Exodus up on the Megaliths around the world?
No megaliths....

I've been to Stonehenge .... quite a while ago.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life! https://youtu.be/ttJBdr6eBuo
  • #9,071
  • Sep 11, 2017 8:23am Sep 11, 2017 8:23am
Quoting Mingary
{quote} Just curious .. How does it work ?
Soylent Green. People are Soylent Green.
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #9,072
  • Sep 11, 2017 9:31am Sep 11, 2017 9:31am
Quoting Exodus
{quote} No megaliths.... I've been to Stonehenge .... quite a while ago.
Long story short. There are structures that humans? built that could only be seen from the air. There are also structures, like on Easter Island, that no one knows how they got there.
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #9,073
  • Sep 11, 2017 11:19am Sep 11, 2017 11:19am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Long story short. There are structures that humans? built that could only be seen from the air. There are also structures, like on Easter Island, that no one knows how they got there.
How are there pyramids built by the Aztecs and also built by the Egyptians? Surely they weren't travelling across the world during that time and talking to each other. How are those great feats of engineering possible without today's modern equipment? Not once, but twice? Outside help? Are we being watched? Have we had visitors?
  • #9,074
  • Sep 11, 2017 2:06pm Sep 11, 2017 2:06pm
Quoting jen101
{quote} How are there pyramids built by the Aztecs and also built by the Egyptians? Surely they weren't travelling across the world during that time and talking to each other. How are those great feats of engineering possible without today's modern equipment? Not once, but twice? Outside help? Are we being watched? Have we had visitors?
Visitors? ...probably, how else could we have come up with the idea of beer.

Last year, IIRC, some intrepid idiots proved that it is possible to build a boat and cross the Altlantic to South America.

No great feat, you might think, except that the boat was made from Papyrus reeds in the Egyptian style.
Carbon-Dioxide: the gas of life! https://youtu.be/ttJBdr6eBuo
  • #9,075
  • Edited Sep 12, 2017 4:30am Sep 11, 2017 8:32pm | Edited Sep 12, 2017 4:30am
Quoting Mingary
{quote} Just curious .. How does it work ?
It seems the thread has taken on a spiritual theme so in words greater than mine (quoting from memory) "for dust you are and dust you shall become" History's first mention of recycling? I suspect so. How does this help trading? fills in the time while I figure if the FTSE gap down is a leading indication of GJ move down, and if so what shall I do about it?.
EDIT:
This is what I saw it was a aberration of the truth the price was not where it was indicated at all I dont know what happened, it was not untill I talked to some one and looked on another platform I saw FTSE was miles up from where indicated and had been for hours, my reasoning was money cant be in two places at once if its gone from the FTSE has it gone to yen? I was suckered...
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  • #9,076
  • Sep 11, 2017 9:17pm Sep 11, 2017 9:17pm
Quoting jen101
{quote} How are there pyramids built by the Aztecs and also built by the Egyptians? Surely they weren't travelling across the world during that time and talking to each other. How are those great feats of engineering possible without today's modern equipment? Not once, but twice? Outside help? Are we being watched? Have we had visitors?
There are a lot of books by Graham Hancock that I read years ago about this topic. Evidence suggests that somewhere down the line we were given some starting techs. Then we were sent on our way.
If you are good at something, never do it for free--Joker
  • #9,077
  • Sep 12, 2017 12:08am Sep 12, 2017 12:08am
Its early here, and so I am posting this as an interesting read on the anniversary of "9-11". Lost two very good friends in the 9-11 attack, and each year gets a little easier to deal with in the grieving process. The feelings are not the same, as the perspective changes as we get older and the introspection of a greater meaning that laments with wisdom gives one new insights on what humanity is capable of. Everything changed for America after that day, so for me personally, I wonder about my friends and what their lives meant, and taken too soon I also contemplate what would have become of them had they survived. [sigh] Forgiveness is one of the hardest things to overcome in order not to impede our personal growth, not forgiving only hurts myself and only feeds more hate, something that needs reminders to break this endless cycle of negativity within ourselves, something I continue to remind myself and work on to improve.

Anyway, I found an interesting article as such days like this where I search for signs, or memories that gives clues to my own understanding of questions still persisting as confounding theories, and unanswerable constructs that still leave me in an endless contemplation, or a loop if you will with a dirge of grief as summers passing and heading into autumn induces such reflections of times gone. The squirrels gather their Acorns for preparation of winter, reminders to me that perhaps I should do the same by awakening such urgencies to recognize the cycles of the season is about living in the now. "We are here waiting, take care, and hope to see you some day my friends," are my thoughts when thinking of Brian and Matt, two people who were never found in the 9-11 recovery efforts, two beautiful human beings who might have changed the world!

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/09/11/the-fifth-year-anniversary-of-september-11th-attack-on-benghazi-libya/#more-138466
  • #9,078
  • Sep 12, 2017 12:23am Sep 12, 2017 12:23am
Quoting jmn5611
{quote} Exactly. This is where Abrahamic religions fail. They don't have any commonality. This is why Jews for Jesus is an oxymoron. Same thing with Muslims for Jesus. They have Abraham as the father of these religions but that is it. Both Judaism and Islam reject Jesus as the son of God. Muslims say he was a prophet of Allah and Judaism won't even give him that. Personally I like the Eastern religions much better. On the ancient Civs topic. Are you and Exodus up on the Megaliths around the world?


In an indirect way, I always half heartedly meditated on a metaphor such as the "Four Horsemen of the Apocalyptic" and the fourth one was missing being Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha, and .... who? This of course was many, many years ago when I entertained such contempts for organized religions. Now, not so much, I do more listening than talking these days as I have a appreciation for certain elements of them. They teach me new things about important aspects of Human history, their behaviors, and seek to identify what has changed, something that is an ongoing process. One thing that stood out to me the most, a rare moment of clarity that has only happened once in my life, in time when I was out for run, and I stopped to catch my breath to observe an Iraqi sculpture of conquering soldiers of the past, (a story unto itself) a complete different thought entered my mind in a single moment as I studied this sculpture and the story it was trying to tell; was the way to fully understanding is to find the common denominator that will unite us all is truly the answer we all seek, and only our own lust and individual ambitions impedes to attain this one understanding which continues to be elusive to this day. I still have trouble articulating this single moment in time I had experienced, so I continue to revisit it in an attempt to break this code!

I am to some degree, but I am still learning new aspects of this. I may be going to Easter island later this year or perhaps early next if weather permitting. I find the topic fascinating!
  • #9,079
  • Sep 12, 2017 12:23am Sep 12, 2017 12:23am
Quoting jen101
{quote} How are there pyramids built by the Aztecs and also built by the Egyptians? Surely they weren't travelling across the world during that time and talking to each other. How are those great feats of engineering possible without today's modern equipment? Not once, but twice? Outside help? Are we being watched? Have we had visitors?

Yes to all your questions!
  • #9,080
  • Sep 12, 2017 12:54am Sep 12, 2017 12:54am
https://youtu.be/n02hYGLPDbk

Lesson here is read the fine print before deciding to do business with a certain entity that provides financial services. I have a feeling this story is not going away anytime soon!
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