Why so hard? | Forex Factory

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Why so hard?

  • #1
  • First Post: Jun 10, 2006 10:40am Jun 10, 2006 10:40am
I thought I'd start something other than another broker conspiracy thread ;-)

I keep hearing from experienced traders that making money at forex and getting to be a good trader is very hard. What I don't know is why it is hard.

Is it a lot of information to learn? Difficult concepts? It just takes years of looking at charts before you get it? It's hard to control your emotions?

What was hard for you during that time you went from neophyte to successful trader?

What would you do differently looking back?

Squid
  • #2
  • Jun 10, 2006 11:11am Jun 10, 2006 11:11am
Quoting Squid
I thought I'd start something other than another broker conspiracy thread ;-)

I keep hearing from experienced traders that making money at forex and getting to be a good trader is very hard. What I don't know is why it is hard.

Is it a lot of information to learn? Difficult concepts? It just takes years of looking at charts before you get it? It's hard to control your emotions?

What was hard for you during that time you went from neophyte to successful trader?

What would you do differently looking back?

Squid
One thing for me - psychology.

Once I had it down, everything just fell into place.. Well, they don't always fall on the right place so I still need to fix them..

As for changing anything? Nothing.. The past is past and every step or mistake I made in the process contributes to what I am today.
Not just in trading but myself as a whole.

I still have a lot to learn and I've accepted that.

So basically, if you're not having a problem, then don't look for one.

(Okay, these things just went out of my head.. hehe.. so read it at your own risk.. )
  • #3
  • Jun 10, 2006 11:30am Jun 10, 2006 11:30am
it's hard as a beginner because, this game is zero sum game and there are a lot of much more experienced, knoledgeable and (timely) informed people on financial markets.
Also the lack of knowledge, experience and as a result low self-confidence makes it hard to keep emotions under control and emotion is the biggest enemy of any trader.
  • #4
  • Edited 2:10pm Jun 10, 2006 11:44am | Edited 2:10pm
for myself, the recipie for getting on the road to success in this adventure has/is;

patience,
mentorship,
study,
practice,
patience,
and more of each...
again, and again.

Also, and this has proven a big one for me and my personality at this early stage (just into my 2nd year), the need to NOT MAKE and real monies in FX as i have sufficient income to support my chosen lifestyle and i can take time to listen to my mentors, do what they recommend, and not be stressed out about making money at this and practice in demo and in a micro-lot account.

: ) Thom

...PS this is a post script thought...one thing that has helped me develop a greater sense of dicipline and patience is practicing the ancient form of QiGong or "Energy Excersise". Basicaly in the advanced forms, the idividual is standing completely motionless is one of several positions for 30 minutes or more each...a perfect match to my enjoyment of 30m candles during the NY morning session : ) more on this by reading a great book called The Way of Energy.
  • #5
  • Jun 10, 2006 11:48am Jun 10, 2006 11:48am
its because of the competition. some of the brightest, boldest, slickest (and richest!) people in the world are in the trading game. so that is your competition!
Relax and be happy.
  • #6
  • Jun 10, 2006 1:43pm Jun 10, 2006 1:43pm
Psychology is my stumbling block right now. When I control myself and stick to my goal for the day I do well... when I try to earn too much I always end up back tracking! But it is so hard to know when to quit. This is why I finally started trading for real but with only a $500 mini account. It allows me to experience the fear, greed, and joy of trading real money albeit on a scale small enough that I don't hurt my lifestyle. I found it immensely different to trade with real dollars... I also found myself less successful at it due to greed and fear. Much more practice is in order for me before I start the $5k real account.
  • #7
  • Jun 10, 2006 5:32pm Jun 10, 2006 5:32pm
Quoting eastmaels
One thing for me - psychology.
Indeed. The tech analysis part of trading is the easy part. The whole psycology part (patience, discipline, emotions, etc) is where the real deal is.
  • #8
  • Jun 10, 2006 6:15pm Jun 10, 2006 6:15pm
Quoting WTB
Indeed. The tech analysis part of trading is the easy part. The whole psycology part (patience, discipline, emotions, etc) is where the real deal is.
I used to not believe that. What is so hard about following a simple plan that work? When it comes to real money, it's hard for me to say oh well that was just $100 loss even tho I know the system will yield more wins than losses.
  • #9
  • Jun 10, 2006 8:55pm Jun 10, 2006 8:55pm
I think it's hard not just because you want to be right, but because you think you can outguess everyone else.

I think instant gratification is also a problem -- it should rank right up there with the seven deadly sins...

Overleveraging is something that's a big hurdle for me. I've lost a lot of money in the past being, what I call, "n00b stoopid".
Mr. Trend
  • #10
  • Jun 11, 2006 1:10pm Jun 11, 2006 1:10pm
Trading is a very graphic, very immediate and extremely unforgiving personal development course. What ever subconscious drivers are that are governing your life, these are what you need to get in order before you are empowered to trade. So it's not that trading is particularly difficult, as some popular common beliefs lead people to think. In any class at school, taught by the same teacher using the same material, some will succeed and some will not. For those who are not succeeding, the answer is often perceived to be outside - in more learning, working harder, finding a mentor, etc. - all of which are really effective and seemingly justifiable and sensible reasons to not face what is the real root of the challenge. You. You can have the best race car in the world, the best team around you, the best training and the best knowledge, but your head, your belief systems and your subconscious will sabotage you every time until you learn what you individually need to learn to break through and let in the good stuff.
The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #11
  • Jun 11, 2006 3:54pm Jun 11, 2006 3:54pm
Why so hard??? I think everyone here has nailed it - your psych. There are lots of profitable "systems" but not all of them will work for YOU. Why? they're not comfortable for you, or you don't believe it. Sometimes, the hardest thing to do is, "believe what you see." I have a friend who knocks out a minimum of 50 pips per day and his method is so simple it's ridiculous. The other issue is, following your rules. If you have a system that works, but nothing that day fits your paramaters, you take a trade anyway - again, your psych.


