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Oanda vs. MBT FREE EXN

  • Post #1
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  • First Post: Feb 11, 2012 6:44pm Feb 11, 2012 6:44pm
So my research into brokers took a few twists and turns. Originally I was looking at Dukascopy versus FXCM, but after some bad personal experiences, I started looking wider. My initial thoughts on Oanda were not positive, but I've had a better experience setting up there. Same with MBT, I originally heard about tech issues. I always test support for a broker before I even open a live account (not a fan of demos) and put in some small money to see how it goes. Support from both was great, they gave me great answers to my questions. MB now has an extensive YouTube catalog of webinar tutorials that show their platforms in detail. At this point, I am running a daily comparison Oanda vs. MBT FREE EXN plan. The experience has been interesting to say the least. Before I put more money into either one, does anyone have any comments about either broker. Have you experienced worse executions as you add money and your account gets bigger? Any other issues? Oanda supposedly (according to the report they file) has slight higher profitable traders, but this FREE EXN plan has amazingly tighter spreads and my executions have been solid, so I wonder how the profitability comparison goes if it were just this plan versus Oanda. Anyway, looking for any comments between the two. I'm not interested in all of these obscure, unknown brokers, I definitely wanted one of the big ten or so and someone regulated with a solid reputation.
Oanda is better. I heard MBT has technology issues and they like their clients losing money as they are a market maker, pure and simple.

LMAX is the only regulated FX exchange in the world. Anybody using EXN, EXC and other abbreviations of a word EXCHANGE are simply playing on the stupidity of people. Be careful.
  • Post #3
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  • Edited 4:33am Feb 12, 2012 4:13am | Edited 4:33am
Quoting nuclearoptio
Oanda is better. I heard MBT has technology issues and they like their clients losing money as they are a market maker, pure and simple.
I disagree. Oanda is a market maker and widens spreads to increase their own profitability against their clients. This is not something "I have heard," it is fact I have proven myself. They claim it is to reflect the market conditions but I have seen their spreads randomly blow out on a regular basis, when no such widening is occuring on MBT's ecn. They used to have a 0.9 pip fixed spread and that was why I went with them. Your lucky to get the spread under 1.3 these days. They have the most profitability and that comes from scalpers taking only a few pips. They are closing that gap with the wider spread now.
Below is a real time comparison of Oanda and MBT spread taken simultaneously. The Oanda spread was 10x that of MBT at the time. Oanda suck!


Attached Images
With Oanda you know what you get. And their execution is one of the best around.

MBT looks sexy initially. It's like a girl in a bar. She looks like 18, great tits, tight ass, dressed like a chairleader or your first girlfriend when she was still a virgin. You approach her and after a few drinks she invites you over and you feel that this is your night and you gonna play with her all night. So you are both lying in bed already and then you realize. This is not the most beautiful girl in the world. She is not a girl. She is a fu-king man from some crazy Asian country. And when you hold 'her' dick in you hand then you know that you have been fooled and you are an idiot.

