Are you in trouble as a trader? | Forex Factory

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Are you in trouble as a trader?

  • #1
  • First Post: Jan 3, 2017 3:02pm Jan 3, 2017 3:02pm
I have no idea whether I'll even get one single response on this thread, which will probably be a good thing, but I thought I'd throw it out there just in case there are any traders out there in financial difficulty because of trading. This is a serious topic, one which rarely gets discussed, but I know for a fact that there are traders out there, quite a lot of them, who have lost/are losing far more than they can afford. Desperation, even panic, can set in as one sees one's dreams, and money, disappear down the plug hole. Often there is no one to talk to, no one who understands or who can give advice, and sadly, the suicide rate is quite high among traders, a small percentage, but high compared to other professions, which is no surprise in a business where so few succeed.

No one understands a trader like a trader, which is why I thought I'd start this thread. All of us probably have stories about our trading journey that other traders can relate to, so, if you're struggling, need a bit of advice from like minded people, a bit of moral support, then this is the thread for you.

If you have got something you'd like to share or discuss, then please don't be shy, you'll be amazed how many of us here on ff will understand exactly where you're coming from.

If this thread helps just one single person, it'll be worth more than all the gold in the world. So I hand it over to you, anyone out there, who could use a bit of encouragement during troubled times.
  • #2
  • Jan 3, 2017 3:09pm Jan 3, 2017 3:09pm
traders, gamblers, all the same..just go here and get help...

http://www.gamblersanonymous.org/ga/...t/20-questions
(replacing gambling with trading)

ps.
every trader must answer at least 5 yes on the questionnaire, if not, you really don't know what trading is about..
  • #3
  • Jan 3, 2017 3:14pm Jan 3, 2017 3:14pm
Quoting cat
I have no idea whether I'll even get one single response on this thread, which will probably be a good thing, but I thought I'd throw it out there just in case there are any traders out there in financial difficulty because of trading. This is a serious topic, one which rarely gets discussed, but I know for a fact that there are traders out there, quite a lot of them, who have lost/are losing far more than they can afford. Desperation, even panic, can set in as one sees one's dreams, and money, disappear down the plug hole. Often there is no one...
Sadly for a few to win money, many have to lose theirs to RBs, HFTs, brokers and other traders alike.
Carpe Diem
  • #4
  • Edited 3:47pm Jan 3, 2017 3:31pm | Edited 3:47pm
Quoting hilmy83
traders, gamblers, all the same..just go here and get help... http://www.gamblersanonymous.org/ga/...t/20-questions (replacing gambling with trading) ps. every trader must answer at least 5 yes on the questionnaire, if not, you really don't know what trading is about..
Personally, I do not view trading as gambling, though I agree the results can be the same. Gambling is very much down to luck, though I have never gambled so cannot speak from experience. Traders do not lose money because they are gamblers, they lose money because they risk their money before they have learnt the necessary skills needed to profit consistently from the markets. It is that simple. With gambling, you will lose even if you know what you are going, or think you know what you are doing, because it is set up that way. With trading, you will lose if you throw yourself at the markets before you have the knowledge and experience required, and lose everything if you risk more than you can afford. So for me, that questionnaire is meaningless. Trading should never be about putting on a position and praying it will go your way - that is gambling I agree, Trading is putting on a position with certain tried and tested parameters that you know put the odds firmly in your favour.

All said and done however, I have huge sympathy for traders who have fallen on troubled times, because although I have never been exactly suicidal, I have been in the situation where I wasn't able to see the wood for the trees, and a bit of sensible, measured advice from a fellow trader would have been very welcome indeed. that's what this thread is about.