My advice, practice, practice, practice. You will overcome it, but it takes time, patience, and practice.

Good luck!
  • #12
  • Jun 11, 2006 5:38pm Jun 11, 2006 5:38pm
Any person can be a trader....Trading is the easiest thing in the world.

Its how you conduct yourself as a trader that matters....and is undoubetly the hardest thing about trading.
  • #13
  • Jun 11, 2006 7:00pm Jun 11, 2006 7:00pm
Quoting Navynfo1
Why so hard??? I think everyone here has nailed it - your psych. There are lots of profitable "systems" but not all of them will work for YOU. Why? they're not comfortable for you, or you don't believe it. Sometimes, the hardest thing to do is, "believe what you see." I have a friend who knocks out a minimum of 50 pips per day and his method is so simple it's ridiculous. The other issue is, following your rules. If you have a system that works, but nothing that day fits your paramaters, you take a trade anyway - again, your psych.
I hear this a lot from traders, and while it is generally true, and I really appreciate that these are words of encouragement, there are underlying factors that scupper the bravest efforts, and no simple words of advice or books can change the subconscious programming that causes the problems. 'Practice, practice, practice' can mean 'fail, fail, fail' if you are caught in a dysfunctional cycle; and you won't get anywhere.

I believe in having the simplest possible system, but spending most effort in dealing with the mind. Then, there is no reason why you can't be successful quickly.
The framework is there; we just have to work on our frame of mind.
  • #14
  • Jun 11, 2006 7:11pm Jun 11, 2006 7:11pm
I think the hardest part is to find a reliable and profitable system.

Once you've find it and trust it, you'll find it easy to follow.

All the psychology / emotional is only when you don't trust your system and think you could do things smarter...


Good luck and many pips,

Simon

  • #15
  • Jun 11, 2006 7:21pm Jun 11, 2006 7:21pm
I'd like to thank everyone who took the time to answer my question. Very interesting answers from all of you. It seems the majority feel that emotions/psychology is the difficult part in becoming a good trader. Yet the answer that scared me the most was Merlin's about the competition.

I know that I can learn to control my emotions - when that happens is a function of how hard I work at it. I can't control the competition.

Squid
  • #16
  • Sep 30, 2012 1:35pm Sep 30, 2012 1:35pm
Recently I 've found a russian book about forex trading from 2001. In it author explains why is so hard to make money. For example everybody could develop system, which is giving up to 60 percent chance to get right entering trade. But there is another side of the coin: exit from trade. Here you also have to develop strategy. Lets say you are lucky and also find the way to get out with small profit.
So your system ( enter + exit ) can be profitable only 36 times out of 100, because 0,6*0,6... And here if you want to get profit ( or break even) you have to use big risk rewards, not less than 1:3... So why about 75 percent leave money on the table.
  • #17
  • Oct 1, 2012 9:48am Oct 1, 2012 9:48am
Quoting vaidas7777
. But there is another side of the coin: exit from trade. Here you also have to develop strategy. .
that depends on your importunity and your will to exit and close your trade. we must have strong strategy & observation.
  • #18
  • Oct 1, 2012 10:11am Oct 1, 2012 10:11am
wow this thread started in 2005,

good initial question,

7 years on, are there any of those original posters still in this fx ?.be interesting if any are still around to comment on ther progress.

although i believe that the majority would having given up by now,

im sure theres very few who last the test of time in this game

maybe it monday blues,

i hate mondays !
  • #19
  • Oct 1, 2012 10:54am Oct 1, 2012 10:54am
A successful trader does not require full time or part time trading. Let money trade for you without monitor the charts.

Dare to dream !
Dare to buy !
Dare to build a group of traders/frenz !
Dare to hire ppl to trade for you !

But requires
Precision plan.
Emotional system.
Logical trade.
Flexible game.
Good technique.
Good analysis.
Right money management.
Sufficient knowledge

Don't believe,
Technical analysis - is suck.
Rumour - Cheating

Believe,
YOURSELF !
  • #20
  • Oct 3, 2012 10:10am Oct 3, 2012 10:10am
Quoting ~bull.bear~
A successful trader does not require full time or part time trading. Let money trade for you without monitor the charts.

Dare to dream !
Dare to buy !
Dare to build a group of traders/frenz !
Dare to hire ppl to trade for you !

But requires
Precision plan.
Emotional system.
Logical trade.
Flexible game.
Good technique.
Good analysis.
Right money management.
Sufficient knowledge

Don't believe,
Technical analysis - is suck.
Rumour - Cheating

Believe,
YOURSELF !

Actually its an interesting thought, and as I'm new to Forex, I dare to dream to make some profit, and in order to be more confident in trading, I really do believe analysis is necessary. So why do you think technical analysis is suck and maybe its worth to believe both in analysis and yourself?
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