Your friends will laugh at it and forgive you if it happens to you once. But if you start enjoying this and spend your every night at the same bar and look for the same kind of 'girls' then after a while you realize that there are no longer any normal people around you.
Quoting fxreporter
So my research into brokers took a few twists and turns. Originally I was looking at Dukascopy versus FXCM, but after some bad personal experiences, I started looking wider. My initial thoughts on Oanda were not positive, but I've had a better experience setting up there. Same with MBT, I originally heard about tech issues. I always test support for a broker before I even open a live account (not a fan of demos) and put in some small money to see how it goes. Support from both was great, they gave me great answers to my questions. MB now has an...
MBT for sure. Nuclearoptio has no idea what he's talking about (despite his foul mouth). Everyone knows Oanda is a market maker, which is fine if that's what you want, but MBT certainly is not. Fast executions. FREE EXN spreads crush Oanda. Oanda can be fine, but just remember that at the end of the day, when they want to take your money, they can.
Quoting fxstevyboy
MBT for sure. Nuclearoptio has no idea what he's talking about (despite his foul mouth). Everyone knows Oanda is a market maker, which is fine if that's what you want, but MBT certainly is not. Fast executions. FREE EXN spreads crush Oanda. Oanda can be fine, but just remember that at the end of the day, when they want to take your money, they can.
I am not saying that Oanda kicks ass. I am just saying that when compared to MBT then Oanda rocks.
Quoting fxstevyboy
MBT for sure. Nuclearoptio has no idea what he's talking about (despite his foul mouth). Everyone knows Oanda is a market maker, which is fine if that's what you want, but MBT certainly is not. Fast executions. FREE EXN spreads crush Oanda. Oanda can be fine, but just remember that at the end of the day, when they want to take your money, they can.
What a truckload of big BS.
Quoting M.A.C.Doug
I disagree. Oanda is a market maker and widens spreads to increase their own profitability against their clients. This is not something "I have heard," it is fact I have proven myself. They claim it is to reflect the market conditions but I have seen their spreads randomly blow out on a regular basis, when no such widening is occuring on MBT's ecn. They used to have a 0.9 pip fixed spread and that was why I went with them. Your lucky to get the spread under 1.3 these days. They have the most profitability and that comes from scalpers taking...
That pic of yours tells a lot .... not.
Quoting A_3
What a truckload of big BS.
And what makes it a truckload of BS? I guess you prefer Oanda? I ran 20 trades last night on MBT free plan. I had price improvement on a couple of fills and never more than 0.2 pips slippage on a couple of trades. The spreads are as shown on their website and your Limit orders cut into the quotes. What is it about Oanda that you think is better if that's your point?
Quoting fxreporter
So my research into brokers took a few twists and turns. Originally I was looking at Dukascopy versus FXCM, but after some bad personal experiences, I started looking wider. My initial thoughts on Oanda were not positive, but I've had a better experience setting up there. Same with MBT, I originally heard about tech issues. I always test support for a broker before I even open a live account (not a fan of demos) and put in some small money to see how it goes. Support from both was great, they gave me great answers to my questions. MB now has an...

So nobody has any bad experiences with either broker later in your relationship with them?
Quoting fxreporter
So nobody has any bad experiences with either broker later in your relationship with them?
You probably won't have a bad experience with either one in terms of funding or withdrawing. In terms of spreads and executions right now, MB is better on that FREE EXN plan.
FXChant Singing the World of Forex
Quoting fxchant
You probably won't have a bad experience with either one in terms of funding or withdrawing. In terms of spreads and executions right now, MB is better on that FREE EXN plan.
Yes, right 'now'.... but they weren't always as aggressive with their spreads on the Free EXN account.

Makes me wonder what plans they have in store for their Pay for Limits account since the Free EXN is really punishing P4L clients within their own user base...


That or maybe they are trying to overcome the negative sentiment on the company after having so many technology issues lately.. so they are buying customers with the thinner spreads.


But hey... take advantage while it lasts... I know I sure miss 0.9 spreads on EUR/USD at Oanda back when that was thought to be normal.
FXGears.com
Quoting Jack_Larkin
Yes, right 'now'.... but they weren't always as aggressive with their spreads on the Free EXN account.

But hey... take advantage while it lasts... I know I sure miss 0.9 spreads on EUR/USD at Oanda back when that was thought to be normal.
I'm definitely taking advantage of the spreads with MB Trading's free exn account, and why not, right? All the brokers have their tech issues, so I look at other aspects of how they deal with issues when they arise and what types of other tools do they use to give traders what we want. There's no right or wrong broker -- you just need to find one you're comfortable with and in my case, after reviewing both Oanda and MBT, I went with MBT.
Quoting M.A.C.Doug
I disagree. Oanda is a market maker and widens spreads to increase their own profitability against their clients. This is not something "I have heard," it is fact I have proven myself. They claim it is to reflect the market conditions but I have seen their spreads randomly blow out on a regular basis, when no such widening is occuring on MBT's ecn. They used to have a 0.9 pip fixed spread and that was why I went with them. Your lucky to get the spread under 1.3 these days. They have the most profitability and that comes from scalpers taking only...
Calling BS on this post. Don't listen to a word fxreporter, it is very misleading. I can cherry pick all the screenshots I want too Doug.

