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Attachments: The Trader's Academy - by Traders for Traders
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The Trader's Academy - by Traders for Traders

Quoting darko2010
{quote} After reading this, I am not sure whether I am a procrastinator or just plain lazy...
If you're anything like me, then most likely both!
Whilst I'm here, I thought I'd re-emphasize something I've talked about before which is extremely important.

There should never be a 'do I or don't I ' decision to make when entering a trade, because such a trade is more likely to be a losing one than a winning one. If anyone of us has not arrived at the stage in our trading proficiency when we do not have clear, identifiable signals to enter ( and exit ) trades, then we should not be trading live. I cannot say for sure because I do not know, but I would say that the majority of losing trades and traders do not have a tried and tested system in place which gives them clear instructions when and when not to get into a trade. Wishful thinking is nearly always punished mercilessly by the markets unless you just get lucky.

We can never be sure of the outcome of any trade we take, but we can be sure of whether we take the trade or not, and if we aren't, we should never take the trade. Of course not all trades will set up beautifully and sit there begging to be taken, some will, whilst others require slightly more of a leap of faith, but even those have to have a pretty strong signal at a pre-determined level that we have already ascertained.

This business of trading should never ever be under-estimated. It is one of the most difficult skills in the world to master, make no mistake about it, and anything less than 100% professionalism will be punished by the markets, every time.
It is the single biggest cause of trader failure...believing that somehow this doesn't apply to trading.
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A few thoughts as I sit here on a rainy Saturday morning doing my week's review.

I've written so much on this thread, and think I've covered pretty much everything I would wish to impart to others with less experience than I have, which is now eleven years since I first looked at a financial chart.

I've always maintained that trading is an incredibly difficult skill to master on so many levels, but we all know that. We look at historical charts and we see the patterns repeat themselves over and over and it looks easy, but when we come to trade a live market where nothing is visible except the historical price and the now, this is far from the case. This is why we have to have something we have identified, something we can map the price movement against, which will create an order where actually there is none. We have to have a way of simplifying that which we have no control over which can move in any direction at any time seemingly at random. We have to be able to make a calculated decision over something which is incalculable, and do it with sufficient precision so as to profit from it again and again. This, is a very tall order, even an impossible one if one has not first acquired sufficient knowledge of the art, because trading is an art and to be good at it, one must become an artist.

I do not consider myself a genius, far from it, but I love the Einstein quote about turning complexity into simplicity, because especially with regard to trading, it is so true, one must have a system in place ( and I've spoken a lot here and elsewhere about systems - they are not something that can be purchased or borrowed to make money, they are the aggregate of knowledge we must have to stand any chance whatsoever of becoming consistently profitable ) which creates order out of the chaos and which gives us clearly identifiable trading opportunities when we can see nothing more than the historical price. We must be like the night time pilot who has to rely solely on his or her instruments to know where they are and what to do. Trading without these clearly identifiable signals and a system built from trial and error is like the pilot flying in the dark with no instrument panel and no clue where the aeroplane is in relation to anything else. It will always end in disaster.
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Market is not random but unpredictable
Quoting 4for4
{image}
That is true, but it is not the key. Before you have emotional discipline, you have to know what you are doing. Screen time, comes first, then, when you can actually read a chart and have learnt to a greater or lesser degree how to anticipate price movement, you can take care of the emotional/psychological side of trading, which is important, but far too much importance is given to it, as if it's the only thing we need to master. So, being as most of us are, which is possessing a pretty high opinion or ourselves, we come into trading having read, and believing that as we ourselves will have no issue with the psychological stuff, trading is going to be a piece of cake. We look at the historical charts and think ' no problem, I'll have this mastered inside six months...I really don't see what the fuss is all about ' .

The belief that trading is 90% psychological and 10% technical, as I've so often read, is the biggest misconception in trading. Spend time, a lot of time, learning how to trade, and when you have proved to yourself on demo and micro account that you can consistently make money, the psychology will take care of itself, or, at the very least, the emotional side of trading well be far less of a challenge. It is my belief that the majority of losing traders are simply trying to run before they can walk.
Quoting cat
{quote} That is true, but it is not the key. Before you have emotional discipline, you have to know what you are doing. Screen time, comes first, then, when you can actually read a chart and have learnt to a greater or lesser degree how to anticipate price movement, you can take care of the emotional/psychological side of trading, which is important, but far too much importance is given to it, as if it's the only thing we need to master. So, being as most of us are, which is possessing a pretty high opinion or ourselves, we come into trading having...
i see it same way.