ps...as I have seen over the years I've been a member of ff, there are many failed traders who denounce trading as a game for gamblers and fools, and they do so in an attempt to justify their own failure. I pay no attention to these people because I know that they are wrong. Trading is difficult, but it is not impossible. Indeed, we are all here because we know this to be true, and those who don't, should simply be left to their own devices and ignored. Personally, I have zero time for the ' you'll all lose in the end ' guru, and neither should any of you.
  • #5
  • Jan 3, 2017 6:38pm Jan 3, 2017 6:38pm
Quoting cat
{quote} Personally, I do not view trading as gambling, though I agree the results can be the same. Gambling is very much down to luck, though I have never gambled so cannot speak from experience. Traders do not lose money because they are gamblers, they lose money because they risk their money before they have learnt the necessary skills needed to profit consistently from the markets. It is that simple. With gambling, you will lose even if you know what you are going, or think you know what you are doing, because it is set up that way. With trading,...
there are professional gamblers that make money and there are pro traders taht make money. likewise for losers. BUT, i don't want to get into a long drawn out argument why trading is not gambling discussion.

my personal opinion is, to hell with the traders that lost money or lost everything in the pursuit of profit. WHy do i need to show remorse?? these bastards would be as sadistic if the tables were turned. so my attitude is, trade like you want to fuck someobdy's life. it's not a fucking game of pick up basketball where i need to show showmanship to the losers. nor do i expect pity when i lose shit loads of money. this is a do or die game where the hard earned money is at risk.

so fuck em...seriously..FUCK EM!...

Attached Image
  • #6
  • Jan 3, 2017 7:27pm Jan 3, 2017 7:27pm
Quoting hilmy83
{quote} there are professional gamblers that make money and there are pro traders taht make money. likewise for losers. BUT, i don't want to get into a long drawn out argument why trading is not gambling discussion. my personal opinion is, to hell with the traders that lost money or lost everything in the pursuit of profit. WHy do i need to show remorse?? these bastards would be as sadistic if the tables were turned. so my attitude is, trade like you want to fuck someobdy's life. it's not a fucking game of pick up basketball where i need to show...
Calm down lil'baby Soros.
The coincidental success is more dangerous than the expected failure
  • #7
  • Jan 3, 2017 7:43pm Jan 3, 2017 7:43pm
Quoting Neqrotik
{quote} Calm down lil'baby Soros.
Inserted Video
  • #8
  • Jan 3, 2017 7:48pm Jan 3, 2017 7:48pm
Money can always be made again, and money is not that hard to make at all. Its all up to what you are prepared to do and go through in pursuit of it.
  • #10
  • Jan 4, 2017 1:33am Jan 4, 2017 1:33am
Quoting hilmy83
{quote} . BUT, i don't want to get into a long drawn out argument why trading is not gambling discussion.. so fuck em...seriously..FUCK EM!... {image}
Neither do I, and neither will I , that is entirely not the point of this thread. Thankfully, I have way more empathy for my fellow traders and by the sound of it for human beings in general than you obviously do, so let's leave it there.
  • #11
  • Jan 4, 2017 1:46am Jan 4, 2017 1:46am
Interesting to see that the moderator changed the title of this thread overnight from ' Are you in trouble '? to ...as a trader '. I guess he thought it might be confusing for some, as in ' are you in trouble with the wife '? or some other generality, which I guess would elicit some interesting replies!
  • #12
  • Jan 4, 2017 1:50am Jan 4, 2017 1:50am
Quoting cat
{quote} Neither do I, and neither will I , that is entirely not the point of this thread. Thankfully, I have way more empathy for my fellow traders and by the sound of it for human beings in general than you obviously do, so let's leave it there.
Awesome thread idea cat!

I know exactly what you speak of and totally support your efforts! This thread could help many people. And not just to to get sympathy, but also to directly confront the trauma that they have brought on themselves, and hopefully break free of that vicious cycle. It is vital if anyone wants to continue trading and be successful in the end.

All the more power to you and this thread.