Fact is that OANDA's spread is almost always 1.2 in liquid times. They do not 'randomly blow out on a regular basis' as Doug suggests. High impact news times they will usually blow out (not always though) and it will be more than most brokers but if you do not trade news this will not really be an issue. When things get fast and illiquid then spreads will widen to 1.4, 1.6 and very rarely more, but this is the same for all brokers. fxtrade is a reliable platform that very rarely goes down especially of late. Don't be fooled by the demo platform which goes down a lot more than the live. Slippage is almost non-existant. I can count on 1 hand the number of times I have been slipped in the many years I have traded with them and most have been positive slips. They have longer hours than all other brokers and you can open and close trades on the weekend for a 10pip spread but handy if you want to leave the computer on friday and let a position run into the weekend (you will only pay 4.4pips extra for this privilege (1/2*10 - 0.6)). They are a reliable and honest broker with no dealing desk (they do not trade against their clients). On the negative side it costs me $20 to withdraw which I think is pretty steep. Deposits are a pain in the arse too for non USD but it is better than it used to be. Live chat and phone help is absolutely useless for anything but your most basic of problems, you need to email frontdesk for any real issues.

I don't trade with MB so I can't say much about them. They have a good reputation and seem to be honest. The spreads on the free EXN platform look very good considering no commission (the best I have ever seen anywhere for no commission broker) but I agree with Jack in that I don't think this will last. It is probably a marketing ploy to get a big client base and then they will raise their markup to more realistic levels. But you can tackle that problem when/if it comes. They state they only have MT4 at the moment which is a deal breaker for me but if you like MT4 then that is not an issue. Slippage will generally be higher with these commercial ECN brokers (OANDA guarantees 10mill at quoted price) but may not be a problem if you don't trade large size.

All in all it seems to be a really close call. Maybe open an account with both and see who you like better.

Good luck
Quoting nuclearoptio
MBT looks sexy initially. It's like a girl in a bar. She looks like 18, great tits, tight ass, dressed like a chairleader or your first girlfriend when she was still a virgin. You approach her and after a few drinks she invites you over and you feel that this is your night and you gonna play with her all night. So you are both lying in bed already and then you realize. This is not the most beautiful girl in the world. She is not a girl. She is a fu-king man from some crazy Asian country. And when you hold 'her' dick in you hand then you know that...
Your comparison with brokers operation are absolutely awesome.

cheers
Quoting Agro
Calling BS on this post. Don't listen to a word fxreporter, it is very misleading. I can cherry pick all the screenshots I want too Doug.

Fact is that OANDA's spread is almost always 1.2 in liquid times. They do not 'randomly blow out on a regular basis' as Doug suggests. High impact news times they will usually blow out (not always though) and it will be more than most brokers but if you do not trade news this will not really be an issue. When things get fast and illiquid then spreads will widen to 1.4, 1.6 and very rarely more, but this...
Agro-

Thanks for the comment, very thorough and matches what I'm experiencing. As I said in the original post here, I already have live accounts with both, I did several months of research on a lot of brokers and had a list of variables. In the end, it came down to these two. The problem is, even if you have a small live account with a broker, that doesn't always paint the picture. You hear about brokers where everything seems good until you get enough money with them and then suddenly...NEWS SPIKE...SORRY FOR THE 100 PIP SLIPPAGE. I had a buddy with a big account with FXCM have that problem. So I'm more looking for those stories. Yes, I agree that support at Oanda is awful, but hopefully, you don't need support much, right? As for MT4, I can take it or leave it. My understanding is that MBT is also working on this quote feed going into their other software as well. As you and several others point out, it remains to be seen if MBT can keep these spreads this tight, but I have to say, right now, with my smaller account size, test trading live on both, MBT has had faster executions and tighter spreads.
Quoting Agro
Calling BS on this post.
It is not bs and it is not misleading. Oanda do widen spreads at regular intervals. Sometimes for only a few seconds, sometimes longer, when no such spread widening is occuring on ecn feeds. I have personally witnessed this and been affected as I scalp with tight stops. They admit themselves that this is true. They claim it is representative of market conditions but I have proven to myself they are lying about this. Here is a link to Oandas own trading forum refering to the very same random spread widening that I have personally witnessed and continue to witness.

http://fxtrade.oanda.com/community/f...;f=16;t=012909

It wouldnt worry a longer term trader targeting 100 pips or more but can be devastating to scalpers with tighter stops targeting smaller gains. it is those traders that are the largest porportion of Oandas profitable traders according to their own stats.