only demo account i would never ever use without for programming error testing or learning the trading station, for rest its useless and most stupid way. very very small cent real account (or your mentioned micro account) is a much much much better way in any kind, so noone learns stupid strategies and lose so much time. time is the biggest value.
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Market is not random but unpredictable
Quoting dukas_trader
{quote} i see it same way. only demo account i would never ever use without for programming error testing or learning the trading station, for rest its useless and most stupid way. very very small cent real account (or your mentioned micro account) is a much much much better way in any kind, so noone learns stupid strategies and lose so much time. time is the biggest value.
Demo of course has its limitations, but it is the only way to learn through trial and error without costing you money. If you can be disciplined trading demo, you will be able to transfer this discipline to a live account. If you cannot, then demo is a waste of time, and being disciplined doesn't mean building a 1000% profit by taking unrealistic trades with enormous stop losses, being disciplined is taking only those trades and those exits which conform to the system you are building.
I thought I would share some thoughts on the dax.
On the hourly charts - make diagonal lines of the highs, copy the lines and see how prices reacts to it.
Make diagonal lines of the lows, copy those and see how price reacts in the future.
Dax reacts to these lines and therefore gives good opportunities for entry and exit.
Your charts will have a lot of lines running diagonal in both directions- I can put up a chart if there is much interest.
Trade the 1 hour charts for support and resistance- 3 mins charts to see buyers or sellers entering the market at these lines.

Have an understanding of trending, complex corrections and ranging markets and risk reward. ABCD patterns strength reasons for entering and exiting position
Quoting cat
{quote} Demo of course has its limitations, but it is the only way to learn through trial and error without costing you money. If you can be disciplined trading demo, you will be able to transfer this discipline to a live account. If you cannot, then demo is a waste of time, and being disciplined doesn't mean building a 1000% profit by taking unrealistic trades with enormous stop losses, being disciplined is taking only those trades and those exits which conform to the system you are building.
yes, but you lose so much time by demotrading.
you lose time by:
- trading without slippage
- trading unreal spike moves
- trading unreal platform, thats there to promote the broker and show all in best cases to let you win
- and and and

as a beginner many invest time in startegies that cant work in real accounts, but they cant see it because of using only demoaccounts. with no problem a demoaccount can have many tousand percent win each month with very low drawdowns because of unreal trading ....
using real account with very very samm money is the only way to know you can trade later a strategy or not, most demo account traded strategies are complete llost time or the results worthless or not to trust.
Quoting dukas_trader
{quote} yes, but you lose so much time by demotrading. you lose time by: - trading without slippage - trading unreal spike moves - trading unreal platform, thats there to promote the broker and show all in best cases to let you win - and and and as a beginner many invest time in startegies that cant work in real accounts, but they cant see it because of using only demoaccounts. with no problem a demoaccount can have many tousand percent win each month with very low drawdowns because of unreal trading .... using real account with very very samm money...
Sounds like you need to change your broker then, as I never encountered such problems. I started on demo, moved to micro accounts, and then full account. Do not make the mistake, as many on this forum do, of thinking and preaching as you are doing here, that what doesn't work for you, will also not work for others.
Quoting cat
{quote} Sounds like you need to change your broker then, as I never encountered such problems. I started on demo, moved to micro accounts, and then full account. Do not make the mistake, as many on this forum do, of thinking and preaching as you are doing here, that what doesn't work for you, will also not work for others.
did you read my post complete wrong (all was about demotrading, this your realized ,or??)? i have encountered problems in demotrading, when i mentioned this? why i have to change my broker because of having extrem wins with demotrading, when any broker has same problems ???
this problems with no slippage, many thousand percents winb in demoaccount with very small drawdown with many strategies, (of course will never work in real account), .... you will have in demoaccount, because there is no real trading in the market and for marketing effect to let you open a account with this broker later, so all need to present in best possible way so you have most easy way to win against real account conditions).
thatswhy i say demotrading is useless, ok some very unexperienced dont know it better, but its one of the worst mistakes possible to do for a beginner, and noone with experience would tell other to use a demo account for any strategy testing, thats pure crazy, only when you dont like the other person or want them lose time for nothiing maybe demotrading is possible to mention, rest is mini mini account the way you have to go and never ever telling about demotrading, that is there for marketing broker and showing all in best case what never happen in real trading.