Take care all!
-fighter-
  • #13
  • Jan 4, 2017 1:56am Jan 4, 2017 1:56am
Quoting fighterdude
{quote} Awesome thread idea cat! I know exactly what you speak of and totally support your efforts! This thread could help many people. And not just to to get sympathy, but also to directly confront the trauma that they have brought on themselves, and hopefully break free of that vicious cycle. It is vital if anyone wants to continue trading and be successful in the end. All the more power to you and this thread. Take care all! -fighter-
Thanks fighterdude! Hopefully we can coax a few people who may be going through hell at the moment, and I know there are some, to air their problems, because it is always best to talk when you find yourself backed into a corner with seemingly no way out. Many of us have been there, many of us are there, and many will be, so hopefully this thread can be of some service.
  • #14
  • Jan 4, 2017 2:31am Jan 4, 2017 2:31am
Quoting mrhigurashi
Money can always be made again, and money is not that hard to make at all. Its all up to what you are prepared to do and go through in pursuit of it.
Good point m8!
Risk comes from not knowing what you're doing.
  • #15
  • Jan 4, 2017 4:59am Jan 4, 2017 4:59am
Quoting CKSCswing
{quote} Sadly for a few to win money, many have to lose theirs to RBs, HFTs, brokers and other traders alike.
Which is the paradox with this thread I suppose, because although none of us want to see others losing badly in the markets, our success actually depends on their failure, and that will never change - there will always be more losers than winners. This thread therefore is not to try to turn losing traders into winning traders, even if that were possible, but to provide encouragement and perhaps guidance for those who are struggling, to whatever degree.
  • #16
  • Jan 4, 2017 5:07am Jan 4, 2017 5:07am
Brilliant thread! I feel most of us have been there at least once.
  • #17
  • Jan 4, 2017 5:28am Jan 4, 2017 5:28am
Quoting bparker
Brilliant thread! I feel most of us have been there at least once.
and it can be a long, hard road back, as many of us will know.
  • #18
  • Jan 4, 2017 5:42am Jan 4, 2017 5:42am
Quoting cat
{quote} Which is the paradox with this thread I suppose, because although none of us want to see others losing badly in the markets, our success actually depends on their failure, and that will never change - there will always be more losers than winners. This thread therefore is not to try to turn losing traders into winning traders, even if that were possible, but to provide encouragement and perhaps guidance for those who are struggling, to whatever degree.
Interesting point... however I've never seen it quite like that. Retail traders make up a very small percentage of FX market volume, so if someone is making good profit they don't necessarily have to be taking it from other retail traders(however I'm sure it does happen) as there are plenty of other market participants(banks, hedge funds, corps) to profit from.

From this perspective, it makes no difference to my bottom line if my fellow retail traders, are profiting along side me.

Just my 2 cents.

-fighter-
  • #19
  • Jan 4, 2017 7:24am Jan 4, 2017 7:24am
Quoting fighterdude
{quote} Interesting point... however I've never seen it quite like that. Retail traders make up a very small percentage of FX market volume, so if someone is making good profit they don't necessarily have to be taking it from other retail traders(however I'm sure it does happen) as there are plenty of other market participants(banks, hedge funds, corps) to profit from. From this perspective, it makes no difference to my bottom line if my fellow retail traders, are profiting along side me. Just my 2 cents. -fighter-
This is true...retail traders are a drop in the ocean when compared with the global banks and hedge funds who together are transacting billions on any given day, and this is a pot for the retail trader to dip into if he/she learns how.

The fact is though, if a trader is deep in the shit, losing money hand over fist, there is very little help out there, if any, for someone who essentially is gambling their ( family's ) money away. As traders, we understand what is happening, the addiction that can set in, the need to overtrade to get our money back, leverage too high, in short, make all the mistakes that traders routinely make, only when the pressure is on, when you are no longer in control, this can be fatal. Above I disagreed with a poster about trading being gambling, but in this regard, he was absolutely right, because when it gets to this stage, when the compulsion takes over, a person stops being a trader and becomes a gambler, and an out of control gambler at that. There is only ever one result from this.

Don't even try and talk to others about your trading problems unless they are traders themselves, because they will not even want to try to understand, they can't understand, only traders will be able to see the page you are on.

My fear with this thread is that although I know there are plenty of traders out there who are being taken through the mill currently, few will probably want to share their miseries and misfortunes on a public forum such as this one for a variety of reasons. All I can say here is that if you are one of these people, and you feel you need some form of help, then this is probably the best place you are going to find to get it, from people who know exactly the sorts of emotions, if not problems, you may be going through right now.

I think I've said all I want to say now, so will leave it for others to contribute if they want to, and I'll come back in if I see the need to respond. Please feel free to contribute.
  • #20
  • Jan 4, 2017 7:40am Jan 4, 2017 7:40am
Id just say, never invest any more then your willing to lose.
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