Why would I lie here about this? what do I have to gain from it? I am profitable with Oanda even under these conditions and I love trading on platform above any other. Ill state my reputation on these statements being accurate knowing full well they are.

I go on to say that Oanda do this to increase their own profitability against their client base. I cant prove this, but given that there own excuse of "true market conditions" is false, it is an obvious conclusion. We all know market makers do this. I am convinced I have seen this practice in action when witnessing spread widening with Oanda that does not show up with other brokers.
Quoting M.A.C.Doug
It is not bs and it is not misleading. Oanda do widen spreads at regular intervals. Sometimes for only a few seconds, sometimes longer, when no such spread widening is occuring on ecn feeds. I have personally witnessed this and been affected as I scalp with tight stops. They admit themselves that this is true. They claim it is representative of market conditions but I have proven to myself they are lying about this. Here is a link to Oandas own trading forum refering to the very same random spread widening that I have personally witnessed and...
I stand by my statements as well. I too scalp with OANDA for small pips. 8+ hours a day 5 days a week so I am in front of the fxtrade platform a lot and always have an eye on the spreads. You say you are 'lucky to get under 1.3 pip spread', but 99% of the time in liquid markets they are at a steady 1.2 pip spread. You also said they 'randomly blow out spreads on a regular basis', but this is not true. Spreads will widen even when there is no news, but it is always when markets are fast and illiquid. I have CFH markets platform also (DMA model) and when oanda hit 1.4 or more then CFH spreads are almost always more volatile (not always wider but will jump between 0.1-2 instead of their usually pretty steady 0.4-0.8).

The link you posted was from last year. Last year saw some unusually low liquidity at times and we did get more spread blowouts, but that was across the board, not just at oanda (although oanda did get pretty bad at times with some spread spikes and price sweeps for no apparent reason and also some huge 50+ pip news spreads). I do think oanda seem to handle illiquid times worse than other brokers. Their news spreads are higher than most and don't come into line as quick and in illiquid/volatile periods they will also be higher than most and last longer. Last year there were many times that I was preferencing other brokers over oanda. But the vast majority of the time oanda is one of, if not the best. This year they have been really good and pre-2011 as well.

I didn't mean to imply you were outright lying, just that you were vastly exaggerating which made your post quite misleading.

Anyway, not much more to say on the matter, you have your opinion and I have mine so others can decide for themselves.
  • Post #19
  • Quote
  • Edited Feb 18, 2012 1:37pm Feb 17, 2012 2:11pm | Edited Feb 18, 2012 1:37pm
Here are some true facts regarding OANDA spreads besides the whole blah blah based on assumptions. Spread is taken from tick data not minute data. I repeat Ticks! Real Ticks. So it can happen that ticks can occur at the same time

Example
Time,Spread
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2
08:07:44,1.2

So in the example above there were 9 tick quotes where spread was 1.2 pips. But there was only one occurrence of 1.2 pips at 08:07:44. Same goes for any other spread from the table. Table and Chart provide time-independent tick occurrences.
Additional note ... no weekend spread was taken into account.
Time period of 2011 ... Jan 3rd - Dec 16th. Around 13 million ticks

EDIT: Data updated
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: Oanda spread 2011.jpg Size: 106 KB
  • Post #20
  • Quote
  • Edited Feb 18, 2012 1:38pm Feb 17, 2012 2:16pm | Edited Feb 18, 2012 1:38pm
Well it seems the table picture has been formatted by FXFactory. Here is an external link. Click on the picture to enlarge
http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/6428/spreadtable.png

63% of time the spread was lower or equal 1.2 pips

EDIT: Table updated
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