only just to help you with this big mistake! belive me, here you are 100% total wrong, there is not one advantage with demotrading and testing strategies against using very very small cent accounts (without the mentioned testing of programming errors or learning the trading station)!

there is no "that what doesn't work for you, will also not work for others.", demo trading is simple a stupid way to lose time. believe it or not, when you trade some years you will see it automatic and change your mind very fast, when you trade decades you will laugh about what you think about demotrading at the moment, or when you start working in brokers you see it in days. any other way, you lose simple much time, if your have much time to lose, all is fine, but normally time is most expensive value on earth, you can spend any second only one time.

so your step demo account ,moved to micro accounts, and then full account is fine, as long you only used demo account for learning tarding station or programming error testing or programm testing in general. rest is lost time, what doesnt mean you have taken some goals or what ever, only not in best possible way done.

believe it or not. demotrading and hedging ( and so on......) are examples of 2 extrem easy beginner topics where there is only one best correct way ( and never ever a "Do not make the mistake, as many on this forum do, of thinking and preaching as you are doing here, that what doesn't work for you, will also not work for others." (this dont work for such super easy topics with a easy to see correct and not correct way), rest is a possible way, but you have to pay for this with time or money.

more i dont have to say to this extrem easy topic.
Treat trading like fishing (for a particular type of fish) with a rod ...

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Market is not random but unpredictable
Does anyone out there know why a trader who calls himself ' Calculus ' has disappeared from ff. He hasn't logged in since June, and for someone who logged in every day, a few people myself included are a little concerned. Thanks.
Hi Cat,

I read some of your posts with great interest, I agree completely that putting serious effort into learning this craft can cause friction with friends & family. I think its important to be honest with them by telling them that this project will be of HIGH priority in your life for the next few years. Also that it's not about making millions, your far more interested in learning. The problem however is that learning will take much effort with lots of trial & error. Time that could be spent with others. Instead you are stuck on a PC, cursing & mumbling to yourself, nearly in tears LOL! The last thing you wanna do at this stage is lose money you can't afford...that will cause even more problems & rightly so because you are now being selfish. It also indicates that you are in fact more interested in making easy money (gambling) than you are at patiently learning the craft with small amounts. Be serious about. Think of it as starting a new long distance Masters degree or PhD. Once you qualify then it becomes a startup business.

Quoting cat
Does anyone out there know why a trader who calls himself ' Calculus ' has disappeared from ff. He hasn't logged in since June, and for someone who logged in every day, a few people myself included are a little concerned. Thanks.
No idea about this person, I hope you find some news.

Good luck.
who dares wins
Quoting cat
Does anyone out there know why a trader who calls himself ' Calculus ' has disappeared from ff. He hasn't logged in since June, and for someone who logged in every day, a few people myself included are a little concerned. Thanks.
been following his daily shouts and yes, i think he is gone from FF. such a waste.
Quoting CrocodileRex
{quote} been following his daily shouts and yes, i think he is gone from FF. such a waste.
Hopefully just gone from ff, and not gone in the broader sense.
Quoting MasterJedi
Hi Cat, I read some of your posts with great interest, I agree completely that putting serious effort into learning this craft can cause friction with friends & family. I think its important to be honest with them by telling them that this project will be of HIGH priority in your life for the next few years.
It normally takes a year or two before you even get to this stage, as most coming into trading believe they'll be earning good money inside a year, and to outsiders who know nothing of the skills required to trade successfully, even this is too long to be sitting in front of a screen week in week out with nothing to show for it. No one minds an apprenticeship with secure job prospects at the end of it, but when you are seen as chasing a dream as it were, there is little support and little sympathy when things go wrong. This is why the path to trading success can be, and actually has to be, a very lonely one, and few, for a variety of reasons, can stay the course.
Quoting cat
Does anyone out there know why a trader who calls himself ' Calculus ' has disappeared from ff. He hasn't logged in since June, and for someone who logged in every day, a few people myself included are a little concerned. Thanks.

I've been wondering what happened to Calculus too. He posted his thoughts in his shoutbox every day for years. And now it seems he's disappeared. Nothing new in his shoutbox since May, and he hasn't logged on since July. He and I exchanged some enlightening (for me) Pm's. I always enjoyed visiting with him. I'm concerned about his health. When such a prolific poster suddenly stops posting and doesn't even log in.... that worries me.
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